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| Topic: God is NOT a loving god. | |
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I don't hate god because i don't accept he exist.I just don't see why people worship a mythological being or beings. If someone ask me a hypothetical question like "Ok rob what would you consider god to be?" i would say minus the psychological part i would say god isn't a being god is energy and matter.This is weak because calling energy and matter god is lame but it's more like if a gun was pointed to my head answer. Because we exist, there is a creative force of some kind manifesting life. I call that God. It is conscious and intelligent and permeates all things, connected and sharing energy and information. Because I exist, I see that as proof of God. God is existence. |
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Edited by
RKISIT
on
Mon 06/10/13 03:45 PM
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I don't hate god because i don't accept he exist.I just don't see why people worship a mythological being or beings. If someone ask me a hypothetical question like "Ok rob what would you consider god to be?" i would say minus the psychological part i would say god isn't a being god is energy and matter.This is weak because calling energy and matter god is lame but it's more like if a gun was pointed to my head answer. Because we exist, there is a creative force of some kind manifesting life. I call that God. It is conscious and intelligent and permeates all things, connected and sharing energy and information. Because I exist, I see that as proof of God. God is existence. Do you just use god as a synonym for consciousness or this is what you actually believe? |
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I don't hate god because i don't accept he exist.I just don't see why people worship a mythological being or beings. If someone ask me a hypothetical question like "Ok rob what would you consider god to be?" i would say minus the psychological part i would say god isn't a being god is energy and matter.This is weak because calling energy and matter god is lame but it's more like if a gun was pointed to my head answer. Because we exist, there is a creative force of some kind manifesting life. I call that God. It is conscious and intelligent and permeates all things, connected and sharing energy and information. Because I exist, I see that as proof of God. God is existence. Do you just use god as a synonym for consciousness or this is what you actually believe? Sometimes. But consciousness is an inadequate name or description for God, but it serves okay, for lack of anything else. The universe is alive and connected in the quantum world where energy and information is constantly exchanged. It is intelligent and manifests forms. Life forms are able to channel and develop conscious awareness of different kinds and degrees from mineral to human. Information can be had via the quantum field and the connections. I don't believe in God as an entity so that term is also an inadequate one. God is "to exist." I exist, and that is my proof of God. |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Mon 06/10/13 03:59 PM
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I find this very interesting. A brain cell and the universe... look similar.
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The vast amount of information in the universe and quantum world is organized, otherwise it would just be chaos. Forms and life forms have access to programs/information which are contained in the elements and combinations of things can form from out of what appears to be nothing.
Life forms can emerge out of purified water and washed quarts sand that have legs or look like plants. So this information is there...they are automatic programs for life. |
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Edited by
Kleisto
on
Mon 06/10/13 07:42 PM
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"the difficulty is in defining what would be 'proof' to an atheist outside of God hiself speaking to them which they may still dismiss as a result of something else,,,, " Actually I'm fairly sure if "god" was all the religious people believe him to be, that god talking to me directly wouldn't simply occur to me as "a result of something else" it would be an extremely spiritual experience that no one in their right mind could deny. Sad to say, it's completely impossible to prove the non-existence of something like "god" because what the entire existence of "god" boils down to is a thought in people's minds. It is comparable to love because it is nothing more than a thought or way of thinking. So the only way that I could possibly prove to you that he does not exist is to alter the way you think and clearly that will never happen as you refuse to listen to logic and truth. So I can define perfectly what would be proof to you, but the definition is of non-existence as you have a mind that refuses to bend to see that truth. But I've been saying it since I was a kid, if the all powerful god wants to prove himself to me, DO IT ALREADY. Oh also I've noticed that you seem to base your belief in "him" on all the beauty and structure and whatever that you see in this world, but what of all the chaos and destruction, the heinous acts and horrible deeds. It seems you hold a very convenient double standard, if something good happens it's god, if something bad happens it's our fault. to quote a beloved family member "I cant reveal God to you, I can only share how He reveals himself to me' Im quite logical and open to truth, no amount of condesention masked as self proclaimed superiority proves otherwise,,, belief in or against God has no LOGIC behind it except the logic drawn drawn for all of us on our UNIQUE life experience,,, and