accept the way I believe or die.

That pretty much covers all religions.

There is no mercy. There is no forgiveness. There is no tolerance. There is no love.

It is all just crap. I am far better off without any of it.

I love being a heathen infidel. I can get along with everyone equally and I ain't gonna get cornholed into someone elses vision of heaven/hell.

(unless I am missing something)

Oh but you are incorrect.

Matthew 7

1Judge not, that ye be not judged.

2For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.


So with that, if an individual judges you to be no good and that you will not enter into the kingdom of Heaven for doing whatever it is in question... guess what their judgement will then be.

We are all the same, believers, non-believers, we're all in the same boat. No one is greater then the other. We all make mistakes or bad choices. Not one of us has the right to say one is lesser then the other or "in the wrong" for their choice of belief.

It is not accept my belief or die, for they know not if that person will die or not, for they do not have the right to make that judgement. Live and let live. Give the information, it is up to that person to choose to believe or not. And it makes no difference on a personal level if they choose to believe or not, it is their choice, their decision. Again, doesn't make them any lesser or greater of a person.

thats nice you don't think bad of Jesus, but that is not my point. if you were to say something bad about him, nobody here would send out a goon squad to kill you. if someone here was to say anything about mohammed, the clerics in Islam would send the goons out to kill them. i realize that not Muslims are not the same, but their is a lot of radical muslims that would do it. can you tell me why this is a practice in Islam?

if someone insult muhammad the reacation of all will be same. To kill the person who insult muhammad its duty of muslam. And not only muhammad , being a muslim its my duty if someone insult jesus, muses or other messenger, its my duaty to cut up the tungue of this person. Have you seen any muslim who insult jesus or muses. This is the huge difference.

You people blame muslim lack of tolerance, after 9/2/11, the tolerance graph decrease in both side not only in muslim. And wht non muslim doing in. Iraq. Iran, libya, afganistan, kashmir and palisten, muslim dont hate jew or christian but this is the reacation of muslim. Every action have reacation.
And i give you a example how non muslim hate MUHAMMAD. once camroon menter ( the embassador of USA in pakistan) deleverd a lecture in my university i was also presnt in his lecture. He reply on a question, WE DONT GIVE SCHOLLARSHIP TO ANY STUDENT. HIS NAME IS MUHAMMAD OR MUHAMMAD WORD PRESENT IN HIS NAME.
you are blaming here musslim hate christian and jew. So what it.

if someone insult muhammad the reacation of all will be same. To kill the person who insult muhammad its duty of muslam. And not only muhammad , being a muslim its my duty if someone insult jesus, muses or other messenger, its my duaty to cut up the tungue of this person. Have you seen any muslim who insult jesus or muses. This is the huge difference.



BUT YOU SEEM TO KEEP ON DODGING THE BIG QUESTIONS. All you do is go on about disrespecting Mohammad and respecting Mohammad. I could care a rat's *** less about Jesus. Good for you yo work with other people of other faiths. BUT WHAT ABOUT SOME OF TH CRAP YOUR FAITH TEACHES? BTW Mohammad IS a false Shepherd! Maybe that is my opinion but the way I see it he is leading Gods own astray with his hate filled teachings. What Justifies a 'holy war' against all not of Islam? You sure seem to not want to answer that one. You defend Islam, Well, defend it properly! But if you cannot in your own heart answer these questions to your own personal satisfaction let alone mine we will never have consensus because YOU CANNOT GET PAST YOUR OWN RELIGIOUS TEACHINGS ENOUGH TO SEE ER IS ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW AND FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE SOME OF US DO HAVE REASON TO a) SEE ISLAM AS A RADICAL FAITH AND b) BY ITS OWN WORDS THREATENS OUR VERY EXISTENCE. Please tell me all those Christians in Egypt were attacked because they some how managed to piss off Islamics who wanted them to convert and they refused. Oh no, I bet you will tell me the unprovoked attacks were provoked by Christians attacking first? How can you honestly tell anyone else your faith is nor radical? Maybe not surrounded by other who believe the same lies.

