I think it might be "What would Jesus do"

Thomas said:



What? Now you are accusing non-believers of being racists? That is probably a stupid and hurtful remark that rises to the level of being reported to admin by the way. I wont do it but just a friendly admonishment. You probably should look up the definition of the term "racist" while you are at it.

Well one of us is right and I'm pretty sure I know which one.

Espically for Krisma and Abra.

rac⋅ism   /ˈreɪsɪzəm/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [rey-siz-uhm] Show IPA Pronunciation

–noun 1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

How do you expect to be able to "convert" people if you cant handle nor answer to their inquiries?

About 85% of what I discuss on these forums is taken from the bible itself.

I will post a passage and ask a question.

How do you expect to be able to "convert" people if you cant handle nor answer to their inquiries?

About 85% of what I discuss on these forums is taken from the bible itself.

I will post a passage and ask a question.

I am not sure what the intention of the original post was, but if that was intended to provide a definition and/or process to become saved, and to discuss it, I think the original post did a good job.

As far as the discussions in this thread, I think people are missing a very important point. Religion is based upon faith and belief, not just logic. While logic does have an important role to play in faith, logic alone can not answer the questions of religion.

For those who are complaining that Christians can not definitively prove their beliefs, they are missing the point. Religion can not exist without faith and belief. It is not up to a person of faith to scientifically prove what they believe.

Personally I would have found this thread more enlightening if it had been a discussion about becoming saved, rather than a thread debating if Christianity is the one true religion.

To the individual a few pages back who said that if I want a discussion about the different religions rituals for becoming saved, thank you for the very good advice that such discussions are better held in the Christianity forum.

It is a shame that every discussion about religion that includes any christian faith must devolve into the same boring debate that I have read over and over and over and over again.

However, it is not my place to judge, and so I will leave you all to your discussion.

Happy Holidays!

It is a shame that every discussion about religion that includes any christian faith must devolve into the same boring debate that I have read over and over and over and over again.

This is an extremely simplistic view Eljay, and it is also an extremely good example of how so many Christians can't think outside of the box they have stuck themselves.

What box is that?

It's the idea that the words in the Bible are TRUE - NO MATTER WHAT!

You see, when you say that either Jesus was telling the truth or he was a lunatic, that automatically presumes that everything that the New Testament attributed to Jesus was actually spoken by him!

This is where I vehemently disagree.

The assumption that Christians can't seem to get past is the idea that every word in the Bible is the verbatim truth. That these words were actually spoken by Jesus. Therefore only two possibilities exist. Either he was telling the truth, or he was a raving lunatic.

I don't believe either is true. There are other possibilities.

What I believe is that Jesus denounced the Old Testament. He was crucified for blaspheme, probably instigated by the Jews but possibly carried out by the Romans. Who knows? Maybe the Jews crucified him themselves without the help of the Romans and then later blamed it on the Romans. We'll never know the truth.

No one could blame the Jews for crucifying Jesus for blaspheme because the Old Testament commanded them to do precisely that. To murder heathens and blasphemists. Jesus clearly preached against things of the Old Testament (even according to the New Testament that was written later)

Jesus' teachings became popular, especially after his death which made him into a martyr. Many people were following the teachings of Jesus (which went against the orthodox religion of the day). The orthodox religion was losing it's control over people.

For a while there were just rumors about the teachings of Jesus and what he stood for. Rumors that weren't supportive of the Old Testament. So the people in authority decided to do something about it. They took the rumors of Jesus and wrote them up into the "gospels". Then they printed those gospels and denounced any accounts that were not in agreement with their written "Bible". They proclaimed it to be the "Word of God".

They used Jesus to prop up the very religion that Jesus spoke out against. All the words that you read in the New Testament that were attributed to Jesus are words that were put into the mouth of a dead man.

There is not a single solitary word in the Bible that was actually placed there by Jesus himself.

So for you to claim that he had to have been a lunatic if he wasn't God is absurd. You're just assuming that everything you read in the New Testament is a verbatim true account of every word that actually came out of the mouth of the man named Jesus. But it's extremely unlikely that this is the case.

In fact, I would personally argue that if the creator of this universe were going to bother to incarnate someone to send a message to mankind he'd have that person write the message down himself. Why would God leave it up to mortal men to write down there version of what happened decades after the fact? That alone doesn't even make any sense to me personally. If Jesus was truly God he would have written down what he wanted to say.

That makes far more sense to me.

The mere fact that all we have is hearsay is actually evidence to me that Jesus wasn't God.

I see absolutely no reason to put my faith in the authors of the New Testament. I can clearly see their motive for using Jesus to revitalize the very religion that Jesus had spoken out against!

I personally believe that Jesus actually spoke out against the violence and bigotry of the Old Testament.

There is no reason at all why I should trust the authors of the New Testament to be speaking for Jesus or put any faith in anything they have to say.

Yet you talk about the New Testament as though it's the "Gospel Truth" of every word Jesus uttered.

I don't buy that at all. I see no reason to believe that. As far as I'm concerned there are far more reason why I shouldn't believe that the New Testament is a true account of what happened. I believe that the New Testament was actually written by Jesus' enemies, not his friends.

That's my belief.

And it goes very deep for me, because I can give you a myriad of reasons why it makes absolutely no sense at all that the original God of the Old Testament would have sent Jesus to change his commands, and be a sacrificial lamb to pay for the sins of man.

None of that makes any sense to me at all. Not in the slightest.

In fact, I'd have to believe some really nasty things about God to accept the biblical story in it's entirety.

The idea that Jesus preached against the Old Testament, was crucified for blaspheme, and then used as a dead marionette doll to prop up the failing religion, makes perfect sense to me. So as far as I'm concerned, that's far more likely what actually happened. I see absolutely no reason to believe otherwise.

Jesus was crucified twice. Once on the pole, and the second time when he was nailed to the Old Testament to prop it up.

That's my belief.

It sincerely is.


You people are actually supporting the murders of Jesus when you preach Christianity.

I think it might be "What would Jesus do"