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Topic: God is NOT a loving god.
RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 02:59 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 03:14 PM



The Bible I read shows me God is a loving God. Don't know what all the boohooey is about.what


Read Joshua.

Slaughter without mercy.... men women and children.
In the name of God.

Yep, that sounds real loving ...indifferent frown


Ive read Joshua! God is Good!!

Joshua leads a successful military campaign to clear idol-worshipping people from the land.

Joshua shows over and over how God blesses His people. The Promised Land was His gift to them, as were the military victories that he engineered.

Joshua said: "Choose you this day whom ye will serve..as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." (Joshua 24:15)

So what about in 2 Kings where god sent she bears to kill 42 kids for making fun of a mans bald head?
That's justifiable cause god did it.Wow can someone say delusionalscared

Kleisto's photo
Thu 06/13/13 03:50 PM




except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way.



No, God doesn't expect ONE way of living above all others, nor has he stacked anything against us. God has told us to live a loving life, that's it. All the different rules/laws or whatever circle around being a loving person, heck we'll even be judged on how we treat others.


You just disproved your own argument, if we are FORCED to do one thing over another by penalty of eternal death if we do not comply, that very much IS expecting one way of living above any others. There's no way around it.



Sorry Kleisto, but you still don't seem to be getting what I'm saying.

What you do from when you were born can not earn you eternal death. That is why the scriptures constantly speak of the "reward" of eternal life. It is earned through faith and action. Faith comes from your heart, it is what you truly put your heart in. And the actions show this faith and or the lack there of the faith. Nobody is forcing anyone to do anything.





Bullcrap, if you HAVE to act one way or another to survive, you have no true choice. It is still forced or at least attempted force.

Kleisto's photo
Thu 06/13/13 03:51 PM


The Bible I read shows me God is a loving God. Don't know what all the boohooey is about.what


Read Joshua.

Slaughter without mercy.... men women and children.
In the name of God.

Yep, that sounds real loving ...indifferent frown


Yep, people who read the Bible and only see a loving God are purposefully ignoring the COUNTLESS passages that show the opposite. And yet we're told we pick and choose.......

Kleisto's photo
Thu 06/13/13 03:53 PM




The Bible I read shows me God is a loving God. Don't know what all the boohooey is about.what


Read Joshua.

Slaughter without mercy.... men women and children.
In the name of God.

Yep, that sounds real loving ...indifferent frown


Ive read Joshua! God is Good!!

Joshua leads a successful military campaign to clear idol-worshipping people from the land.

Joshua shows over and over how God blesses His people. The Promised Land was His gift to them, as were the military victories that he engineered.

Joshua said: "Choose you this day whom ye will serve..as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." (Joshua 24:15)

So what about in 2 Kings where god sent she bears to kill 42 kids for making fun of a mans bald head?
That's justifiable cause god did it.Wow can someone say delusionalscared


Amen to that......by this logic any war is good if it's waged by God.....seems a lot like how we justify war now doesn't it? If we do it it's good, to hell with the people that die in its' wake. Funny huh?

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 03:54 PM








"the difficulty is in defining what would be 'proof' to an atheist outside of God hiself speaking to them which they may still dismiss as a result of something else,,,, "

Actually I'm fairly sure if "god" was all the religious people believe him to be, that god talking to me directly wouldn't simply occur to me as "a result of something else" it would be an extremely spiritual experience that no one in their right mind could deny.

Sad to say, it's completely impossible to prove the non-existence of something like "god" because what the entire existence of "god" boils down to is a thought in people's minds. It is comparable to love because it is nothing more than a thought or way of thinking. So the only way that I could possibly prove to you that he does not exist is to alter the way you think and clearly that will never happen as you refuse to listen to logic and truth. So I can define perfectly what would be proof to you, but the definition is of non-existence as you have a mind that refuses to bend to see that truth. But I've been saying it since I was a kid, if the all powerful god wants to prove himself to me, DO IT ALREADY.