So tell me, WHAT JUSTIFIES A HOLY WAR AGAINST THOSE WHO DO NOT FOLLOW ISLAM? "God Commands you?" Really? God never told me to make war on Islam or anyone else. So now you want to defend a pedophile. What else do you call someone who has sex with prepubescent girls? I could care less if he was married to her. My ROMAN forefathers were depraved but even they viewed sex with Children to be unacceptable. Granted in Classic Civilization children had marriages arranged for them at five and they were married at twelve and expected to have children by fifteen but NINE YEARS OLD? Essentially what you are saying is if you had a daughter someone as old as me could buy her from you at six years old and be screwing her at nine. Would you really see that as permissible? So how does conduct like that become acceptable? And Muslims who insult Jesus? I have seen them before here in the USA. They don't last long here.

And here you say you have a duty to cut the tongue from the person who insults Mohammad. I could say in the same breath if I were to become judge of man it would be my duty to cut the tongue of every man who cast a lie in the name of God. I would be VERY busy and no one would have a tongue save a rare few who truly are saintly. they are out there. I see the goodness of man outside of religion every day. You too would probably have a more fulfilling life if you could see past the lies you are being taught.

Besides, it says in the Quaran to be polite to the infidel until Islam is strong enough to strike at him within his own land. Can't remember EXACTLY where it says that but I am sure some conscientious reader here will find it for me! Why, BECAUSE WE ARE TRYING TO SHOW YOU THE OTHER PERSPECTIVE! So why not tell me why I should not fear Islam being an INFIDEL? I mean before all of us and GOD ABOVE AND NOT THE CHRISTIAN GOD speak the truth. I got money on you can't.

MAYBE THE REASON MANY MUSLIMS REBUKED THE 9/11 ATTACKS WAS THEY ARE BEGINNING TO SEE THE HYPOCRISY AND PARADOXICAL LIES OF ISLAM! It is the same thing as any Christian finding the paradox and hypocrisy in Christianity. St. Thomas Aquinus was a lecherous perverted alcoholic who had a penchant for theology and philosophy. But for all his pretty rhetoric the Catholic Church uses so much to justify "THEIR" God after studying critical reasoning I found his writing to be fallacious cyclical arguments to justify something there is no tangible evidence to support the existence of.

So how about it, what gives me reason to fear from your own faith? Do you take me for an illiterate? Translated Quarans exist here too. Please educate me here...

Am not judging....just saying what i saw....in nigeria,the muslim group are really bombing everywhere....they say they are "boko harams"...Enjoys killing people

BUT YOU SEEM TO KEEP ON DODGING THE BIG QUESTIONS. All you do is go on about disrespecting Mohammad and respecting Mohammad. I could care a rat's *** less about Jesus. Good for you yo work with other people of other faiths. BUT WHAT ABOUT SOME OF TH CRAP YOUR FAITH TEACHES? BTW Mohammad IS a false Shepherd! Maybe that is my opinion but the way I see it he is leading Gods own astray with his hate filled teachings. What Justifies a 'holy war' against all not of Islam? You sure seem to not want to answer that one. You defend Islam, Well, defend it properly! But if you cannot in your own heart answer these questions to your own personal satisfaction let alone mine we will never have consensus because YOU CANNOT GET PAST YOUR OWN RELIGIOUS TEACHINGS ENOUGH TO SEE ER IS ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW AND FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE SOME OF US DO HAVE REASON TO a) SEE ISLAM AS A RADICAL FAITH AND b) BY ITS OWN WORDS THREATENS OUR VERY EXISTENCE. Please tell me all those Christians in Egypt were attacked because they some how managed to piss off Islamics who wanted them to convert and they refused. Oh no, I bet you will tell me the unprovoked attacks were provoked by Christians attacking first? How can you honestly tell anyone else your faith is nor radical? Maybe not surrounded by other who believe the same lies.

So tell me, WHAT JUSTIFIES A HOLY WAR AGAINST THOSE WHO DO NOT FOLLOW ISLAM? "God Commands you?" Really? God never told me to make war on Islam or anyone else. So now you want to defend a pedophile. What else do you call someone who has sex with prepubescent girls? I could care less if he was married to her. My ROMAN forefathers were depraved but even they viewed sex with Children to be unacceptable. Granted in Classic Civilization children had marriages arranged for them at five and they were married at twelve and expected to have children by fifteen but NINE YEARS OLD? Essentially what you are saying is if you had a daughter someone as old as me could buy her from you at six years old and be screwing her at nine. Would you really see that as permissible? So how does conduct like that become acceptable? And Muslims who insult Jesus? I have seen them before here in the USA. They don't last long here.

