do you know when ice cream was invented ??? Back in bibilical times the closest thing to ice cream was frozen snow but clearly not available in desert locations

Can you show us the passage in the Bible where it says Jesus ate ice cream?


Blondey111...

A very good website. Thank you.

http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/tbhell.html

I'm thinking we all agree that ice cream exists (even though it isn't in the bible) but nonetheless still exists .

Like many other things...

you enjoy that Greek version of wrongness, BigD, I always have the translation I prefer more than the KJV...


Matthew 5:22 CJB

The Complete Jewish Bible

22 But I tell you that anyone who nurses anger against his brother will be subject to judgment; that whoever calls his brother, `You good-for-nothing!' will be brought before the Sanhedrin; that whoever says, `Fool!' incurs the penalty of burning in the fire of Gei-Hinnom!


from Hebrew Gê' Hinnōm - JewishEncyclopedia.com:

For this reason the valley was deemed to be accursed, and "Gehenna" therefore soon became a figurative equivalent for "hell." [[[[[Hell, like paradise, was created by God (Soṭah 22a);]]]]] according to Gen. R. ix. 9, the words "very good" in Gen. i. 31 refer to hell; hence the latter must have been created on the sixth day.


the Jews claim Yeshua means HELL, as in fire and brimstone and damnation!!

Again, the biblical authors didn't use the Norse word Hell because the word wasn't in their vocabulary.

Why all of the fuss about a Norse word used in some English versions of the Bible?

After all, English isn't the original language of any book of the Bible.

You are correct David. Anyone with good knowledge knows that it was written in brail. I've seen the movie 'book of Eli '

amen, pardon the pun.

From iam_resurrected


The Ancient Koine Greek is where your Bible comes from. It's where all the NTs come from.

But I will tell you one thing for sure. The word "hell" is not in the "The Complete Jewish Bible".



A figurative equivalent for "hell." As there is no "hell" in the Scriptures, there can be no literal equivalent.

I don't know where you are getting this from, but here is the entry on Gehenna from the Jewish Encyclopedia...


http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/6558-gehenna

In case Mingle won't allow the graphic I posted the web page it comes from. It explains why this valley was considered accursed.

But this place was never considered to be "hell." The Ancient Jews did not believe in a "hell." Nor did they believe that anyone was going to heaven after death. They looked forward to the Resurrection of all mankind by the Messiah and his accompanying kingdom. Your "Complete Jewish Bible" NT is from Messianic Jewish Publishers. Not very old at all. And not strictly Jewish.

So there is no way they would consider Yeshua as "hell."

And there is no mention of a "hell" during creation in Genesis. As a matter of fact, the word "hell" does not appear anywhere in the Ancient Hebrew text.

CLV John 11:23 Jesus is saying to her, "Your brother will be rising."
24 Martha is saying to Him, "I am aware that he will be rising in the resurrection in the last day."

The Scriptures and it's various reference books are not like a Smorgasbord. You can't just pick and choose the meanings and words you like because they happen to fit into your belief system. You have to take them as they come.

wrongness?

I don't think so.


From mikey4yousweety


Oh yeah. I remember that movie. Good flick.

From iam_resurrected


So basically iam_resurrected is making my argument for me. If one can escape (or be delivered) from "hell" then others can as well.

This proves that "hell" is not "eternal."

According to the KJV, anyway.

Unless the word 'sheol' means something other than "hell."

Is There a Place Called Hell

____________________________________________________________________-

Yes, my in-laws house on thanksgiving

https://norse-mythology.org/gods-and-creatures/giants/hel/

There is no explanation from Dodo_David as to how this pagan goddess got into the Bible if indeed that is what it is. There is also a "hell" of sorts in Egyptian myths, Hinduism, Ancient Mesopotamia, and several other pagan religions.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hel_(being)

As "Hel" is a goddess, she does not fit the description of the English version of "hell." Neither does "Hades," the brother of Zeus.

Also, this site says "Hel" was from Poetic Edda, compiled in the 13th century. That is about 1000 years since the NT was formed.