Oh also I've noticed that you seem to base your belief in "him" on all the beauty and structure and whatever that you see in this world, but what of all the chaos and destruction, the heinous acts and horrible deeds. It seems you hold a very convenient double standard, if something good happens it's god, if something bad happens it's our fault.


to quote a beloved family member

"I cant reveal God to you, I can only share how He reveals himself to me'


Im quite logical and open to truth, no amount of condesention masked as self proclaimed superiority proves otherwise,,,

belief in or against God has no LOGIC behind it except the logic drawn drawn for all of us on our UNIQUE life experience,,,

and I Also notice that similarly, non believers tend to blame God for all the atrocity and not have much gratitude towards him for all the blessings and beauty,,,


Actually I hold no double standard, I know that when it comes right down to it, all the good and the bad that happens to us is our doing alone. The topic of this thread is to simply point out the conflict in the way religious people think. God did all of the good things in life, man did all of the bad. Much too convenient of a double standard. If god did all of the good things then you must also hold him accountable for the bad things. But from the same branch of reasoning, if god has no control over us and we do all of the good and the bad, then your entire supposed reason for believing in his existence goes out the window because all of the beauty and structure you see in this world is the work of man, not god and science can explain the rest.

And if you really think I'm being so condescending, then think about what you would think of me if I told you a pink flesh-eating bunny rabbit lives in my closet and whispers secrets to me in my sleep. I read it in a book, I feel that it's true and therefore it must be! Perhaps you'd just brush it off and say "well, that's his belief, who am I to judge?" well, what if I built a whole religion around it and started preaching it to you in person "have you heard of the pink flesh eating bunny rabbit, let me tell you about it, he talks to me!" and what if the pope of my new religion started coming to your bible studies and policing what you can or can't do(just like the actual pope interferes with medical science). Ya getting irritated yet? Well that's how I feel about religion.


if dozens of books were written about your bunny rabbit, and billions of people over thousands of years reinforced that same entitys existence

I probably would consider it,, just on one persons word and one book though,, probably not


and as far as God having control, that is a different issue, I can lay out flour, sugar, milk, and eggs in front of you,, but if you bake a wonderful cake or burn it,, is YOUR control

I may CHOOSE to intervene to assist you at some point or I may sit back and let you learn on your own

none of those things are inconsistent

God creates life, and nature, and then leaves the rest to us to proceeed with,,, there is nothing illogical in that,,,

He allows the circumstances which create both the good and evil that we experience, but the details are up to us as is the result,,,


except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way.



more of the if its not what makes me happy it cant be loving.....

mentality

he hasnt stacked the deck,, WE have,,,,it only is difficult now because we have caved in so much against it for so long

what should have been simple is now difficult for us because of all the EXTRA stuff we have come to expect to receive

instead of expecting to give,,,,,


I'm sorry, love doesn't make demands to love, it just gives it. Your God makes demands in order to love, therefore it fails the love the test, that's how I see it.



God gave no "command" to love. You can not command anyone to love or really command anyone to do anything.

God tells us, informs us of what he wishes. It is our choice to obey or not. Therefore if one does remain dead eternally, it is there own fault, not God's.

Choices my friend, choices.




Cowboy this is your typical paradigm.
You keep typing god informs us and blah,blah,blah.Point is who is us cause god has not informed me of anything.If he did i wouldn't be an atheist.

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 04:13 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 04:17 PM





The Bible I read shows me God is a loving God. Don't know what all the boohooey is about.what


Read Joshua.

Slaughter without mercy.... men women and children.
In the name of God.

Yep, that sounds real loving ...indifferent frown


Ive read Joshua! God is Good!!

Joshua leads a successful military campaign to clear idol-worshipping people from the land.

Joshua shows over and over how God blesses His people. The Promised Land was His gift to them, as were the military victories that he engineered.

Joshua said: "Choose you this day whom ye will serve..as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord." (Joshua 24:15)

So what about in 2 Kings where god sent she bears to kill 42 kids for making fun of a mans bald head?
That's justifiable cause god did it.Wow can someone say delusionalscared


Amen to that......by this logic any war is good if it's waged by God.....seems a lot like how we justify war now doesn't it? If we do it it's good, to hell with the people that die in its' wake. Funny huh?

2 ways to look at it,it could be using a belief in a god to wage war or it could be a psychological delusion that a voice in their head they accept to be god told them to wage war.
In the minds of a neocon war mongrel deity believer there's false dichotomy in their views to wage war.Just ask George Bush Jr.
Example of it is "God is a loving god,but he wanted me to kill all the Philistines."