I Also notice that similarly, non believers tend to blame God for all the atrocity and not have much gratitude towards him for all the blessings and beauty,,, Actually I hold no double standard, I know that when it comes right down to it, all the good and the bad that happens to us is our doing alone. The topic of this thread is to simply point out the conflict in the way religious people think. God did all of the good things in life, man did all of the bad. Much too convenient of a double standard. If god did all of the good things then you must also hold him accountable for the bad things. But from the same branch of reasoning, if god has no control over us and we do all of the good and the bad, then your entire supposed reason for believing in his existence goes out the window because all of the beauty and structure you see in this world is the work of man, not god and science can explain the rest. And if you really think I'm being so condescending, then think about what you would think of me if I told you a pink flesh-eating bunny rabbit lives in my closet and whispers secrets to me in my sleep. I read it in a book, I feel that it's true and therefore it must be! Perhaps you'd just brush it off and say "well, that's his belief, who am I to judge?" well, what if I built a whole religion around it and started preaching it to you in person "have you heard of the pink flesh eating bunny rabbit, let me tell you about it, he talks to me!" and what if the pope of my new religion started coming to your bible studies and policing what you can or can't do(just like the actual pope interferes with medical science). Ya getting irritated yet? Well that's how I feel about religion. if dozens of books were written about your bunny rabbit, and billions of people over thousands of years reinforced that same entitys existence I probably would consider it,, just on one persons word and one book though,, probably not and as far as God having control, that is a different issue, I can lay out flour, sugar, milk, and eggs in front of you,, but if you bake a wonderful cake or burn it,, is YOUR control I may CHOOSE to intervene to assist you at some point or I may sit back and let you learn on your own none of those things are inconsistent God creates life, and nature, and then leaves the rest to us to proceeed with,,, there is nothing illogical in that,,, He allows the circumstances which create both the good and evil that we experience, but the details are up to us as is the result,,, except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. |
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Smh. What law is there against charity and kindness and living at peace? Proof God exists: Guilt! John 16:8-11
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More proof God exists. When you were a child you became conscious of evil... no one taught it to you but you became aware of good and evil when you were a wee child! Genesis 3:5 So then God has bound all men to sin so that he might have mercy upon them all.
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But will all receive mercy? You are all given grace for the rain falls on the wicked and the righteous alike. But will all receive mercy?
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More proof God exists...a loving Father who disciplines those he loves. But an enemy hates who comes only to steal to kill and to destroy. A Father gives life and breath and eveything else. Butthe
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But the father of lies what good can he possibly do? What can he create?
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"the difficulty is in defining what would be 'proof' to an atheist outside of God hiself speaking to them which they may still dismiss as a result of something else,,,, " Actually I'm fairly sure if "god" was all the religious people believe him to be, that god talking to me directly wouldn't simply occur to me as "a result of something else" it would be an extremely spiritual experience that no one in their right mind could deny. Sad to say, it's completely impossible to prove the non-existence of something like "god" because what the entire existence of "god" boils down to is a thought in people's minds. It is comparable to love because it is nothing more than a thought or way of thinking. So the only way that I could possibly prove to you that he does not exist is to alter the way you think and clearly that will never happen as you refuse to listen to logic and truth. So I can define perfectly what would be proof to you, but the definition is of non-existence as you have a mind that refuses to bend to see that truth. But I've been saying it since I was a kid, if the all powerful god wants to prove himself to me, DO IT ALREADY. Oh also I've noticed that you seem to base your belief in "him" on all the beauty and structure and whatever that you see in this world, but what of all the chaos and destruction, the heinous acts and horrible deeds. It seems you hold a very convenient double standard, if something good happens it's god, if something bad happens it's our fault. to quote a beloved family member "I cant reveal God to you, I can only share how He reveals himself to me' Im quite logical and open to truth, no amount of condesention masked as self proclaimed superiority proves otherwise,,, belief in or against God has no LOGIC behind it except the logic drawn drawn for all of us on our UNIQUE life experience,,, and I Also notice that similarly, non believers tend to blame God for all the atrocity and not have much gratitude towards him for all the blessings and beauty,,, Actually I hold no double standard, I know that when it comes right down to it, all the good and the bad that happens to us is our doing alone. The topic of this thread is to simply point out