there is difference between ceremony and marriage,, the bible does not specifically define what marriage must be,, except that two become one under God

this is not requiring anyone elses definitions or laws,, just the bibles

this is why I don't believe God will only recognize our governments definition of marriage,, especially since our Goverment has itself redefined Gods definition, for he made marriage first, not government

if a man and woman become one under a covenant with God,, they are married,, where in that is government required?

What I understand about this in the bible the act of having sex that represented marriage in Gods eyes.
Later man set rules and regulations according to Gods laws given trough Moses.
And when government was established they implemented they're own laws and the church also implemented they're own laws.
But even he who has sex with a prostitute gets married to her.
This is just my opinion according to what I learned from the Bible.
Sorry had no time to read all coments and view points.

...God recognizes systems and structures that man puts in place (except that HE is not pleased with anything that is against HIS word or will).

It is because God reckons with systems and structures that are in place that the Bible instructs clearly that we submit to authority.

It is therefore proper for a man and a woman who want to get married to do so legitimately by following the process recognized in their environment - NOT just start living together and having sex.

To think we can just start living together and having sex according to our pleasure without following the recognized process of getting married is a lie from the devil! It is fornication in the sight of God as per Bible contents.

We must keep at the back of our minds that the Bible already says concerning the heart of man, that it is desperately wicked and deceitful above all things. Follow the Bible please!

Well articulated.

Please show me the verse, that says that God submits to government systems and abides by them?

So if i choose to go to tribe somewhere, and follow their traditions(jump over a broom, etc), and i'm 'married' there...then i move back to the U.S do i have to Re-Do the marriage ceremony in the U.S to be right in God's Eyes?

Our World is a big place, this is why i don't think the ceremony matters as much as the intention behind the promise


speaking of systems,
even the most-basic ones i.e Ten Commandments those actually were never given to Christians(they were given to Jews, many modern Jews actually wonder why Christians adopted them),

I don't think the God honestly cares about our systems, or traditions for that matter, i think he is concerned with our motives, and the REASONS we have for those, look up Proverbs 16:2, (but we are getting ) so I digress.

Once married...you are married! If you get married in the U.S. as per the U.S System, you remain married...even if you shift location to Nigeria.

See Roman Chapter 13:

1Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.

2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended.

4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer.

5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing.

7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes: if revenue, then revenue: if respect, then respect: if honor, then honor.

The only justification for disobeying authority is if the authority is asking you do something that is against God or His word. (See Daniel)

More...

1st Peter 2: 13- 16:

13 Submit yourselves for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether to a king as the one in authority,

14 or to governors as sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and the praise of those who do right.

15 For such is the will of God that by doing right you may silence the ignorance of foolish men.

16 Act as free men, and do not use your freedom as a covering for evil, but use it as bondslaves of God.


Again:
Galatians Chapter 6:
15. Neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything;what counts is the new creation.

16. Peace and mercy to all who follow this rule-to the Israel of God

And kindly note Isaac, that I used the word "recognizes". I di not say God submits. GOD is above all and submits to no man. But HE does recognize institutions as evident in HIS instruction to those who follow HIM to submit to authority.

Do please also note again that the Bible calls believers and followers of JESUS CHRIST, the Israel of God!

You are right that they have been getting divorced. The scriptures teach that if a man lay with a woman he ought to marry her. As I understand it, that was
Primarily a provisional and protective role. Malachi states that a divorcee is exposed to violence. Christ stated that whim God has joined together let no man put asunder. Furthermore, Paul wrote that 'Do you not know that one who joins himself to a prostitute becomes one flesh with her?"

The point is that people who have had sex with others are joined with them on a spiritual level also, hence why marriage is only dissolved by death. Remember the woman at the well with five husbands yet the man she was currently with was not her husband?

As you said, God's word is God's word.

God created marriage with Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. In the New Testament he writes that 'all of God's gifts are for those who know and believe the truth', as expounded by John Piper, he explains that marriage therefore is for believers only.

Not trying to start a fight, just clarify.

Jesusmyall has said it well. I've heard it said,(sorry it may have been John MacArthur), that one the commitment to marry has been made, yes the hormones and urges to come together will be stronger than ever. He states that at that point the ceremony should not be delayed because the commitment to permanence has been made.

John Piper again was the pastor who noted that permanence is the single most defining characteristic between marriage and all other relationships (I guess he figured sex was an excluded defining characteristic because it's only to happen in marriage anyway).

I have met an american guy here in mingle. I've discussed into him that I do believe there's no premarital sex will happen to me and that guy....next thing I know...he doesn't have interest with me anymore :(

Not sure if you were meaning it the same way I'm bout to say it, but the scriptures say it's better to marry then to burn. As in it's better for them to be married, then sinfully indulging in sexual actions.


1 Corinthians 7:9

9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.




The woman at the well was living under old covenant laws/culture. The laws being discussed in today's Christian lives have no coalition to that incident.

Sex doesn't join anyone on a spiritual level. That's why there is such a thing as adultery, which is sex between two not married to one another. And that is why God has told us it is better to marry than to burn.