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 05:04 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 05:35 PM
If the elohim named yahweh was a loving god why didn't he just simply reveal himself to the egyptians instead of sending moses?
He sent a dude with a staff that could turn into a serpent and expected the egyptians to just say "ok we believe in your yahweh(I AM).Nope moses did the same thing the egyptian priest could do but yet that was supposedly going to change what a civilization has believed for thousands of years.So yahweh decided to just plague their a s s e s.Cute fictional story.
Anyways a poster says i know nothing of hebrew mythology he called it tradition or history.Eloah is singular for god,elohim is plural for gods.So the god for jacob was eloah ya'akov.What was the god for abraham called?
My point is the jews took a bunch of elohim and converted it into 1 eloah.....next.

msharmony's photo
Thu 06/13/13 05:32 PM
HE does not answer to his creation,, thats why

HE does HIS work not the work of mortal conscience,,,

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:02 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 06:03 PM

HE does not answer to his creation,, thats why

HE does HIS work not the work of mortal conscience,,,

msharmony if you wish to believe this i have no problem with it but just to put this out there the OT is nothing more than a bunch of different gods that the authors or author of the bible tried to blend together to make it as 1 god.
You won't believe me cause you have faith blinders on but keep looking for the truth you're just looking in the wrong direction.jmho

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:22 PM
Lets take a look at Moses books(Torah),he refers to himself in the third person throughout his books yet he stats in verses "Now show ME your glory" and "The word of the lord came to ME".
JEDP has the most stupid apologetic answer for this.Ken Ham is a great business man.

no photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:43 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Thu 06/13/13 06:49 PM
I am not going to get into the delusional excuses MADE FOR GOD ..for the story of slaughter in the Book of Joshua because it is all fiction anyway. It is a good example though, of how dictators (Character played by Joshua) control their idiot followers and manipulate them to wage war on people so they can plunder and steal their stuff.

God did not give the land to Joshua. He (Joshua) took it through plunder an murder.

And I said:

Don't ever dare tell me that God ordered it, and don't preach to me that this same "God" spoke to someone and enlisted men to do his killing for him.

And don't tell me that this is 'The wrath of God' or that the people slaughtered were "evil." (Or idol worshipers)

If you dare to tell me these things I will surmise that you are TOTALLY insane to believe such fiction, and more insane to preach it, and more insane to believe and sanction genocide of those people.

...OF ANY PEOPLE

And don't start talking about it having happened 2000 years ago..and that I should just ignore the story... as if that changes anything.

It never happened. What gets my goat is the Christians who sanction such brutal merciless killing and believe that God ordered it. What a crock of bull.

(And Christian wonder why there is war in this world. They need only to LOOK AT WHAT NONSENSE THEY BELIEVE.)


RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:47 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 06:50 PM

I am not going to get into the delusional excuses MADE FOR GOD ..for the story of slaughter in the Book of Joshua because it is all fiction anyway. It is a good example though, of how dictators (Character played by Joshua) control their idiot followers and manipulate them to wage war on people so they can plunder and steal their stuff.

God did not give the land to Joshua. He took it through plunder an murder.

And I said:

Don't ever dare tell me that God ordered it, and don't preach to me that this same "God" spoke to someone and enlisted men to do his killing for him.

And don't tell me that this is 'The wrath of God' or that the people slaughtered were "evil." (Or idol worshipers)

If you dare to tell me these things I will surmise that you are TOTALLY insane to believe such fiction, and more insane to preach it, and more insane to believe and sanction genocide of those people.

(And Christian wonder why there is war in this world. They need only to LOOK AT WHAT NONSENSE THEY BELIEVE.)



You do know that the war god Yahweh is a bull also.Didn't want to go there but hey they want to seek the truth.So heaven is a place their spirits will graze.mooooo...GO MINOTAUR.

Lazarus102's photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:53 PM
Edited by Lazarus102 on Thu 06/13/13 06:56 PM
"But I will say this one thing. God has made himself known to his creation that is certain but they did not recognize him at his coming."

So god is deceptive, good to know. As I've been saying, nothing but convenience upon convenience. All answers are the same, it's like talking to a child that makes things up as you go. If I say anything that conflicts your god and proves his non-existence, the answer is naturally "god need not answer, for he is god." HAH, what a sham.
No no,Don't look behind the curtain!(Wizard of OZ, also a sham, but at least he tried to prove himself not to be, lol)

The answers are always SO predictable because they're so black and white and holding no real thought or logic, just god is this, you are blind for not believing. The quick easy one size fits all answer for those that don't actually read the bible that they spend so much time defending. Those that do read the bible quote the convenient verses from it while ignoring and avoiding the crap out of the verses that directly conflict with the verses they're quoting. The bible is a huge mass of contradictions.