the conflict in the way religious people think. God did all of the good things in life, man did all of the bad. Much too convenient of a double standard. If god did all of the good things then you must also hold him accountable for the bad things. But from the same branch of reasoning, if god has no control over us and we do all of the good and the bad, then your entire supposed reason for believing in his existence goes out the window because all of the beauty and structure you see in this world is the work of man, not god and science can explain the rest. And if you really think I'm being so condescending, then think about what you would think of me if I told you a pink flesh-eating bunny rabbit lives in my closet and whispers secrets to me in my sleep. I read it in a book, I feel that it's true and therefore it must be! Perhaps you'd just brush it off and say "well, that's his belief, who am I to judge?" well, what if I built a whole religion around it and started preaching it to you in person "have you heard of the pink flesh eating bunny rabbit, let me tell you about it, he talks to me!" and what if the pope of my new religion started coming to your bible studies and policing what you can or can't do(just like the actual pope interferes with medical science). Ya getting irritated yet? Well that's how I feel about religion. if dozens of books were written about your bunny rabbit, and billions of people over thousands of years reinforced that same entitys existence I probably would consider it,, just on one persons word and one book though,, probably not and as far as God having control, that is a different issue, I can lay out flour, sugar, milk, and eggs in front of you,, but if you bake a wonderful cake or burn it,, is YOUR control I may CHOOSE to intervene to assist you at some point or I may sit back and let you learn on your own none of those things are inconsistent God creates life, and nature, and then leaves the rest to us to proceeed with,,, there is nothing illogical in that,,, He allows the circumstances which create both the good and evil that we experience, but the details are up to us as is the result,,, except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. more of the if its not what makes me happy it cant be loving..... mentality he hasnt stacked the deck,, WE have,,,,it only is difficult now because we have caved in so much against it for so long what should have been simple is now difficult for us because of all the EXTRA stuff we have come to expect to receive instead of expecting to give,,,,, |
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"the difficulty is in defining what would be 'proof' to an atheist outside of God hiself speaking to them which they may still dismiss as a result of something else,,,, " Actually I'm fairly sure if "god" was all the religious people believe him to be, that god talking to me directly wouldn't simply occur to me as "a result of something else" it would be an extremely spiritual experience that no one in their right mind could deny. Sad to say, it's completely impossible to prove the non-existence of something like "god" because what the entire existence of "god" boils down to is a thought in people's minds. It is comparable to love because it is nothing more than a thought or way of thinking. So the only way that I could possibly prove to you that he does not exist is to alter the way you think and clearly that will never happen as you refuse to listen to logic and truth. So I can define perfectly what would be proof to you, but the definition is of non-existence as you have a mind that refuses to bend to see that truth. But I've been saying it since I was a kid, if the all powerful god wants to prove himself to me, DO IT ALREADY. Oh also I've noticed that you seem to base your belief in "him" on all the beauty and structure and whatever that you see in this world, but what of all the chaos and destruction, the heinous acts and horrible deeds. It seems you hold a very convenient double standard, if something good happens it's god, if something bad happens it's our fault. to quote a beloved family member "I cant reveal God to you, I can only share how He reveals himself to me' Im quite logical and open to truth, no amount of condesention masked as self proclaimed superiority proves otherwise,,, belief in or against God has no LOGIC behind it except the logic drawn drawn for all of us on our UNIQUE life experience,,, and I Also notice that similarly, non believers tend to blame God for all the atrocity and not have much gratitude towards him for all the blessings and beauty,,, Actually I hold no double standard, I know that when it comes right down to it, all the good and the bad that happens to us is our doing alone. The topic of this thread is to simply point out the conflict in the way religious people think. God did all of the good things in life, man did all of the bad. Much too convenient of a double standard. If god did all of the good things then you must also hold him accountable for the bad things. But from the same branch of reasoning, if god has no control over us and we do all of the good and the bad, then your entire supposed reason for believing in his existence goes out the window because all of the beauty and structure you see in this world is the work of man, not god and science can explain the rest. And if you really think I'm being so condescending, then think about what you would think of me if I told you a pink flesh-eating bunny rabbit lives in my closet and whispers secrets to me in my sleep. I read it in a book, I feel that it's true and therefore it must be! Perhaps you'd just brush it off and say "well, that's his belief, who am I to judge?" well, what if I built a whole religion around it and started preaching it to you in person "have you heard of the pink flesh