And here you say you have a duty to cut the tongue from the person who insults Mohammad. I could say in the same breath if I were to become judge of man it would be my duty to cut the tongue of every man who cast a lie in the name of God. I would be VERY busy and no one would have a tongue save a rare few who truly are saintly. they are out there. I see the goodness of man outside of religion every day. You too would probably have a more fulfilling life if you could see past the lies you are being taught.

Besides, it says in the Quaran to be polite to the infidel until Islam is strong enough to strike at him within his own land. Can't remember EXACTLY where it says that but I am sure some conscientious reader here will find it for me! Why, BECAUSE WE ARE TRYING TO SHOW YOU THE OTHER PERSPECTIVE! So why not tell me why I should not fear Islam being an INFIDEL? I mean before all of us and GOD ABOVE AND NOT THE CHRISTIAN GOD speak the truth. I got money on you can't.

war in islam. Islam order to screw such type doggggy like you. If quran is fall book and bibile is true, come to pritical life stop your hypothesis and accept my challenge.

First i am asking from you, is your country count you in human population, islam order to screw sucha duggy like you. You say i have seen the muslim who insult jesus, when some one debate a rabid pigiii like you, he will also be gonna crazy Stop your shitty statment. Please accept my challange. And show me that i am wrong. If you claming that i am wrong so why you not accept my challange. Common baby dont be rabid accept my challange and show to the word that quran is fals book.

these are not muslim. They are spot on islam . no space for sucha type dog in islam.

BUT YOU SEEM TO KEEP ON DODGING THE BIG QUESTIONS. All you do is go on about disrespecting Mohammad and respecting Mohammad. I could care a rat's *** less about Jesus. Good for you yo work with other people of other faiths. BUT WHAT ABOUT SOME OF TH CRAP YOUR FAITH TEACHES? BTW Mohammad IS a false Shepherd! Maybe that is my opinion but the way I see it he is leading Gods own astray with his hate filled teachings. What Justifies a 'holy war' against all not of Islam? You sure seem to not want to answer that one. You defend Islam, Well, defend it properly! But if you cannot in your own heart answer these questions to your own personal satisfaction let alone mine we will never have consensus because YOU CANNOT GET PAST YOUR OWN RELIGIOUS TEACHINGS ENOUGH TO SEE ER IS ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW AND FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE SOME OF US DO HAVE REASON TO a) SEE ISLAM AS A RADICAL FAITH AND b) BY ITS OWN WORDS THREATENS OUR VERY EXISTENCE. Please tell me all those Christians in Egypt were attacked because they some how managed to piss off Islamics who wanted them to convert and they refused. Oh no, I bet you will tell me the unprovoked attacks were provoked by Christians attacking first? How can you honestly tell anyone else your faith is nor radical? Maybe not surrounded by other who believe the same lies.

So tell me, WHAT JUSTIFIES A HOLY WAR AGAINST THOSE WHO DO NOT FOLLOW ISLAM? "God Commands you?" Really? God never told me to make war on Islam or anyone else. So now you want to defend a pedophile. What else do you call someone who has sex with prepubescent girls? I could care less if he was married to her. My ROMAN forefathers were depraved but even they viewed sex with Children to be unacceptable. Granted in Classic Civilization children had marriages arranged for them at five and they were married at twelve and expected to have children by fifteen but NINE YEARS OLD? Essentially what you are saying is if you had a daughter someone as old as me could buy her from you at six years old and be screwing her at nine. Would you really see that as permissible? So how does conduct like that become acceptable? And Muslims who insult Jesus? I have seen them before here in the USA. They don't last long here.

And here you say you have a duty to cut the tongue from the person who insults Mohammad. I could say in the same breath if I were to become judge of man it would be my duty to cut the tongue of every man who cast a lie in the name of God. I would be VERY busy and no one would have a tongue save a rare few who truly are saintly. they are out there. I see the goodness of man outside of religion every day. You too would probably have a more fulfilling life if you could see past the lies you are being taught.

Besides, it says in the Quaran to be polite to the infidel until Islam is strong enough to strike at him within his own land. Can't remember EXACTLY where it says that but I am sure some conscientious reader here will find it for me! Why, BECAUSE WE ARE TRYING TO SHOW YOU THE OTHER PERSPECTIVE! So why not tell me why I should not fear Islam being an INFIDEL? I mean before all of us and GOD ABOVE AND NOT THE CHRISTIAN GOD speak the truth. I got money on you can't.
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Andy ... You based this entire diatribe upon a false premise.

