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| Topic: what do you believe? | |
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Okay I do feel for you. Whoever told you there is no hope for you because you are gay is full of it and doesn't believe their own religion. I believe that you being gay either by design or choice is no different then the people who are judgmental they struggle with a different issue the issue of judging others. Everyone has some characteristic that is unique to them. Is this anything new? not at all. I work with a lot of diverse people. some gay, some straight, some whatever. I do not treat them any different because of their sexual orientation.
Honestly if that is their only complaint about someone than they should be overjoyed. My beliefs teach me all these things are equal in the eyes of God A lie, being judgmental, rage, abuse, murder. I also believe that the Grace of Christ is sufficient to cover this. No where in the teachings of Christ does he say that one sin is not greater than another. So for those self-righteous Christians you have dealt with I hope they realize that the judging that they have done is just as bad as the sin they accuse you of. Just to let you know I also believe that I am no where near perfect. I know I will never be there either. So if you would like I would love to introduce you to the Christianity I know. Not the one that has been accusing you in the past. email me and we can talk more. Hey, there. First, my intention wasn't to elicit sympathy for being gay, I don't view it as a "symptom" of a "disease"    I was just offering my experience with how some religions view me in order to answer your question on why Im atheist. Others (religions) don't make this distinction. I'm also atheist because I can't really believe that there is a higher power looking out for me or one that planned me. I want to solve my problems myself and explore life on my terms to see what the rules really are, not have them handed to me like an instruction manual that has all my questions answered.
Second, well...I guess that last part answered your query on whether I want to be re-introduced to christianity. Later 
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Edited by
Abracadabra
on
Sun 08/30/09 07:42 PM
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Second, well...I guess that last part answered your query on whether I want to be re-introduced to christianity. Later
Oh come on Fusion. Give it a shot. All you have to give up is your sexual identity and your intellectual freedom and you too can become a bigot for Christ! Just think of the rewards! 
All the Christians will love you! 
Some of them might even be gay!
It's well-known that their clergy likes to fondle little boys! 
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Second, well...I guess that last part answered your query on whether I want to be re-introduced to christianity. Later
Oh come on Fusion. Give it a shot.
All you have to give up is your sexual identity and your intellectual freedom and you too can become a bigot for Christ! Just think of the rewards!
All the Christians will love you!
Some of them might even be gay!
It's well-known that their clergy likes to fondle little boys!
I did want to try the last part out, that way if I start to feel guilty I'm in the right place to be "forgiven"
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Second, well...I guess that last part answered your query on whether I want to be re-introduced to christianity. Later
Oh come on Fusion. Give it a shot.
All you have to give up is your sexual identity and your intellectual freedom and you too can become a bigot for Christ! Just think of the rewards!
All the Christians will love you!
Some of them might even be gay!
It's well-known that their clergy likes to fondle little boys!
I did want to try the last part out, that way if I start to feel guilty I'm in the right place to be "forgiven"
Now that was funny... 
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To the person above me your and idiot. Everyone has faith in your car to get you where your going and other things etc. God also gave us free will and he can control his creation he can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses. You just don't get it thats ok though you probably never will. YEAHHHHH!! follow my religion or you're an idiot!! oh, how many people I have met that felt that way.... |
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To the person above me your and idiot. Everyone has faith in your car to get you where your going and other things etc. God also gave us free will and he can control his creation he can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses. You just don't get it thats ok though you probably never will. Thank you for reading my post. But what you've just said doesn't make any sense. You say that God can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses. But that would mean that he could solve problems without violent methods and communicate with his creation without ambiguity. The idea that a God who can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses would need to 'sacrifice' his Son as a Blood Sacrifice is absurd don't you think? Who would this God have been trying to appease by this sacrifice? Mankind? God needs to appease sinful men? 