eating bunny rabbit, let me tell you about it, he talks to me!" and what if the pope of my new religion started coming to your bible studies and policing what you can or can't do(just like the actual pope interferes with medical science). Ya getting irritated yet? Well that's how I feel about religion. if dozens of books were written about your bunny rabbit, and billions of people over thousands of years reinforced that same entitys existence I probably would consider it,, just on one persons word and one book though,, probably not and as far as God having control, that is a different issue, I can lay out flour, sugar, milk, and eggs in front of you,, but if you bake a wonderful cake or burn it,, is YOUR control I may CHOOSE to intervene to assist you at some point or I may sit back and let you learn on your own none of those things are inconsistent God creates life, and nature, and then leaves the rest to us to proceeed with,,, there is nothing illogical in that,,, He allows the circumstances which create both the good and evil that we experience, but the details are up to us as is the result,,, except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. more of the if its not what makes me happy it cant be loving..... mentality he hasnt stacked the deck,, WE have,,,,it only is difficult now because we have caved in so much against it for so long what should have been simple is now difficult for us because of all the EXTRA stuff we have come to expect to receive instead of expecting to give,,,,, I'm sorry, love doesn't make demands to love, it just gives it. Your God makes demands in order to love, therefore it fails the love the test, that's how I see it. |
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Edited by
Conrad_73
on
Tue 06/11/13 03:01 AM
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More proof God exists. When you were a child you became conscious of evil... no one taught it to you but you became aware of good and evil when you were a wee child! Genesis 3:5 So then God has bound all men to sin so that he might have mercy upon them all. God exists because he has to exist,therefore he does exist! 
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except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. No, God doesn't expect ONE way of living above all others, nor has he stacked anything against us. God has told us to live a loving life, that's it. All the different rules/laws or whatever circle around being a loving person, heck we'll even be judged on how we treat others. Where you cannot learn anything because you are left dead eternally? What in the world are you talking about my friend, you have your entire life to learn. |
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"the difficulty is in defining what would be 'proof' to an atheist outside of God hiself speaking to them which they may still dismiss as a result of something else,,,, " Actually I'm fairly sure if "god" was all the religious people believe him to be, that god talking to me directly wouldn't simply occur to me as "a result of something else" it would be an extremely spiritual experience that no one in their right mind could deny. Sad to say, it's completely impossible to prove the non-existence of something like "god" because what the entire existence of "god" boils down to is a thought in people's minds. It is comparable to love because it is nothing more than a thought or way of thinking. So the only way that I could possibly prove to you that he does not exist is to alter the way you think and clearly that will never happen as you refuse to listen to logic and truth. So I can define perfectly what would be proof to you, but the definition is of non-existence as you have a mind that refuses to bend to see that truth. But I've been saying it since I was a kid, if the all powerful god wants to prove himself to me, DO IT ALREADY. Oh also I've noticed that you seem to base your belief in "him" on all the beauty and structure and whatever that you see in this world, but what of all the chaos and destruction, the heinous acts and horrible deeds. It seems you hold a very convenient double standard, if something good happens it's god, if something bad happens it's our fault. to quote a beloved family member "I cant reveal God to you, I can only share how He reveals himself to me' Im quite logical and open to truth, no amount of condesention masked as self proclaimed superiority proves otherwise,,, belief in or against God has no LOGIC behind it except the logic drawn drawn for all of us on our UNIQUE life experience,,, and I Also notice that similarly, non believers tend to blame God for all the atrocity and not have much gratitude towards him for all the blessings and beauty,,, Actually I hold no double standard, I know that when it comes right down to it, all the good and the bad that happens to us is our doing alone. The topic of this thread is to simply point out the conflict in the way religious people think. God did all of the good things in life, man did all of the bad. Much too convenient of a double standard. If god did all of the good things then you must also hold him accountable for the bad things. But from the same branch of reasoning, if god has no control over us and we do all of the good and the bad, then your entire supposed reason for believing in his existence goes out the window because all of the beauty and structure you see in this world is the work of man, not god and science can explain the rest. And if you really think I'm being so condescending, then think about what you would think of me if I told you a pink flesh-eating bunny rabbit lives in my closet and whispers secrets to me in my sleep. I read it in a book, I feel that it's true and therefore it must be! Perhaps you'd just brush it off and say "well, that's his belief, who am I