So at some pont you've made enough laws/regulation and you need to sit back and revel
in the controls you have forced on a 'free people'.

They freedom isn't free and someone is always paying for it, if not the rich(and good for them
going out and using their brains to make more money- land of opportunity)who will pay
for all the 'free handouts' of the socialism programs being rammed up the backsides of ALL tax
paying citizens- 47% of all Americans pay zero in federal income taxes. Screw it tax them too!!
Let the freeloaders fill what its like to have their money extorted from them like the rest of us.

I'm permitted to keep about 60 cents for every dollar I've earned- straight robbery.

And how about we used the Obamessiahs own words and apply it to the 'government' at a certain
point I think you've stole enough money.

Doc

So the powers that be have no problem writing law after law, and
in fact the AZ law mirrors that of the federal government enacted
by congress not too many years ago. Here's the biggest difference-
It requires peace officers to actually enforce a law that was already
a law in the first place (which I'm certain someone has already brought up).

You want to pick and choose which laws we should ignore? I guess we
could start with the most debaucherous and work our way down from there.
They're laws that unfortunately had to be put into place because
for whatever reason, for whatever group or click or sect of people-
someone, somewhere, sometime abused another. And, as a caviat(again
probably been covered already) over 9000 people ARE killed each year
as a direct cause of an illegal alien, beit drunk driving, hit and run,
straight up murder, whatever. Doesn't make someone prejudice to want to
protect his or her family, its called love- or are we only allowed to
love someone who is not an American? I'm not sayin, I'm just sayin.

Peace
Doc

Depending on how far back you evolutionist choose to go
it can be said that even the native americans aren't from
America(bearing straights-great migration). So kind of stands
to reason that the last man standing gets to make the rules.
I find it funny and sad at the same time that only the american
territories like rico, and guam have english as their official
language. English is pretty much a given as the national language,
immigrants who become citizens have to demonstrate that they can
Not only understand it but speak it as well. I'm guessing some of
you might call that racism or some. Other nonsensicle obsurdity-
Me, hell I call it nationalism, if its good enough for you universal
healthcare handout types then it should be good enough for our language too...
The Alabama remark doesn't go far enough- it is America and you are speaking
ENGLISH right now. Deal with it.

Doc

Oh yeah- I'm back.

;)

Live and let live.

Equal rights for everybody, white black green yellow, straight gay, smart and dumb, islamic catholic taoist tree hugger, whatever.....

equal rights for everyone, period! and yes that means us dumb white dudes too. down with racism of all kinds.

d

Unfortunately I've already sent in my taxes earlier this year... funny thing happened though;
the government was nice enough to "correct" a "mistake" and rescended one of those stim checks, since I did not receive mine due to the fact I was in Afghanistan. So basically they stole 600 bucks and told me it was my fault because I was wrong and should not have been receiving one on the first place. (I'm not a special enough interest group!)
But, boy was I sure glad they were looking out for me! This aint the land of the free i signed on the defend, lots has changed in the mindsofthe mental midgets who are now running the insane assylum.
oh well.... spill some tea for me please.


doc

crazy liberal asks herself "are my beliefs destroying the very fabric of this once great country?"

well rules of engagement are more covered in country, and are set in accordance to the threat levels of any one particular area, meaning the rules of engagement are not the same in Baghdad as they are in Mosul or Baquba.

there are theatre wide rules of engagement. but those can jump from one level to the next depending once again on the threat level of the SOLDIER engaged at the time.

these are the five S's that we use, 1. signs, 2. shout, 3. show(them your weapon), 4. shove(if they get to close to you and wont stop) 5. shoot!

any time someone is in range to shout at then they are also in range to blow you away with a suicide vest (always a real threat- i hope you agree)

what are the "rules" of war. really there is only one.

don't die for your country, make the other guy die for his. breaking that down for the learning impaired...COME HOME ALIVE.

DO PEOPLE DIE IN WAR? YES. IS IT AVOIDABLE- ONLY IF WE WERENT FIGTING A WAR. SEE WHAT SOME OF YOU AND THE MEDIA FAIL TO PORTRAY ACCURATELY IS THAT WE TAKE GUN FIRE FROM ALL OVER THE PLACE...INSURGENTS LIKE TO USE HOUSES THAT ARE OCCUPIED BY CIVILIANS. We dont know if there are civilians in there we only know we are being shot from there, so we shoot back- defending ourselves and sometimes the innocent are trapped between the bad guys and US.

is it crap, yes it is--- so would you please mind terribly going over there and telling the insurgents not to shot from houses that have civilians in them, please, that would be great thanks-

doc

Wow some people and their arrogance and audacity to speculate on the reasons a person joins the service, the acts they go through, and the feelings that you believe they should have.