You stated that the Prophet Mohammad lead people astray.
He did not.

Men did by intrepreting his Word with their vain imaginings.

Much the same as do Christian Ministers that hold out the plate for the Poor yet preach words of hate.

Mohammad is not at fault (he was raised up by God).

God is not at fault...

Men are.

I will also challenge you... Not to prove one or the other religion...

Rather to rise above the hatred that has descended upon both...

and find God.

I will accept that yes indeed like the bible a council mad the final interpretation. So yes my premise is flawed in that way. But my premise of Muhammad being deified is not. You place ANYONE above God and you are committing a sin. And to justify violence to defend Muhammad? PLEASE, dude has been dead how long??? Oh that's right, he ascended into heaven. But when a man speaks and others twist his words he lead others astray. Why? That man didn't insure his words and teachings were not perverted. No man can foresee their actions in the future. If Jesus was all that he would have seen the deaths of millions in his name and forsook the crucifixion. Then God would have pissed on him like God did Lucifer for disagreeing with God. Prophets are nothing more than men. When they become Holy Symbols is when problems begin. Heck, offered the choice between the Ten Commandments of Moses and the Two Jesus gave Christianity and the world they always fall back on the ten, not the two.

But I still want to know what justifies harming Infidels when they are no threat to Islam???? Notice how I never get an answer to this???

You claim this to be a debate??? God you are making a joke here are you not??? Insults and ad hominums? I am not going to accept your challenge because you cannot answer my SIMPLE QUESTIONS? When a book promotes violence against others in the name of god it is a lie. I READ THE QUARAN ALREADY! I need to do it again so I can show you exactly where it spells out how to deal with people not accepting your faith??? You think groups like Al Quieda, the Taliban, Boko Haram, Hamas, the government of Iran, are just a spot on Iran when they embrace the most fundamental of the teachings of the Quaran? So you want to call me a dog? I am not going there. Why? Because I am bigger than your religious zealotry. You DARE call me a Hypocrite when I read your Quaran? Easy to find it online. PROVE TO ME WHY I HAVE NO REASON TO FEAR ISLAM!!! NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND! You want to debate, bring it on! I can chapter and verse you all week long. I have taken on Christians with a much bigger bark that you got bite and I leave them looking like total idiots. Why? I GREW UP STUDYING THE BIBLE. I was taught to ask questions. I did not like the lack of answers I got. And do I get answers here?

All I get is "Accept my challenge and memorize a Quaran."

NO! I know my challenge requires way too much thought on your behalf to answer ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU KNOW TE REAL ANSWER PROVES WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN TO BE FALSE TEACHINGS!.

Suddenly things got real quiet here...

Do I hear pages shuffling? I am so waiting to see the Paraphrasing coming!

Oddly my arguments stem from what I read, not what I feel. And then actions are speaking to me louder than words. I can see direct parallels of Modern day Islam to Medieval Europe. Take ANY Islamic nation and look at what you will find. Poverty, backwardness, and ignorance due to a serious lack of a real education punctuated by ostentatious opulence and grandeur only in key cities and Mosques ONLY. Evil religious leaders who convince others to do their bidding in the name of their idea of God. A faith based on "Obey us or die." Theology run states and nations. Religious leaders living in the excess of the faithful. And of course all the factional infighting.

Sadly not all of what Islam preaches is bad. Like I have said on other posts the truth can be found in pieces among other teachings. There are some valid lessons and moralities but then it is all turned on itself with the hate, misogyny, and demand for utter compliance. Islam needs to turn away from the Quaran and adopt a more tolerant stance all around. Even Christianity tries to color education to favor them. Its always an Us or hem thing I despise.

A truly civilized religion is one where the faithful can sit among others of different faiths, argue with each other and still be friends. Not religions that "follow me or die," or be "beaten down" or Hurt, crushed, killed ,maimed, raped by a donkey, etc. A civilized faith does allow questions to be asked in the name of enlightenment and NOT being hypocritical. This is the GREATEST weakness of the Catholic Church and NOTHING will convince them otherwise! It also will eventually be what kills Islam. You cannot make curious people stay in the darkness of God's ignorance. And when the truth comes out those false Shepherd will find a bell tolling for them. Till then it is "I'm Right, Don't insult (or question) our prophet or I kill you," and "you don't know what you are talking about." So I should Ignore the words of Saudi Immigrants who are Christian who actually SPIT on the mention of Muhammad's name? How about Syrians who say Democracy is not for Arabs? How about Afghans I have met who are baffled why we even waste our time in Afghanistan.