to judge?" well, what if I built a whole religion around it and started preaching it to you in person "have you heard of the pink flesh eating bunny rabbit, let me tell you about it, he talks to me!" and what if the pope of my new religion started coming to your bible studies and policing what you can or can't do(just like the actual pope interferes with medical science). Ya getting irritated yet? Well that's how I feel about religion. if dozens of books were written about your bunny rabbit, and billions of people over thousands of years reinforced that same entitys existence I probably would consider it,, just on one persons word and one book though,, probably not and as far as God having control, that is a different issue, I can lay out flour, sugar, milk, and eggs in front of you,, but if you bake a wonderful cake or burn it,, is YOUR control I may CHOOSE to intervene to assist you at some point or I may sit back and let you learn on your own none of those things are inconsistent God creates life, and nature, and then leaves the rest to us to proceeed with,,, there is nothing illogical in that,,, He allows the circumstances which create both the good and evil that we experience, but the details are up to us as is the result,,, except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. more of the if its not what makes me happy it cant be loving..... mentality he hasnt stacked the deck,, WE have,,,,it only is difficult now because we have caved in so much against it for so long what should have been simple is now difficult for us because of all the EXTRA stuff we have come to expect to receive instead of expecting to give,,,,, I'm sorry, love doesn't make demands to love, it just gives it. Your God makes demands in order to love, therefore it fails the love the test, that's how I see it. God gave no "command" to love. You can not command anyone to love or really command anyone to do anything. God tells us, informs us of what he wishes. It is our choice to obey or not. Therefore if one does remain dead eternally, it is there own fault, not God's. Choices my friend, choices. |
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except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. No, God doesn't expect ONE way of living above all others, nor has he stacked anything against us. God has told us to live a loving life, that's it. All the different rules/laws or whatever circle around being a loving person, heck we'll even be judged on how we treat others. You just disproved your own argument, if we are FORCED to do one thing over another by penalty of eternal death if we do not comply, that very much IS expecting one way of living above any others. There's no way around it. |
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God gave no "command" to love. You can not command anyone to love or really command anyone to do anything. God tells us, informs us of what he wishes. It is our choice to obey or not. Therefore if one does remain dead eternally, it is there own fault, not God's. Choices my friend, choices. Even though God has the final say in who lives or dies.......it's like saying that a murderer who demands something or he shoots isn't responsible because the victim had a choice to obey and chose not to. That wouldn't work and neither does this. |
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except for the fact that he knowingly does this and then yet expects ONE way of living above all others despite stacking the deck against that, and punishing in a way no human ever would.......in a way where you CANNOT learn anything because you are left dead eternally. Not a God I choose to worship who will act in that type of way. No, God doesn't expect ONE way of living above all others, nor has he stacked anything against us. God has told us to live a loving life, that's it. All the different rules/laws or whatever circle around being a loving person, heck we'll even be judged on how we treat others. You just disproved your own argument, if we are FORCED to do one thing over another by penalty of eternal death if we do not comply, that very much IS expecting one way of living above any others. There's no way around it. Sorry Kleisto, but you still don't seem to be getting what I'm saying. What you do from when you were born can not earn you eternal death. That is why the scriptures constantly speak of the "reward" of eternal life. It is earned through faith and action. Faith comes from your heart, it is what you truly put your heart in. And the actions show this faith and or the lack there of the faith. Nobody is forcing anyone to do anything. |
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God gave no "command" to love. You can not command anyone to love or really command anyone to do anything. God tells us, informs us of what he wishes. It is our choice to obey or not. Therefore if one does remain dead eternally, it is there own fault, not God's. Choices my friend, choices. Even though God has the final say in who lives or dies.......it's like saying that a murderer who demands something or he shoots isn't responsible because the victim had a choice to obey and chose not to. That wouldn't work and neither does this. Absolutely not the same lol, you're trying to relate God to a regular person. God is the judge my friend, he is the judge of you. God created you, he has the ability to say do this or that and say not to do this or that. And God isn't just up there randomly choosing, well hmmmm, this person seems like a nice person to have around think I'll keep'em or nah I don't like that person, to the fire pits with him. No, it's not like that lol. God has told us the requirements to receive this gift he offers, it is one's own choice/responsibility to take him up on the offer or not. |
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