That makes no sense. Satan? God needs to sacarifice his son to appease a fallen demonic angel? Again that makes no sense for a God who can do anything he chooses any time he chooses. The only thing left to appease is himself. But a God who goes around being appeased by having people nailed to poles would himself be a demonic God. It doesn't make any sense no matter how we try to look at it. The only thing that makes sense is that this story is just as ficticious as the stories of Zeus (yet another God that was appeased by blood sacarifices). Don't you think that it makes far more sense that Jesus was a very wise man who saw how absurd (and violent) this story is and so he basically denounced it? After all, according to this story people were indeed still stoning each other based on the myths of Yahweh. Jesus saw that this was a horrible thing and tried to teach people to forgive each other instead. This flies in the very face of Yahweh. Why would Yahweh send his only begotten Son to come to Earth and denounce his very own commandments? Doesn't that make sense to you? You're the one who's calling me an idiot. I respect your view, but I ask you to consider precisely why you think I might be an idiot. I'm just considering the absurdities that are in the Bible. I'm not making them up. Like you've said, I read the book and this is basically what the story is saying overall. Also what sense does it make that the Virgin Mary was sinless? If that's true then why didn't God create Adam and Mary instead of Adam and Eve? Then we wouldn't be in this pickle in the first place. You'll probably say because God can do anything he damn well chooses. But still, why would it be our fault that God fixed Adam up with that wretched Eve instead of fixing him up with Mary? He could have saved everyone a lot of heartache and not have had to sacrifice his own Son later to pay for his own stupid mistake of creation. Clearly if God can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses then we aren't responsible for a single solitary thing. God is responsible for the whole mess. I'm really only asking you why I should put my FAITH in the idea that God is an idiot when I could choose to put my FAITH in the idea that Yahweh wasn't God at all, and the REAL Goddess isn't that stupid. Look at the Wiccans. They worship a very intelligent female deity who simply says, "Do as ye will and harm none". You don't see her going around having any of her daughters nailed to pole. In fact, she doesn't even have any fallen angels to be at war with. As a spiritual tradition it just sounds far more intelligent don't you think? I mean I'm not trying to convert you to Wicca. I personally don't buy into any formal religions myself. But I'm just saying that if you're going to put your FAITH in folklore why not at least choose a sane God who doesn't go around trying to solve everything using violent bloody methods? I have faith that God is good. That's the only faith I need. I don't see the value in these religions that try to make God out to be an angry jealous idiot who turns people into pillars of salt, has his own son nailed to a pole, and is at war with a demonic angel that he needs to appease. I ask you. Why would I even want to put my faith in an idea that God is so innept? I would rather believe that God is at least as intelligent and compassionate as me. That pretty much eliminates any of the Mediterranean mythologies. I would never have my son nailed to pole to appease myself. And if I'm supposedly all-powerful and can choose to do anything I want, I wouldn't allow a demonic angel to pee around with my pet humans. And like I mentioned earlier, I'd be at least nice enough to have fixed Adam up with a nice girl like Mary instead creating a bimbo like Eve for him. 
We never had a chance if this Mediterranean mythology is true. So I put my faith in the idea that the real God is actually nice, and not at all like the ficticious God of the Old Testament. Even Jesus denounced the ways of Yahweh. That's why he was nailed to a pole in the first place. He was accused of blaspheme against Yahweh. For whatever it's worth I don't think you're an idiot. I think your just a victim of a mythology that you haven't truly thought about in depth yet. 
I was a victim of it myself for the longest time. It basically ruined my life to be perfectly honest about it. It made me feel guilty about ever stupid little thing. Things that I had absolutely no business feeling guilty about at all. It's truly sad. good post...however, arguing w/ people unable to see beyond their dogma is like banging your head against a wall. It only feels good when you stop. |
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I, too, was raised w/o any dogma or any particular belief system. Also, to their credit, my parents allowed me to make my own decisions regarding what I would believe. As a child, they allowed me to go to various churches with various friends (w/o my parents). On the whole, I found them to be laughable....and sad (not to mention filled w/ hypocritical a-holes). I also tend to agree w/ the opinion that raising a child "religiously" is a form of child abuse, along the same vein as not reading to a child and not making them wear seat-belts.
Thinking for one's self is not a common thing. More's the pity. My condolences for being gay. Not because you're gay, but because of the way people in this country treat anyone who isn't just like everyone else. And the more different, the worse it gets. But I'm sure they'll get forgiven on Sunday.... Except for potential mates, I've never understood why anyone would give a crap what genitalia someone fancies. But then again, I don't really understand much of what humanity does... Hey Arc, I totally agree with you, sorry I didn't get back to you. And it's alright about the people, they are after all JUST people!