How many on this thread are in the military, how many on here have been to Iraq or afghanistan? have fought in past wars or conflicts of this country?

I am not a prisoner.
I have not been treated badly or unfairly by the army or the government.
for the most part people in the nation treat me well (not that I care)

The original post said the kid was an "FO, quite possibly the most dangerous job on the battlefield" even tho any job on the battlefield is dangerous- an FO's job(forward observer) is to stand back off the battle and direct any support by fire missions (that's mortars and rockets for those of you who dont know) occassionaly they "paint" a target with a laser- this can be done from over a kilometer away.
meanwhile the troop on the ground is kicking in a door or ducking for cover from small arms and sniper fire. take from that what you will.

there are to many times people in one profession or another just dont want to be left out of the story, so they say crap that is crap just to be relevant. example....

in 2006 the most kenetic battle that US soldiers were engaged in was happening in "Ramadi" one little battalion of 717 men in a city of 400,ooo..... but yet to hear soldiers who were in iraq in other places you would think that they all fought in Ramadi- it just wasnt so.

most of them are embarrassed about what they do there...not because they are killers, but because they arent. they never get to leave their bases (FOB's or COP's).

the ratio of combat troops to support troops is 1 to 8. what does that mean? it means for every door kicker there is 8 men or women who are in country to support him. whether they are mechanics, cooks, transportation whatever...the point is they dont kick in doors.

140,000 troops, divide that by eight, thats how many true combat soldiers are in Iraq.....

those who say otherwise just honestly do not know the facts or are honestly lying to you.

I never had an FO on the battlefield- i called one on the radio once but that was it.

on a separate note- since im a prisoner, Im i also a murderer for killing a man?

if you have never fired your weapon at a person with the hostile intent on killing that person - who by the way was trying to kill either you or one of your friends then your opinions about the goings on in Iraq mean exactly spit, which has turned into a saliva stain on my uniform- but its okay, i'll still wear it with pride.

I'd like to investigate the whole "snow soldier" thing. personally I think it is full of BS. Sadr city only recently has became a hot spot again(it was one at the end of 2004 but was quickly turned around) the FOB is called HOPE, and until about march of 07 was occupied by US forces. it has been in relative peace until recently with the uprising of the militia. You of course have to know about the area right there before you can make any judgements about what is going on---we call it putting it into perspective. about 1.2 million people living in about 10 city blocks...IT IS THE MOST CONGESTED AREA IN IRAQ. An Area that saddam had set aside (wasnt that nice of him) for shiite in and around baghdad. SO yeah, their pissy, i would be to. they have been pissy, and now even more so. easy to get the crowd running in a movie theatre when you cry fire.

Keep your fake tears of empathy or sympathy- all it is doing is running the makeup on your face.


peace

killer Doc, prisoner number 187

rose that was intended for the group and not shot at you personally.


af huh? well yep no jokes here, its good to be nice to the people that give you a ride, right? haha just kidding. they do more than that.



doc

They, there have been calls for help from expatriated iraqi's since after the 91 kurd massacres quite frankly. but im sure those peope dont count right- your asking did the government of iraq call and say help us get rid of this guy? shheeeessh, you people.....
throw one thing out there, they say ok but, what about, you explain that and its like, yeah ok but what about, what about, what about...just a big circle jerk. you dont want the truth, it doesnt fit in with your perception of reality alice.