I am a Christian. I believe and follow Jesus Christ (and Christ Jesus). I do not pay much attention to pagan religions.

There is no "hell" in the Scriptures.

Me too, Bigd.

you are correct

after researching, it appears after the Great White Throne judgement, whoever is not found written in the Book of Life will be cast into the Lake of Fire.

which means as of this very moment, those people who are dead in their graves and [[[[[not found]]]]] written in the Book of Life are still just rotting in their graves.

they will appear before Yeshua during the Judgment and then be cast into the Lake of Fire.

what I did notice however, the Hebrew Jews assumed being born a Jew automatically granted them a spot in heaven. so, with this kind of mindset, they never thought about the possibility of being the ones not spending eternity with God. therefore, they never had the need to write about a place where they believed they never would end up at.

WOW, hell and trinity are both lying concepts in mainstream Christianity. interesting, very very very interesting!!

and what Peter mentions as Tartus and the Abyss are for fallen [Demons] angels only!!

so basically, Yeshua's resurrection was to free those found written in the Book of Life from rotting in their graves.

hmmmm, this does make the parable of Lazarus and the rich man seem sketch...

thankfully, I researched the Torah and real Old Testament scriptures. I really missed this one concerning hell

From iam_resurrected


All mankind that dies will be rotting in their graves until Jesus returns. But I am glad to see you are doing some research. That is why it is important to separate the doctrines of men from what God wants us to do.

One more thing. The people that go into the Lake of Fire, there is nothing that says they will stay there.

Now read over my thread on The End of the World - Eon. There is some interesting stuff there. Paul defined 5 eons. Can you find them?



Good job!

Lee Marvin did a song years ago called 'I was born under a wondering star'
A line it says 'hell is in Hello'!

The Hebrew term 'satan' is a verb and title, not a name. It means arguer or adversary, old Hebrew was a very limited dialect and most words are loose and ambiguous compared to more modern languages. As a title it was given to public advocates, ie. lawyers.

The English word 'devil' comes from the old English, deuil, which is a translation of the latin, daemon or demon, which in turn is the translation of the greek damon, which means divine messenger or ancestral spirit and was used as a substitute for the word seraphim when rabbi wrote in greek instead of Hebrew, because greek is a more concise language than Hebrew, which is as mentioned a very limited and inherently ambiguous dialect in early forms when scripture was first written down.

Satan translates to lawyer, or someone who is acting like a lawyer in an argument. Devil literally means angel, there is no differentiation.

The evangelical concept of Hell simply doesn't exist either in Judaism or early Christian script, it was borrowed from pagan beliefs at the time, which often happened during various stages of christianization. The concept of Hell is taken from Greek mythology where Tartarus was the burning chamber of incarceration within the afterlife realm, Hades which was ruled by the god of earthly realms, Hades. There was also a kind of heaven in Hades. Zeus ruled the divine sky, Poseidon the changing seas and Hades earthly mortality, that was the Greek trinity.
Later, during north European Christianization the terms were changed from Greek but again mixed with local paganism to describe the same concept, which was Greek, except now they used Germanic terms in which the land of the dead was called Nifleheim, in which was a domain called Hel, which was ruled upon by a monstrous goddess named Hel. In Germanic mythology heaven as it were, was in a completely different location whereas originally in the Greek it was in the same neighbourhood, so the new alignment was borrowed too.

There was no hell originally in Judaism, the closest Hebrew term for the concept is that of Sheol, a word that describes the slum neighbourhood of ancient cities, where dead were burned in the street. It was where the most impoverished lived in these cities, so was rife with destitution, disease and the smell of burning flesh. Sheol as such describes a rather unpleasant existence, but an earthly one and describes nothing whatsoever about any fairy lands. Early Christianity started upon this basis but received a tremendous amount of local pagan influence, simply because most early converts had been brought up viewing things in such a manner, and it was much more loose with parables and metaphors by intention, where Judaism in Hebrew is more a linguistics issue and involves a lot of arguing to decide what scripture is even saying between rabbi.