Dear CowboyGH,

Please read what 1st Corinthians 6;15-17 says:

15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take away the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute? May it never be!

16 Or do you not know that the one who joins himself to a prostitute is one body with her?....

I also think that you are making a very fundamental mistake about assuming that the Old testament is of no significance to faith. Jesus said clearly that HE did not come to abolish the law but to fulfill it.

Again, some of the disciples made multiple references to the old testament portions of the Bible while writing in the new testament.

If the old testament is of no relevance, then why does the Bible cover from Genesis to Revelation?

Obviously, the death and resurrection of JESUS CHRIST signified many new things (for example the symbolic cutting of the veil in the temple into two, the response of JESUS on the issue of the adulterous woman who was caught in adultery, salvation by grace through faith as against the forgiveness of sins through sacrifice of bulls & goats, etc) but these do not mean that Old testament part of the Bible is not useful to faith today!

it's not that the old "testament" is of no revelance. The old covenant between man and God is fulfilled, the laws thereof the old covenant no longer apply to us, unless just so happens both happens to have the same law. And please don't take verses out of context.


1 Corinthians 6:15-17
15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.

16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

And right there at the end of 15, says God forbid to the taking of a harlot. "Sex" doesn't join people as one flesh, marriage through God makes them one flesh.


Hebrews 8:13

13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

And I don't have to say anything to this one, says straight up the old covenant is old and ready to vanish away. Thus why Jesus came to give us a new covenant. Because the laws and or the covenant in itself only holds power till all prophecies are fulfilled.


Matthew 24:34

34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.


Then we have to look at word meanings generation - All of the offspring that are at the same stage of descent from a common ancestor.

The first stage, the first generation has passed. We are in the next generation, the next stage of the prophecies. All the prophecies of the old covenant was fulfilled with Jesus on the cross, thus it passed and thus why Jesus gave us a new covenant and set of laws to abide by.

,,,,so, then the Bible is the Bible. The entire book is written for instruction to the person who purposes to follow God. Both the old and new testament have valuable lessons for the Christian to draw and learn from.

...so it should not be that each time anyone quotes from the old testament books, your response is that the old testament is not longer applicable! That's the point I am making.

I also do not understand what you mean by "quoting scripture" out of context. What Bible says is what Bible says. I did not add or subtract - I jus reproduced it.

The sin of sexual immorality is one that has peculiar consequences. The Bible even says, it is the one sins, which if committed, is done not only against God but against the body of those who do it.

Paul is telling us the magnitude of its implications. In creating the institution of marriage (of which sex is a fundamental part)...God had said, a man would leave his father and his mother and cleave unto his wife and that the two would become one flesh. Therefore, Paul is warning here....that it is unholy for a person to sinfully join his body to that of a prostitute through immorality; because in so doing, the person also becomes one with the harlot- to the condemnation of the person's soul...unless of course that sin is repented of. Repentance also means turning away from repeating it.

Hello, justmeEmma,

How are you? It is interesting, reading about your experience. I just want to send you a word of encouragement - don't let the guy's withdrawal bother you. Your match made from heaven will come and he will find you. When he finds you, he will respect your wishes and will not withdraw from you because of your choice to take a stand for God and for HIS word - the Bible.

Be strong...steadfast. God is faithful to the end.

God bless you. Amen.

Incorrect my friend. Sex has absolutely nothing to do with marriage in that context. One can have sex and not be married and one can be married and not have sex. When two are married, they are one person, one being, one unit. They are one in the same sense Jesus and his father are one. Not to the fullest extent of course, not comparing us to God lol. But the act of being "one" is in the same sense. And no one else sin(s) will effect your eternal well being whatsoever. Say you're married and your spouse murders someone, that sin will not be placed on you. For God will judge each and every person for their own actions/faith/ect.



You didn't alter anything, but you took the meaning of the verse out of context.

We were talking about sex and marriage. And you quoted "1 Corinthians 6:15-17" But nothing in those verses support what you are stating, as it plainly says in it "God forbid" in connection to that which was said in those verses.



No I state the old covenant is fulfilled, finished, completed, but in the context in response to someone saying that it's a law that is for us. When we are under absolutely no law from the old covenant/testament laws.



One can not follow both old and new covenants though. Yes bits and pieces from this one or that one, but as an entire covenant one can not follow both. As one covenant man is saved by works, and in the other one is saved by faith. But as for "lessons" yes both covenants/testaments do have valuable "lessons" to learn from and not repeat the past. But as for laws/instructions one can not follow both at the same time.

CowboyGH,

2nd Timothy Chapter 3 Verses 16 - 17 says:

16 All Scripture is God - breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

So that is it! ALL Scripture is the entire Bible (Genesis to Revelation)

The new testament does NOT throw away the Old testament from being scripture!

Umm, there must have been some kind of confusion some where along the lines you read here. No the NT doesn't throw away the OT. But the Law of the OT no longer apply to us, for God, Jesus fulfilled that covenant and gave us a new covenant signed with his blood. A person can not serve two masters ;) and the OT and the NT are two totally different sets of laws, would be contradictory with one another if we were to follow both.

OT says and eye for an eye, NT says turn the other cheek.