Im a grown ass man Miguel, 35 years old, some thats not old to others its anciet, to some of these crusties on here im just a bullpup. point is miguel- i havent had a drill sergeant in a very long damn time, and to use that as a retort for being called out on your rather transparent humanitrianism is definately playing the lib card of denial.

you say that you are against war because people die and uselessly get hurt. yeah okay I can except that.. but if you think for one second in your lonelywalkinghead that this war hasn't been more about humanitarianism than money then I would just say...."oh thats right you avent been there"

WE are treating them better than they have ever been treated before, better food, better medical, better schools, better beter better. on all level, rights being the primary one.


you guys have this mentality that all people all over the world get treated with respect and have rights to do and say whatever they want, then there is the reality of it which is they dont.

women can not speak out freely in a great part of the world, and you libs claim to be for the women- ha!your a joke.

claim to be for the kids, but kids are slaves in how much of the world? where are your cries for that? again, ha! your a joke.

dont come at me with this false pretend caring and compassion that you profess. you dont like the war, say i dont like the war it cost to much of my money, id respect that more than "oh people are suffering"

because your on the wrongside of compassion to not be for the war. but hey like i said earlier, its all about looking good and sounding good to you guys and not actually being good.

so whatever you have to tellyourself to sleep better at night.



doc- the humanitarian- who would of thunk

there is right and there is wrong. the cop out answer is that there is a lot of gray areas and people should throw hugs around and except the wrong with a smile.

I dont mind being on the wrong side of an issue politically. I could even care less when someone would try to tak my freedom to express that right (cause they aint stopping doc from talking) the thing that gets me all damn fired up more than anything.

Not mad man, or dragoon lady, or even symbelmyne- they at least show honesty about we're they are coming from. no what gets me are the fake people...the ones that for civility sake will just throw out their beliefs... reminds me of the peter in the bible story. I can not stand a coward.

fake a$$ people want to be nicey nicey to make people like them, nope, not buyin that wormed block of cheese. be real be your self and if someone dont like it and wants to argue with you and your belief, hey screw them- they're not enriching my life.

neenerneenerneeneer

its kinda like that airplane movie "surely you cant be serious?" "I am serious and dont call me sherlly"

back on point;

yep your right, if we arent careful on te whole iraq thing then it will be all for not, and bite us squarely on the buttocks, yes sir.

so your just floatin out the in political no mans land then arent you? do you feel like a minority? are you being picked on by friends and family? just kidding.... listen this has been a learning experience for some and a nitemare for others. I for one ....well lets leave that one alone.

good chat thanks for helping get the temp back down, i really got to get off here now.


doc

in your humble and very learned opinion im sure.

whatever makes you sleep at night.

its cool...just a little heated if you couldnt tell, if you took offense then lets just play it off as a miss judgement once again for the bush administration

im no sir tho , but thats cool too.

what are you missing your check? your block o'cheese, or are you the guy that got the wii and the 360 and the ps3, the i-phone, a little thump thump system in your ride.

eye role smiley is right.

we created a welfare handout state, and everyone wants to take a turn in line. you should be so proud of yourselves.

maybe some day we will come down there to argentina or whatever third world nation your living in and liberate it to so that you too old foul friend my excersize your "right" to vote and speak your mind at the ballot box, provided of course those are truly free elections and not some mock excersize.
I for one am glad your gone, please, and dont take this the wrong way....dont come back.


peace

Sorry to hit and run but, things to do , I just wanted to put my 2 pennies in here.



How many people are eating because of that?
How many kids are going to school because of that?
How many vacines are being giving out bcause of that?
and yet those who say they are for humanity would rather see more innocents sqandered because they themselves feel they are being jipped out of some free government welfare handout.

I know Im going to catch hell for this one too. but, how many strving kids do you know in america....really how many? and if you do know any, why arent you feeding them. Or does the call for charity only come at the cost of someone else, put up or shut up.
How many kids in america do you know who arent going to school? why arent they in school? do we have to drag them out of the home and make them go? isit there parents fault for not making them go? is the fault of the government for them not getting up and going to school. there are laws you know that require them to go to school, or be signed out by the parent for home schooling, special needs what have you. so if they arent going to school someone needs a butt whooping.
How many diseases could be cured? your kidding right? they have been working on cancer for how long, thrown how much money at it, yet still around, aids, same thing. Its almost like someone with a gambling addiction- this is my last dollar im putting it in the machine it will be the one....im going to hit with this one....dope! dammit missed out.
ad with a price tag of 720 mil (which i think is scewed- some of that money counted is money that was going to be spent anyway one soldiers pay whether it was there or here didnt matter) but with price tag 720 (using your numbers mad) sounds like the wealthy are losing more than you or I. I know i dont have that kind of cheddar laying around the house.