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I kind of believe in the writings of Bull Durham:
Annie Savoy: I believe in the Church of Baseball. I've tried all the major religions, and most of the minor ones. I've worshipped Buddha, Allah, Brahma, Vishnu, Siva, trees, mushrooms, and Isadora Duncan. I know things. For instance, there are 108 beads in a Catholic rosary and there are 108 stitches in a baseball. When I heard that, I gave Jesus a chance. But it just didn't work out between us. The Lord laid too much guilt on me. I prefer metaphysics to theology. You see, there's no guilt in baseball, and it's never boring... which makes it like sex. There's never been a ballplayer slept with me who didn't have the best year of his career. Making love is like hitting a baseball: you just gotta relax and concentrate. Besides, I'd never sleep with a player hitting under .250... not unless he had a lot of RBIs and was a great glove man up the middle. You see, there's a certain amount of life wisdom I give these boys. I can expand their minds. Sometimes when I've got a ballplayer alone, I'll just read Emily Dickinson or Walt Whitman to him, and the guys are so sweet, they always stay and listen. 'Course, a guy'll listen to anything if he thinks it's foreplay. I make them feel confident, and they make me feel safe, and pretty. 'Course, what I give them lasts a lifetime; what they give me lasts 142 games. Sometimes it seems like a bad trade. But bad trades are part of baseball - now who can forget Frank Robinson for Milt Pappas, for God's sake? It's a long season and you gotta trust. I've tried 'em all, I really have, and the only church that truly feeds the soul, day in, day out, is the Church of Baseball. or Crash Davis: Well, I believe in the soul, the c0ck, the pu$$y, the small of a woman's back, the hanging curve ball, high fiber, good scotch, that the novels of Susan Sontag are self-indulgent, overrated crap. I believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening your presents Christmas morning rather than Christmas Eve and I believe in long, slow, deep, soft, wet kisses that last three days. If I had to choose, I'd go with Crash. |
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If I had to choose, I'd go with Crash. Well if Annie Savoy thinks she's supposed to worship Buddha then Crash Davis is no doubt the better choice.
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A belief should be protected by proof .
You can believe anything but do you support it by any evidence at all ?. |
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I was raised religious, but ultimately I felt happiest just thinking for myself. It really aggravates me when people have a belief or a moral ground that is based soley on religion. I don't need the Bible to tell me that it's wrong to murder someone, for instance. I mean, that's dangerous. We start wars in the name of religion. We discriminate in the name of religion. We do ugly things because we think that's what God would do. And the God I believe in would want us to all execute some common sense... ya know?
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A belief should be protected by proof . You can believe anything but do you support it by any evidence at all ?. Faith is the basis of most religions. The very definition of which is to believe something that cannot be proven. If it were to be proven, it would no longer be a belief system, but a fact system. It's like no one actually believes in evolution, it's accepted as a fact, but not believed. Creationism is a belief system, you can't prove it. This seems like an arguement that can easily be answered with a dictionary. |
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A belief should be protected by proof . You can believe anything but do you support it by any evidence at all ?. We spin around the sun, not the other way around, this is also proven. Someone is nailed to a cross with the dying promise of a swell afterlife....I don't beLIEve this because there is no evidence to support this belief. Is this what you were implying or something totally different? |
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I, too, was raised w/o any dogma or any particular belief system. Also, to their credit, my parents allowed me to make my own decisions regarding what I would believe. As a child, they allowed me to go to various churches with various friends (w/o my parents). On the whole, I found them to be laughable....and sad (not to mention filled w/ hypocritical a-holes). I also tend to agree w/ the opinion that raising a child "religiously" is a form of child abuse, along the same vein as not reading to a child and not making them wear seat-belts.
Thinking for one's self is not a common thing. More's the pity. My condolences for being gay. Not because you're gay, but because of the way people in this country treat anyone who isn't just like everyone else. And the more different, the worse it gets. But I'm sure they'll get forgiven on Sunday.... Except for potential mates, I've never understood why anyone would give a crap what genitalia someone fancies. But then again, I don't really understand much of what humanity does... Hey Arc, I totally agree with you, sorry I didn't get back to you. And it's alright about the people, they are after all JUST people!
On the whole, people suck. There are still some bright spots in humanity, but on the whole people suck. That's why I wanna live in the Star Trek universe. There are no stupid people in the Star Trek universe...or door knobs. Funny thing about the door knobs... |
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I, too, was raised w/o any dogma or any particular belief system. Also, to their credit, my parents allowed me to make my own decisions regarding what I would believe. As a child, they allowed me to go to various churches with various friends (w/o my parents). On the whole, I found them to be laughable....and sad (not to mention filled w/ hypocritical a-holes). I also tend to agree w/ the opinion that raising a child "religiously" is a form of child abuse, along the same vein as not reading to a child and not making them wear seat-belts.