Am I to believe that when Egypt ousted Mubarak that all the Coptic Christians "STARTED" a fight with the local Islamic population? And how could celebrating church services incite the burnings and attacks upon Christians in Indonesia? And in Nigeria, all that violence aimed at Christians by a group who's own name is "Western Knowledge Is BAD!" (Boko Haram) Not to mention other nations having to deal with Islamics like India, Russia, France, England, and even Trinidad and Tobago recently had a number of arrests in connection to a crime wave they had and it was confirmed Islamic militants that were captured. After their capture the bank robberies and car thefts stopped. Gee, I wonder why?

I want to know why I should not fear Islam. I want GOOD SOLID ANSWERS! I want to know why the Quaran says it is justified for me to be harmed when I have harmed no one just because I will not kiss God's (Allah's) a@@. That is the WORDS OF ISLAM'S BOOK AND ISLAM'S PROPHET! I am supposed to respect someone who threatens me??? Why??? God will judge me??? And you are who to speak for God???










Man the silence is deafening.

And I said it before. I am not out to convert anyone to anything or any faith. But I will speak up when I see a lie and saying Islam is not radical is a lie! AND THAT ALSO IS A COMMAND OF MUHAMMAD. LIE TO INFIDELS!

Anyone want to call me a liar here? Shall I get the chapter and verse from a Quaran for this???

Come on muslims, lets debate here! Only one person had the fortitude to point out a fallacy of mine. And that person was right! But on average I can back what I say and ask! So why is it Islamics can't argue the fine points of their faiths? Much for the same reasons that Catholics can't. They have no clue what or who they are worshiping! THAT IS FALSE SHEPHERDING!!! Leading people blindly and keeping them blind!

AdventureBegins... Sometimes it takes others to see our mistakes that we must correct. You caught one.

Notions of culture and human rights have a totally different dimension when we talk about an Islamic state,especially when we discussing about religion.We are each other quickly finde *your religion are full of violence*etc.Everthing couse most people have prejudice,and the majority of comments I can say,that many wrongly perceive their faith and then what to say to the other..Many confuse the faith with the traditions of culture they come from it is not same-custom and religion,but they are associated.I see by the comments that many political events mention-it is wrong..Now you reminds me-like-of U.S. government, which wants at all costs to impose "democracy" and that by those standards that they believe that others will respond.,forgetting that the message of God-love, forgiveness,respect for others.fanatics in any religion they must not have places and voice

If you really think that they did done Islamic terrorists-your brains are washed very well-I, as a Christian Orthodox faith,I never believed in it.

I have studied other faiths. Orthodox Christianity practices pseudo Judaic traditions mated to Christian beliefs. It would be considered in some circles a more fundamental form of Christianity. I grew up Lutheran but received a good Catholic High School education. But in time I likewise read a Qur-an, I have read a Book of Mormon, and likewise have had opportunities to read and talk to people who are of many other faith practices. I like to know what the other guy is thinking so to speak.

Now when it comes to people from Pakistan it is not the people who I have issue with. It is their religious beliefs I have issue with. When a faith preaches Holy War of any kind that is a religion not to be trusted. When it makes lying acceptable it is a lie unto itself. When it preaches "Conform or be punished" it is wrong. Any religion based on these ideals including a lot of Christianity fall prey to their own sins of deceit. Pakistan's biggest problem is there are three ideals of Islam all out to dominate the others. This is indicative of many Islamic nations like Egypt!

But if you want to see REAL terrorists at work turn on the news!

As in the media are the ultimate terrorists! Look at how much fear teh news sells.

Any religion itself is not a bad thing, but the problem lies when man starts deciding what god wants, and starts to speak for him... nobody knows what any god wants, and i don't know of any god that wants war or people killing in their name... even if islam is not terroristic by nature, there are over a billion followers, and if 10% are terrorists, that leaves 100 million terrorists killing in the name of god...

dang,those Copts must be suicidal if they went to do that!