and who did i say was wrong?

ok, sure.. whatever you say

I was talking about in general. Next time I see it, I'll let you know, as I'm not digging back through posts at this time.

But really, why even bother to mention your beliefs on here if you're unwilling to discuss them and just complain when people ask about them?

it's not a discussion anymore, just some arguments now... do you want to argue? if you want, we can... what do you want to argue about?

its a personal choice to eat cookies all day, but its not healthy

its a personal choice to litter, but its not healthy

its a personal choice to be naked in public,but its disruptive

,,there are plenty of choices that are personal that have long term consequences for more than the 'person' involved

suicide is a 'personal' choice, but I wouldnt want the government giving its 'support' to it either,,,,

and finding who it is that would decide WHICH personal choices were truly only personal would be a task in itself

if the terms 'right' and 'wrong' are so troublesome to people, shoudl we discard 'healthy' and 'unhealthy' too,, and just let people do whatever they choose with their bodies without 'judgment'?

anyway, Im adjusting to the reality that this is the direction our 'world' is turning,,,

I am sure, that similar to the idea of mothers working,,,as great and 'equal' as that seemed in the moment,,

it caught on to be so popular that it almost became 'inferior' to suggest as a woman that you didnt want to work outside the home, or that you wanted a man to support you


it became more Human and evolved and smart and mature to be an 'independent' woman , even in a marriage where two are supposed to lean upon each other and be a mirror for the lives they bring into the world


now , it has turned to where women usually HAVE to work to support their families, the men dont take their role nearly as serious because they are no longer 'necessary' and more and more children grow up in fatherless homes which statistics show are at higher risk for nearly every social ill we can imagine

but this is all worth it for the 'equality' we gained,, I guess

anyhow,
there will come a time when people will look back and wonder how 'great' an idea it ended up being for our families and our communities

I wont support it, but Im not gonna worry about it either,, we all learn in due time,,,,

Those examples don't work for different reasons, if someone loves another person who loves them back, and wants to be with them forever, how is it harmful to allow them that? It's not.

I will say though, I do sort of wonder if we are focusing on the wrong thing with this though the more I think about it. That meaning that.....we should be focusing more on why the government is involved in marriages and relationships at all, than who is allowed it or who isn't. Cause honestly......they don't have any business in it either way, gay or straight.

Hmm. You're comparing same sex marriage to eating cookies, littering, being naked in public and suicide? And the issue is that you want to be able to tell people what they can't do because you find it unhealthy?

"we should be focusing more on why the government is involved in marriages and relationships at all, than who is allowed it or who isn't. Cause honestly......they don't have any business in it either way, gay or straight."

I wrote that 12 pages ago.

mh, the government does not exist to determine what is right and wrong, healthy and unhealthy. at least not in america. "we the people" did not give the government the authority to determine right and wrong, we gave it the authority to determine what is legal and what is illegal but we placed severe ristrictions on the laws they make with the concept of equal due process of law firmly entrenched in the fifth and fourteenth amendments. of course the government should not support suicide but laws prohibiting suicide prohibit it for all people eaually. nobody is asking that the government support gay marraige any more than the government supports a marriage between man and woman. the government does not support marriage between man and woman, it LEGALIZES marriage between man and woman so the government is bound by EQUAL DUE PROCESS OF LAW to legalize marriage for gays as well. personally i think the institution of marriage needs a major overhaul in this country leaning more toward the legal aspects that protect all parties than the so called unbreakable vows that are prevelant but that's an entirely different topic. i see this topic as not unlike equal right to vote regardless of sex or race or religion or anything else whether personal choice or not. and of course nobody has proven that homosexuality is a personal choice anyway have they?

Yup I agree, democracy at work.

So?



These are both illegal in most places.




Then they aren't personal choices. If your decisions directly effect other people, then they are by definition not personal.



Suicide is bad for the society as a whole and therefore an undesirable behavior, which rightfully should be illegal.



Exactly, so let everyone make their own decisions.



Yes, that's exactly what we should do.

The government is involved because of things like taxes if you are a couple. If the state defines marriage "with the benefits as male and female couples" then that is the states right. They don't say gay people can't live together or do w/e. It just says that they can't legally be joined.

That being said they want marriage rights for all the legal stuff. So you can't tell the state to stay out of it if what they are wanting from the marriage comes from the state.

huh... i thought they wanted benefits from the government, but don't want the government involved?...kinda wierd, dontcha think?

I understand all that, but really the state has no business being a part of a personal relationship.

I'm not even saying they don't deserve the same benefits, but just that.......maybe this could be looked at another way too, as to why we are allowing the state entry into our relationships to start with.

I disagree with that, that is still a personal choice, and it doesn't sit right with me that a person who may try to kill themselves unsuccessfully is gonna be jailed or whatever the case may be for doing it. Yeah THAT'S gonna help them......not.

because the state and government controls the laws that hand out the benefits, i suppose... from what i understand, all states have a law that gives beneifits to non married couples that live together, the same as being married... texas, for example, will not recognize a same sex marriage, but will hand out benefits to same sex couples that have been living together

I like that idea, the benefits part anyway.

As for the first part, still don't like it.