Community > General Religion Chat

Topic: The THEORY of Evolution.
Untamed Joined Sat 01/05/08 Posts: 126	Mon 01/21/08 05:26 PM
Umm, where do you get this info? Much of it is false, for example Neanderthaul was not an arthritic old man. Neanderthaul, though not a human ancestor, was a very robust and strong species who had several remains discovered. We have more than one. Lucy, you're right, everybody agrees she was a chimp, a BI PEDAL CHIMP, in other words a chimp with our pelvis designed for walking upright. Remember, a theory is more than an educated guess, I think your definition of theory is really a hypothisis, evolution is a true scientific theory;^] I really don't want to get into this stuff, but we don't have Lucy's pelvis. We have one hip bone and a fragment of the sacral area of the pelvis. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/7951/lucy.jpg Here is an article about Oliver, a bi-pedial chimp who was once believed to be a human-chimp hybrid or even a missing link. After DNA testing, it was confirmed that he was simply a weird looking chimp. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_(chimpanzee) Now let's assume that we had enough of Lucy's skeleton to say that she was bi-pedial. That's an assumption, since we don't have enough of it's (we can't even prove the gender) skeleton to determine conclusively if it was a biped. But assuming that we could confirm that Lucy was a female and was a biped, how do we know that Lucy didn't have the same deformities that Oliver had? Is it unreasonable to assume that Lucy could be deformed just like Oliver is deformed? I guess it all comes down to what you are willing to accept at faith. bolded is my emphasis. Wow, whats that? speculation again? Just like the scientifically built 'missing link' from a tooth?

Bearsman Joined Fri 10/05/07 Posts: 318	Mon 01/21/08 05:29 PM
Big J, Did you say male violence? Anarchrist

Big_Jim Joined Tue 01/15/08 Posts: 373	Mon 01/21/08 05:30 PM
CREATION IS CRAP! EVOLUTION IS CRAP! I am fully aware of my unhelpfulness. Maybe you guys should fight to the death on this matter?

Untamed Joined Sat 01/05/08 Posts: 126	Mon 01/21/08 05:31 PM
We have witnessed the selective process in our time. So your "theory" is off by a long shot. We indeed did evolve. And we will continue to evolve. Our lifetimes are but micromilliseconds in the time on this planet. If you are going to say that creationism, or incestuous beginning of man is more a reality, I will beg to differ with you. Spare me that nonsense nessie. give me ONE missing link. Why is it that we are supposedly have gone from simple to complex, yet when scientists find PROTOZOA on HIGHER levels of "millions of years of rock" and LARGE ANIMALS in the lower levels???? Shouldnt it be the otherway around since if you go from simple to complex; you also get BIGGER; after all that IS the idea of "evolution". Not to mention that through these "millions of years of rock" we see TREES LYING VERTICALLY THROUGH THESE "millions of years of rock"?? Why is it that these trees are JUST as preserved at the TOP as at the BOTTOM?? Shouldnt the bottom be in LESS condition since its at an "older" level of rock???

toastedoranges Joined Thu 01/03/08 Posts: 11042	Mon 01/21/08 05:31 PM
bolded is my emphasis. Wow, whats that? speculation again? Just like the scientifically built 'missing link' from a tooth? this is what i find funny. religious folk getting all uppity over speculation with actual evidence before them, while all they have is blind faith

Big_Jim Joined Tue 01/15/08 Posts: 373	Mon 01/21/08 05:32 PM
Big J, Did you say male violence? Anarchrist HAHA! You... I am gonna have to watch you... What's this dark side you have been talking about, please tell me it's not "...of the force."

Bearsman Joined Fri 10/05/07 Posts: 318	Mon 01/21/08 05:32 PM
Do we get to use light sabers.....huh, huh, huh, huh, huh?