So it's like two jews talking and one says they have a terrible lot in life, the other remarks, gee you must really live in Sheol, whilst a Christian with a classical education scribes the conversation and substitutes the term Gehenna, but then it is rewritten into latin about 5 centuries later as Hell, and a pentacostal comes along and says, my god, it's a real place!
That's how you wound up with hell in Christianity. Similar story with the devil. Lucifer is a name but not a real one, it's a title taken by rulers like Josh the Fearful. It is believed by most scholars it was probably the battlefield title of Nebadchannezzar III. Not a spirit being. And before you say the greatest trick of the devil is making people believe he doesn't exist, the word devil as previously described is a mistranslation (due to modern meaning) of the Hebrew seraphim. Doesn't mean anything more than that. It's just a derivative of the Greek, damon which means divine messenger or ancestral spirit.

edit. it should also be mentioned archaic Hebrew in which earliest scriptures are written uses masculine and feminine linguistic forms, which is why god seems a bit schizo as LORD God in one phrase and creator God in another. Some scholars believe Judaism was originally pantheistic and became monotheistic sometime around the 5th century BC, ie. God was a married couple with a host of demigods not too unlike other period religions, Mr and Mrs God, but the Mrs God sort of got lost along the way, or absorbed into the new omnipotent multifaceted God of many personalities and forms.

Blah and Blah. Religion, any type is a man made construct and your only fooling yourself if you believe otherwise. Im done thats my 2 cents worth.

Sounds alot like Ancient Koine Greek. It developed over time (about 1000 years) into a modern language but was a pretty basic language. I believe it was a fisherman's language at the start.

Strong's

H7854 satan saw-tawn'
from H7853;

an opponent; especially (with the article prefixed) Satan, the arch-enemy of good.

Strong's

G1228 diabolos dee-ab'-ol-os
from G1225;

a traducer; specially, Satan (compare H7854).

traduce:
verb (used with object), traduced, traducing.
1 : to expose to shame or blame by means of falsehood and misrepresentation
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/traduce

I think we can get a good picture of the Adversary by reading the Book of Job.

CLV Jb 2:3 Yahweh said to the Adversary, Have you set your heart ›on My servant Job? For there is no one like him on earth, a man flawless and upright, fearing Elohim and keeping away from evil. And he still is holding fast to his integrity, though you would incite Me against him to swallow him up gratuitously.
4 Then the Adversary answered Yahweh, saying, Skin in behalf of skin, for all that a man has would he give in behalf of his soul.
5 Nevertheless, now put forth your hand and touch ›his bone and his flesh. He shall assuredly scorn you to your face.



And "angel" means messenger...

Strong's

H4397 mal'ak mal-awk'

from an unused root meaning to despatch as a deputy;
a messenger; specifically, of God, i.e. an angel (also a prophet, priest or teacher).



Some good research here.



Strong's

H7585 sh'owl sheh-ole'
or shol {sheh-ole'};

from H7592; Hades or the world of the dead (as if a subterranean retreat), including its accessories and inmates.

I have not seen it represented as a city. In the Scriptures, it is called the Unseen or Unperceived. It is the figurative place where all souls go at death.



Ah yes, Gehenna. The Valley of Hinnom. It is a real place. An actual physical place you can find on the map. It was used as a garbage dump for Jerusalem. It was situated on a sulphur deposit, so a fire would burn hotter than a normal fire. It was also used as a "Potters Field" of sorts, where vagrants and criminals were "buried."

I have traced "hell" to about the 10th century, so far. It was considered the coldest place in existence. So cold that demons and devils were depicted as blue, not red. The fire was added later, from Gehenna.



Very good. Lucifer comes from a mistake in the Septiguant. He is often confused with the King of Tyre from Ezekiel.



Interesting...

CLV Gn 1:26 And Elohim said: Let Us dmake humanity in Our image and according to Our likeness. Let them hold sway over the fish of the sea and over the flyer of the heavens, over the domestic beast, over every land animal and over every creeper that is creeping on the earth.
27 So Elohim created humanity in His image; in the image of Elohim He created it: male and female He created them.

Male and female He created them.

Good job. Very interesting work.