we're not destitute, we're not indigent, we're not lying naked on the bathroom floor. We are just fine, take a breath. so what if some people need to stop spending like they are paris hilton or donny trump, guess what your not! No one told you, or twisted your arms and said go spend like mad and max out all your credit cards, and dont save. oh wait a minute, they did say dont save didnt they, the democrats, "we will provide for you, you will have social security to take care of you, go be crazy have fun you nutty kids" and you listened to the lie....who's fault was that again? George take your cards on a spending spree at the mall? did you really need the xbox360 and the PS3? How many of you are on new computers right now? on high speed dls broad band wireless whatever? hopw many new shoes in your closets, how many new jeans shirts purses, cars in the driveway?
People YOU have to take responsibility for yourselves. this is still the best country on the planet, if you see someone in need, why cant you help them, how on earth did our parent grandparent great grandparents on down ever manage to live without the handouts from the government? hmmm...
your grown ups, you should be realist, not day dreamers of could of would of.....
you get on these pittypat party tantrums preaching about how "oh me the poor and the helpless people all this suffering" but yet when people are helping those poor suffering people its like your some jeckyl and hyde..."screw those people i meant me"
which is it?

are you for womens lib? we are busting down the brickwalls that are oppressing women in iraq.
are you for feeding the hungry? we are giving them more than rice lifting at least that part of their socio economic levels, and any social worker can tell you that poor nutrition in poor socio economic families can and does lead to greater health problems, so we're killing two birds with one stone- and saving money in the long run.

Cry me a river bleeding heart liberals, bleeding supposedly for everyone else, but really, in a reality check.... the greedy ones in this country are you. the things you claim to be for you could give two rats less about. but it looks good on paper doesnt it, sounds good, makes you sound and look good...until you have go and tell someone that your utopian orwellian world really was just a dream and now its time to be realist.


peace from a baby killing war mongering, progandist with a rich millionaire daddy agenda that you can stick in your , "oh its a peace pipe" and smoke away.


im out this boitch




doc

Symbelmyne are you even allowed to vote where you are? I think you told me once you weren't. Freedom is a wonderful thing and from time to time it must be protected from those who wish it ill.
Claims of the big oil companies running the show are more than a bit on the conspiratorial side, especailly when you take into account that off the coast of florida nearer to Cuba there are CHINESE oil rigs not American. And they aren't from shell or exxon or mobile.
What utterly amazes me is still with at least three soldiers dancing in this thread some of you would have the "Audacity" to tell us and others what we know to be true because we live it and see it, that we are liars and propagandizers.
You don't like the war, got it. We don't either, it's not very much fun being shot at by snipers or having your humvee hit by an IED. But when you stumble on or have an Iraqi tell you where large weapons caches are or where an al queada cell is and you bust them, that makes it all worth it.
Was Iraq wonderful before we came over here? If you really honestly believe that then your speaking out of ignorance. Did we blow some stuff up? Of course we did. Did we carpet bomb the place? Hell no we didn't.
The electric plants, and water treatment/pumping facilities were so bad and outdated and falling apart when we first got here, it became the first priority of the reconstruction. Don't you remember all the stories about the power outages? and now where are those stories? there gone because we fixed them.
Do things need to be fixed in the US? hell yea they do, for starters we should build some more damn oil refineries to help somehow with the cost of fuel(even tho now we are sitting on a surplus- speculators are driving the price up, not the corporations).
Iraqi'a control over 85% of their contry now (militarily) and that number is growing everyday. The soldiers will becoming home sooner rather than later. Tell me doe it make sense, I mean any kind of sense to let the world know when that will be. All that does is puts soldiers lives in danger, consentrated attacks and what not. So I am happy that you dont know when, Im happy I dont know when, but more importantly, with there being only so many ways in and out, Im happy they dont know when.
Soldiers that tell you their own experiences on here do it because we know what you don't get to hear about iraq. we dont do it to make the president or the circumstances look rosier than they really are.
As far as our good friend BIN, I wouldnt worry to much about that, more troops are being diverted to afghanistan, near the pak border, al qaeda forces will fall, the network will be uncovered and what ever plush little cave he is in(most likely a house in pakistan) he will be found, and Im pretty sure it will be with a bullet in his head.
SO relax, kick back wait for november when you and your crazy lib friends can get out and rock the vote for either the socialist guy or the socialist girl.There isnt anything you can do anyway but give yourself high blood pressure.

Doc

oh yea- this wasnt a form letter mad man.

yep, what she said.>>>>>>^