Big_Jim Joined Tue 01/15/08 Posts: 373	Mon 01/21/08 05:35 PM Edited by Big_Jim on Mon 01/21/08 05:40 PM
Do we get to use light sabers.....huh, huh, huh, huh, huh? LMFAO! Love the picture. Back to the matter at hand, you come, Lord Vader.

Big_Jim Joined Tue 01/15/08 Posts: 373	Mon 01/21/08 05:38 PM Edited by Big_Jim on Mon 01/21/08 05:39 PM
bleh

Untamed Joined Sat 01/05/08 Posts: 126	Mon 01/21/08 05:40 PM
Creationists and other brands of 'believers' insist on holding this false debate about 'evolution' on the foundation of competing 'beliefs' or 'faith'!!! Other brands of 'believers', meaning those whom collapse 'reality' and a word for word interpretation of the bible, as one and the same. Through a very particular spriritual phenomenon known as revelation, some become convinced of a particular 'revealed' truth. That is what is referred to as a belief. Such a 'revealed' truth, or belief, deals with collapsing the word for word meaning of a book, as the word of 'god'. That is a revealed belief, and people are free to beleive such revelations. Regardless of the belief in the end, it remains what it is: A 'REVELATION BASED BELIEF'. Based on the intangible. Based on faith. Faith, revelations and emerging beliefs, do not belong to the 'material', physical, or factual domain. Faith, revelations, and beliefs cannot be proven, nor can they be demonstrated to be scientifically true. If they were, think of it for a moment, THEY NO LONGER WOULD BE BELIEFS, ... THEY WOULD BE HARD FACTS!!! On the opposite side of the spectrum, facts never require FAITH, nor do they require any form of REVELATIONS to be demonstrated!!! Moreover, anyone presenting as a fact, something which was based on some sort of revelation, would see this alledged 'fact' relegated to domain of belief, and religious practice. No need to feel offended!!! Facts cannot attack religious beliefs, and religious beliefs cannot attack facts. There are no common denominators to connect the two domains. No amount of insinstance on the part of false phophets claiming that their beliefs are 'facts', will change this possible god given reality, that 'evolution' will never be a matter of faith, and creationism will never be a matter of fact nor science. The confusion between fact and belief, religion and science, was possibly legitimate and excusable throughout the 'dark ages'; lack of education, lack of information, etc. In 2007, confusion is no longer possible. To insist on perverting faith into fact, and and fact into faith is downright dishonest, and litterally laced with 'BAD FAITH'. Seriously. In order for evolution to be true you will need to have (emphasis on HAVE) actual MISSING LINKS. But you dont. When ever some scientist comes along with an idea of HOW X could have evolved its almost always stated as "this explains how X could" COULD. SPECULATION taken as TRUTH. What does THAT say about the scientific approach of tested until VALID? EVen if you DID find something that could be credible as a 'missing link', in order for it to be UNDENIABLE this what would have to be presented: Monkey - Us. Monkey -(credible missing link) - Us : this missing link ALONE will NOT be enough to prove that we have come from simple, to more complex. hence it would have to repeat[/] TWICE again: Monk (NEW credible missing link [A]) - Original credible missing link - (ANOTHRE NEW credible missing link ) - Us. And the process of finding Links between links will go on and on until it is UNDENIABLE that we evolved.

Untamed Joined Sat 01/05/08 Posts: 126	Mon 01/21/08 05:41 PM
bolded is my emphasis. Wow, whats that? speculation again? Just like the scientifically built 'missing link' from a tooth? this is what i find funny. religious folk getting all uppity over speculation with actual evidence before them, while all they have is blind faith SHOW ME this evidence!!

