Just found this:




http://scienceunited.org/

Not sure about the nut story, but I think the immune thing, definitely!
We're all connected. It's like when a number of rats develop a specific resistance or gene -whether naturally or not- pretty soon thereafter ALL rats on the planet have the same variation even though they never got in contact with one another.


Herd immunity is most being immune to something due to going through a disease OR vaccination.
What's the big deal with that? I don't get it.
It's part of life, of having a human body. It automatically comes with an immune system to keep us alive.
The first ring of defence starting in the throat, 5 glands that detect & check EVERYTHING that goes in, whether solid or air/gases. They tell the immune system when there's something bad and it has to kick in.

So what's the big deal with 'herd immunity'? Without this extremely fine-tuned exquisite ability of the body we'd have gone extinct long time ago. We probably wouldn't have lasted a week, hihi.

The difficulty is getting to that "herd" immunity and the cost associated with getting there by having the illness. A well designed vaccine causes the immunity response in the body without the dangers associated with the disease. In the case of COVID, the dangers for some are very real and the result for some is death.

The cost associated with it now are only because it turned into a pandemic. That hardly ever happens, last time was a century ago with Spanish flu.
You cannot anticipate that, ever, as there will always be something new at some point. At least as long as we live the way we live (fear-based).
Most diseases that come up do not turn in a pandemic.
And if this ever comes back round it likely won't cause this much chaos as most will be immune.
What will happen when it mutates remains to be seen, even if that is going to happen. And if it would change enough for our immune system to not be able to handle it, the vaccines they're making now -based on this version- won't help either.

Also... as for the cost of it... did you read the economic results in the USA AFTER the Spanish flu?
The cities that did a very strict lockdown and social distancing AND for a long time as well, bounced back economically afterwards at the speed of light! It boosted everything.
The cities who hadn't been so strict and didn't shut down stuff for a longer period didn't do so well at all afterwards.
So I think this cost thing is relative. Don't forget a lot of money is being made now too, just from different things.
And if everything gets a boost afterwards... Might make up for a lot!
Big difference now of course is that many companies can and are still working because it's internet based, only have their people work from home. Maybe not in the US, but in other countries like mine for sure.

For anyone interested ....,Expert panel on herd immunity and covid19...,

http://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-comments-about-herd-immunity/

Even based on the conservative estimation that 50% of a population would need to be infected with covid to attain herd immunity . That is an astounding figure to achieve . If 80 to 95% is necessary The mortality rate will be higher In order to achieve the target . Not sure what Sweden and Netherlands population figures are or how many have been infected but it is obvious the time required to achieve herd immunity would be substantial .

For it to be effective there would need to be global herd immunity . Not sure if borders to these countries are closed or open . If closed how will they manage tourism once other countries (Who have not achieved herd immunity ) open their borders ???

Personally , to me it seems a risky strategy .

How will they assess what percent of the population have been infected ??

It is unclear what immunity someone affected will have or how long that immunity will provide protection . Also unclear it it is possible to be reinfected with covid19. Some of the data supports that this is already happening .

Some countries are developing antibody testing . Again unsure if the Netherlands or Sweden are Currently implementing this ?

How will they determine the number of asymptomatic carriers ??

Given we still do not understand some of the basics of this disease I believe it is better to proceed with caution .. herd immunity may be achievable in the long term but it is not a short term solution .

A vaccine is still the preferred method to generate herd immunity .

Blondey, please explain point (a) to me

1) earlier in the thread, Dark had stated there is no vaccine for virus only bacteria

Does it not mean any vaccine will have a) converter that converts the virus to bacteria (again lethal to human lungs) and b) then creates vaccine against the bacteria?



If half the world population was infected, 3 billion; deaths would be 200 million
based on mortality rate: 200,000 deaths per 3 million figures
again based on current data & projections for day after -- 26 April

Let's say 100% of population is required to be infected then more than half a billion will die.

Gruesome because living in India, while lock down is on till May 3 - after that the choices for 50% of populations will reduce to starvation versus going out and getting infected.

asymptomatic carriers About 2000 Muslims who left a Delhi based congregation of 4000 that had members who were already infected - but unaware - are in hiding in different states across India.

India 23,000 infected / 700 dead.