I still haven't gotten an answer to why psychology plays no part in the bible; I answered it myself but I was hoping for a more intellectual reply than "he is god, god do god things, believe and YE WILL BE SAVED!" which really has nothing to do with what I said at all.

no photo
Thu 06/13/13 06:55 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Thu 06/13/13 06:57 PM
You do know that the war god Yahweh is a bull also.Didn't want to go there but hey they want to seek the truth.So heaven is a place their spirits will graze.


Yes, they are all bull, but what gets me are the people who believe it actually happened as it is written in Joshua and they make excuses for the bloody genocide saying that God ordered it and they think that is Okay because the people were "evil" or idol worshipers, or inbred with Satan or aliens etc.

Whatever they believe about the people that were supposed to have been killed in the book of Joshua, it means that they could believe (or do believe) that same thing about people in the world today and they are the kind of people who will justify war in the name of their Gods.

Alien or imaginary Gods... they will kill people who do not believe as they do or who worship another God not approved by them.

Insanity at its finest.

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 07:04 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 07:08 PM

You do know that the war god Yahweh is a bull also.Didn't want to go there but hey they want to seek the truth.So heaven is a place their spirits will graze.


Yes, they are all bull, but what gets me are the people who believe it actually happened as it is written in Joshua and they make excuses for the bloody genocide saying that God ordered it and they think that is Okay because the people were "evil" or idol worshipers, or inbred with Satan or aliens etc.

Whatever they believe about the people that were supposed to have been killed in the book of Joshua, it means that they could believe (or do believe) that same thing about people in the world today and they are the kind of people who will justify war in the name of their Gods.

Alien or imaginary Gods... they will kill people who do not believe as they do or who worship another God not approved by them.

Insanity at its finest.

Seriously i'm not joking Yahweh is a bull actually a minotaur.Yahweh is a copycat of Baal.All those desert dwellers copied off of each other to promote their quickly created gods.The bible is just a blender of these gods to make one.What do you think the golden calf was all about?

no photo
Thu 06/13/13 07:12 PM


You do know that the war god Yahweh is a bull also.Didn't want to go there but hey they want to seek the truth.So heaven is a place their spirits will graze.


Yes, they are all bull, but what gets me are the people who believe it actually happened as it is written in Joshua and they make excuses for the bloody genocide saying that God ordered it and they think that is Okay because the people were "evil" or idol worshipers, or inbred with Satan or aliens etc.

Whatever they believe about the people that were supposed to have been killed in the book of Joshua, it means that they could believe (or do believe) that same thing about people in the world today and they are the kind of people who will justify war in the name of their Gods.

Alien or imaginary Gods... they will kill people who do not believe as they do or who worship another God not approved by them.

Insanity at its finest.

Seriously i'm not joking Yahweh is a bull actually a minotaur.Yahweh is a copycat of Baal.All those desert dwellers copied off of each other to promote their quickly created gods.The bible is just a blender of these gods to make one.What do you think the golden calf was all about?


Oh I see... No I didn't realize that.

no photo
Thu 06/13/13 07:13 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Thu 06/13/13 07:13 PM
What do you think the golden calf was all about?


I had no idea why it was in the image of a calf or bull. But the gold I understood...

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 07:20 PM
Edited by RKISIT on Thu 06/13/13 07:23 PM

What do you think the golden calf was all about?


I had no idea why it was in the image of a calf or bull. But the gold I understood...

It's a Assyrian tradition that hebrews,hyksos,israelites whatever you want to call gods chosen people stole(not the christian color vestment thingy) or mimicked.

RKISIT's photo
Thu 06/13/13 09:06 PM
See the truth is is that followers can't grasp the concept of how the abrahamic mythology all began they just start with genesis 1:1,it started way before that fallacy.

no photo
Thu 06/13/13 09:33 PM

See the truth is is that followers can't grasp the concept of how the abrahamic mythology all began they just start with genesis 1:1,it started way before that fallacy.


Yep. So even when the truth is known, its not accepted.


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