Thinking for one's self is not a common thing. More's the pity. My condolences for being gay. Not because you're gay, but because of the way people in this country treat anyone who isn't just like everyone else. And the more different, the worse it gets. But I'm sure they'll get forgiven on Sunday.... Except for potential mates, I've never understood why anyone would give a crap what genitalia someone fancies. But then again, I don't really understand much of what humanity does... Hey Arc, I totally agree with you, sorry I didn't get back to you. And it's alright about the people, they are after all JUST people!
On the whole, people suck. There are still some bright spots in humanity, but on the whole people suck. That's why I wanna live in the Star Trek universe. There are no stupid people in the Star Trek universe...or door knobs. Funny thing about the door knobs... I wanna live there too. It was always so funny whne someone would bring up "god", they characters would always laugh like when a kid does something stupid At the least id like a spaceshuttle,later
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I, too, was raised w/o any dogma or any particular belief system. Also, to their credit, my parents allowed me to make my own decisions regarding what I would believe. As a child, they allowed me to go to various churches with various friends (w/o my parents). On the whole, I found them to be laughable....and sad (not to mention filled w/ hypocritical a-holes). I also tend to agree w/ the opinion that raising a child "religiously" is a form of child abuse, along the same vein as not reading to a child and not making them wear seat-belts.
Thinking for one's self is not a common thing. More's the pity. My condolences for being gay. Not because you're gay, but because of the way people in this country treat anyone who isn't just like everyone else. And the more different, the worse it gets. But I'm sure they'll get forgiven on Sunday.... Except for potential mates, I've never understood why anyone would give a crap what genitalia someone fancies. But then again, I don't really understand much of what humanity does... Hey Arc, I totally agree with you, sorry I didn't get back to you. And it's alright about the people, they are after all JUST people!
On the whole, people suck. There are still some bright spots in humanity, but on the whole people suck. That's why I wanna live in the Star Trek universe. There are no stupid people in the Star Trek universe...or door knobs. Funny thing about the door knobs... I wanna live there too. It was always so funny whne someone would bring up "god", they characters would always laugh like when a kid does something stupid At the least id like a spaceshuttle,later
Yeah, a godless universe where there is no poverty, no stupid people, no stupid predjudicies. Sounds like heaven to me, if you'll pardon the expression.
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I, too, was raised w/o any dogma or any particular belief system. Also, to their credit, my parents allowed me to make my own decisions regarding what I would believe. As a child, they allowed me to go to various churches with various friends (w/o my parents). On the whole, I found them to be laughable....and sad (not to mention filled w/ hypocritical a-holes). I also tend to agree w/ the opinion that raising a child "religiously" is a form of child abuse, along the same vein as not reading to a child and not making them wear seat-belts.
Thinking for one's self is not a common thing. More's the pity. My condolences for being gay. Not because you're gay, but because of the way people in this country treat anyone who isn't just like everyone else. And the more different, the worse it gets. But I'm sure they'll get forgiven on Sunday.... Except for potential mates, I've never understood why anyone would give a crap what genitalia someone fancies. But then again, I don't really understand much of what humanity does... Hey Arc, I totally agree with you, sorry I didn't get back to you. And it's alright about the people, they are after all JUST people!
On the whole, people suck. There are still some bright spots in humanity, but on the whole people suck. That's why I wanna live in the Star Trek universe. There are no stupid people in the Star Trek universe...or door knobs. Funny thing about the door knobs... I still believe most people have good in their hearts... I haven't given up on humanity, not yet. 
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agree with person above me.
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To the person above me your and idiot. Everyone has faith in your car to get you where your going and other things etc. God also gave us free will and he can control his creation he can do anything he chooses anytime he chooses. You just don't get it thats ok though you probably never will. YEAHHHHH!! follow my religion or you're an idiot!! oh, how many people I have met that felt that way.... the funny ones are the ones that say "follow my lack of religion or your're an idiot" either way is people trying to force their beliefs on others |
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I think the buddists may be close...live a good life, dont hurt anyone or anything{etc, etc.} and you will asend. Anything wrong you do on earth you will atone for in the afterlife{not hell}. When you are done payin yer dues...you asend. Everyone goes somewere. And we all get together in the end.
I cannot follow any religion were they belive that pets dont go to "Heaven" too...thats just wrong. |
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