Hi jaish

The global race is on to develop a vaccine Against covid . Here is a list of potential vaccines that are currently in the development stage

http://www.who.int/blueprint/priority-diseases/key-action/novel-coronavirus-landscape-ncov.pdf

If you look at the platform column and type you will see there are several different platforms that can be used to create a vaccine .. some use the actual virus or portion of it ., others use genetic code DNA /RNA and others use an existing vector like the measles virus . As you can see from this list only a few developers are using live attenuated (weakened) covid virus.... or the inactivated form .

Explanation of how the vaccine platforms differ ...

http://amp.abc.net.au/article/12132414

Will go back and reread darkowl ‘s post and add a further comment if nec .

Unfortunately the creation of the vaccine is just one part . The clinical phases of testing for safety and outcome is what demands time .

It Is still expected to take 12 to 18months before a vaccine is ready for use.

Even if they modify an existing vaccine it would still need to be trialled to ensure the immune response is effective and does not cause harm.

India Is on the list as working on a vaccine . Which ever country wins the race to develop a successful vaccine will gain a massive economic boost . I have my fingers crossed for your country

Coronavirus: First patients injected in UK vaccine trial

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52394485

"Prof Andrew Pollard, director of the Oxford Vaccine Group, who is leading the trial, said:" "We're chasing the end of this current epidemic wave. If we don't catch that, we won't be able to tell whether the vaccine works in the next few months. But we do expect that there will be more cases in the future because this virus hasn't gone away."

China already conducting phase 2 vaccine trial ....

http://www.fiercepharma.com/vaccines/china-s-cansino-bio-advances-covid-19-vaccine-into-phase-2-preliminary-safety-data

The "cost" I was referring to was not economic! The "cost" is in the number of people who will die. As I'm one of those people with underlying concerns, I'll be very careful to protect myself until a vaccine is available. I'd really prefer to live and enjoy life for a few more years!

Ah that way. I can understand it is extra scary then. My mom also has a number of conditions that make her part of the vulnerable group. She was scared at first, since she lives in a flat and in a busy city, but I think she's a bit more relaxed about it now.

5th day on end with lower new cases numbers!
This phenomenon shows in a few more countries. Hoping it will continue! We had 3 days of numbers going down a week and a half ago in a few countries including mine. But then it went back up again for about a week.
Hopefully this time that won't happen and we are truly beginning to see the start of a downward trend.

After people being locked down or restricted for a period of time, they tend to want out. Same as cabin fever; when that happens they tend to be more careless. It takes several days from the increased social activity before we see the results. I believe the average from being exposed to serious enough infection to be tested or hospitalized is 5 days. Things that seem to increase numbers are like holidays (Easter) and nice weather days especially on the weekend. Practice your social distancing and wear your face covering.

Inject people with disinfectant?
What was he smoking?

We did have a peak 4-7 days after Easter, while the 3 days directly after Easter we had fewer. Interesting. Hadn't thought of that yet.

I've not seen anyone with a face mask here, only 1 in Rotterdam when I went to buy my car near there.
I am guessing there will be some more in the cities, but over here not seen 1.
And so far I've seen 2 people here wearing disposable gloves in the supermarket.
I only bought hand desinfectant last week, wasn't intending too, only bought it cos it was on the counter. I figured it could be handy when leaving the supermarket before getting into the car. But I forget to take it with me, hihi.
I do wash my hand right away when I get home.
I live in a fairly remote area. Could be that if I'd live in a more densely populated place I'd act differently.

Who would be dumb enough to think that was a real idea? I took it as a joke when it was said. Same level as that couple who took the fish tank cleaner!! And these are the same people who elect our politicians!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Galidesivir ... potent antiviral compound

Nz looks to be showing interest in the use of this antiviral compound as a treatment for covid . Further clinical trial currently underway in Brazil . Phase I clinical trials testing for effectiveness against other serous viral pathogens were completed in 2019 .....

http://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/415015/kiwi-scientist-behind-frontrunner-covid-19-treatment


http://www.drugs.com/clinical_trials/biocryst-completes-phase-1-clinical-trial-galidesivir-18143.html

it's inappropriate. people are dying. more will die.
a presidential address about a global pandemic we are in the midst of, from the white house, is neither the time nor the place to for jocularity nor sarcasm.
period.

facts would be nice. ideas about pathways forward would be nice.

an iota of humanity would be nice.

I agree dub .. not only inappropriate but dangerous . As a leader trump should be embarrassed and ashamed . I would like to have a little chat with him lol.

This country is made up of all different intellectual levels, regardless of whether
or not you find them fit to vote. If it was meant as a joke, how is this any better?
At a time like this? It’s sad when words of one man prevent people from having empathy,