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 01/21/08 05:42 PM
We have witnessed the selective process in our time. So your "theory" is off by a long shot. We indeed did evolve. And we will continue to evolve. Our lifetimes are but micromilliseconds in the time on this planet. If you are going to say that creationism, or incestuous beginning of man is more a reality, I will beg to differ with you. Spare me that nonsense nessie. give me ONE missing link. Why is it that we are supposedly have gone from simple to complex, yet when scientists find PROTOZOA on HIGHER levels of "millions of years of rock" and LARGE ANIMALS in the lower levels???? Shouldnt it be the otherway around since if you go from simple to complex; you also get BIGGER; after all that IS the idea of "evolution". Not to mention that through these "millions of years of rock" we see TREES LYING VERTICALLY THROUGH THESE "millions of years of rock"?? Why is it that these trees are JUST as preserved at the TOP as at the BOTTOM?? Shouldnt the bottom be in LESS condition since its at an "older" level of rock??? I can see that your understanding is limited by your own limitation that you impose upon yourself. Open your mind a little more there. All you have to do is reread what you write to see it. I can see it. Can you?

toastedoranges Joined Thu 01/03/08 Posts: 11042	Mon 01/21/08 05:43 PM
I can see that your understanding is limited by your own limitation that you impose upon yourself. Open your mind a little more there. All you have to do is reread what you write to see it. I can see it. Can you?

voileazur Joined Sun 03/11/07 Posts: 2140	Mon 01/21/08 05:48 PM
Why is it that we are supposedly have gone from simple to complex, yet when scientists find PROTOZOA on HIGHER levels of "millions of years of rock" and LARGE ANIMALS in the lower levels???? Shouldnt it be the otherway around since if you go from simple to complex; you also get BIGGER; after all that IS the idea of "evolution". Not to mention that through these "millions of years of rock" we see TREES LYING VERTICALLY THROUGH THESE "millions of years of rock"?? Why is it that these trees are JUST as preserved at the TOP as at the BOTTOM?? Shouldnt the bottom be in LESS condition since its at an "older" level of rock??? You're right Untamed, pre-suppositionist, apologetics, bible inerrancy is so much simpler than true research, where on the contrary we always have to let go of our 'prejudices' and 'pre-suppossitions'!!! Put me down for the great flood, the garden of Eden, Adam in god's image, and the fabrication of Eve out of a 'rib' from Adam's thorax... It's so much simpler this way!!! Thanks!

Bearsman Joined Fri 10/05/07 Posts: 318	Mon 01/21/08 05:49 PM
The truth is where you find it. Everybody wants to know their creator. That is the essense of our mind. In my mind I seek to be wanted and loved. We humans trive on love. Seek out the people with troubled lives and you will find that the commonality is this essential lack of love. All you scientist out there, do the research on babies without nurturing. That would include most speicies of warm blooded animals. I believe in this next writing from Corinthians 13:1-13 4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. 11When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. 12Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. 13And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love. God is Love. Let us not forget. Bearsman in earnest

Untamed Joined Sat 01/05/08 Posts: 126	Mon 01/21/08 05:55 PM
Why is it that we are supposedly have gone from simple to complex, yet when scientists find PROTOZOA on HIGHER levels of "millions of years of rock" and LARGE ANIMALS in the lower levels???? Shouldnt it be the otherway around since if you go from simple to complex; you also get BIGGER; after all that IS the idea of "evolution". Not to mention that through these "millions of years of rock" we see TREES LYING VERTICALLY THROUGH THESE "millions of years of rock"?? Why is it that these trees are JUST as preserved at the TOP as at the BOTTOM?? Shouldnt the bottom be in LESS condition since its at an "older" level of rock??? You're right Untamed, pre-suppositionist, apologetics, bible inerrancy is so much simpler than true research, where on the contrary we always have to let go of our 'prejudices' and 'pre-suppossitions'!!! Put me down for the great flood, the garden of Eden, Adam in god's image, and the fabrication of Eve out of a 'rib' from Adam's thorax... It's so much simpler this way!!! Thanks! Read "Bone of contention". and prove me wrong. but you wont. I take th effort to study things like these not because Im unsure or doubting my faith. are you the same? or are you all afraid? If I am sooooooooooooo closed minded and soooooooo misled and so "brainwashed", why not take 1 hour (bone of contention is short and sweet) and put me in my place. Go ahead. I confident that you will bring excellent points.

Bearsman Joined Fri 10/05/07 Posts: 318	Mon 01/21/08 05:57 PM
Sorry. I was havin too much fun with the puns. The evidence is in............... --This poster cannot continue because we have broken both of his hands and taken him away to the monastery.-- However, he said to tell UNTAMED, "I love you, man!!" anonymous

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 01/21/08 06:04 PM Edited by Dragoness on Mon 01/21/08 06:07 PM
The truth is where you find it. Everybody wants to know their creator. That is the essense of our mind. In my mind I seek to be wanted and loved. We humans trive on love. Seek out the people with troubled lives and you will find that the commonality is this essential lack of love. All you scientist out there, do the research on babies without nurturing. That would include most speicies of warm blooded animals. I believe in this next writing from Corinthians 13:1-13 4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. 8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. 11When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. 12Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known. 13And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love. God is Love. Let us not forget. Bearsman in earnest No offense intended bear, but I just love how us "nonbelievers" have to be untouched by love to be the way we are. I am not walking around with no love in my heart. I told others on a different post about the fact once I released myself from the bonds of religion, I never felt more love, light and freedom in my heart. I have a light that shines out of me that religious people mistake for the love of god. Yet it is not. I am no "scientific zombie" walking through the world with a numbness of emptiness. I found my center of love, respect, light, etc.... When I debate this issue with others I am sharing my opinion that has freed me. Whether others will get the same experience from the information I do not know but I share anyway. In my discovery of the breaking the shackles of religion one of the most disturbing beliefs forced down my throat was the incestuous creationism. It is sick and unhealthy to believe it and teach it to children in my opinion. There are many more beliefs I freed myself from but the love I feel now surpasses any love I felt under religious teachings of judgement and oppression. One has to be the one true while all others are going to hell. The devil is the reason for the evil in the world when all I can see are evil people doing all this evil. There is no god or devil to control or influence us, we are our own makers of good and evil. I hold myself responsible for my bad and good traits. It freed me to do this. I am now free to judge myself for the person I am and I am a good person without religion. It is not my moral center, nor the determiner of morality. I am.

nuenjins Joined Mon 10/29/07 Posts: 1046	Mon 01/21/08 06:10 PM Edited by nuenjins on Mon 01/21/08 06:11 PM
If I was in charge of my own evolution, I would have definitely kept the wings. This whole retarded argument is like watching kids argue on the playground. Evolution has no solid case and anyone willing to look at the facts of DNA would have to come to that conclusion. On the other hand, I don't exspect anyone who hasn't experienced what God is for themselves to understand. That's Gods job. Why aren't we seeing mixes of DNA right now and intermitant species and different levels of man. Because there isn't any and never will be. My faith has had oodles of physically manifested and supernatural evidence, but all you weazers can say and ever have said is "good for you, if it works for you". Du-uh, a miracle slaps you in the face and you STILL deny it, how stupid can a smart man be. Cop outs. I see Abra is still fighting himself. THEY buggin you Abra?

Abracadabra Joined Thu 04/12/07 Posts: 17851	Mon 01/21/08 06:14 PM
Blood clotting just POPPED out of nowhere did it? Just like the universe? Seriously. Have you been able to answer Funches question? You think it’s silly to believe that the universe just POPPED into existence out of nowhere, but the idea that a God just POPPED into existence out of nowhere isn’t a problem. Clearly you have no ability to think deeply. Why do you feel so threatened Abra? Threatened? Don’t flatter yourself. The things you are claiming are simply absurd and totally groundless. I’m just calmly pointing out that fact. You seem to be the one who is in a real panic about evolution. You apparently see evolution as a serious threat to your religion. Like if evolution is true then your religion must be false! Good luck with that one! I’d say you’re in big trouble. Glad it’s not my religion.