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| Topic: FACT SHEET: 45 YEARS OF OCCUPATION | |
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Edited by
Optomistic69
on
Tue 06/12/12 03:14 PM
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What would I be "prejudice" against? The Jewish religion? --Not possible since I know nothing about it, and I don't have any concern over what gods people want to worship ---The race of white European Jews? ---Not possible since they are just as white as me. We are both Caucasians, the same race. No prejudice there.
Well if you nothing about the Jewish religion then how exactly again are you an authority on who are supposedly fake Jews and how do you know that they are not really Jewish? 
Is it the same way that since you know nothing about Engineering that you know for certain that all the Engineering analysis of the WTC Towers attacks were fake? 
You are struggling slo..
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What would I be "prejudice" against? The Jewish religion? --Not possible since I know nothing about it, and I don't have any concern over what gods people want to worship ---The race of white European Jews? ---Not possible since they are just as white as me. We are both Caucasians, the same race. No prejudice there.
Well if you nothing about the Jewish religion then how exactly again are you an authority on who are supposedly fake Jews and how do you know that they are not really Jewish?
Is it the same way that since you know nothing about Engineering that you know for certain that all the Engineering analysis of the WTC Towers attacks were fake?
I don't need to know anything about any of the fake religions to know the method of operations of the evil people who have infiltrated the governments of this world. I don't need to know anything about Engineering to say that if the official account of the WTC had any merit, there would not be thousands of people (not just me) calling it fraud and an inside job. I am certainly not alone in what I believe and see. |
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Thousands of people in a world of billions is not much. You would need about 70 million to be even 1%
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Thousands of people in a world of billions is not much. You would need about 70 million to be even 1% Well I haven't gotten around to talking to all of them.
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Edited by
Chazster
on
Tue 06/12/12 04:00 PM
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To take it further there are more people that believe in those so called fake religions than that think 911 was an inside job. What does that say about your logic?
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To take it further there are more people that believe in those so called fake religions than that think 811 was an inside job. What does that say about your logic? Nothing. What is 811? |
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To take it further there are more people that believe in those so called fake religions than that think 911 was an inside job. What does that say about your logic? Thanks for the correction. What do fake religions have to do with 911?
And what does any of that have to do with my logic? |
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Christianity, Judaism and the Islam religion are all FAKE and false religions built on the back of the myth of King David and Abraham who are only found written about in so called "Jewish texts." Outside of those "Jewish" texts, there is no hard evidence that King David or Abraham or Solomon or any of those characters were anything other than myth. Therefore not only are King David and Abraham invented, the Jewish as a people are also completely invented. (There are no "chosen people" of the god of Abraham.) There was no Exodus. There was no Joshua or Moses. All fiction. And of course that truth brings down the whole house of cards and the New Testament also, which means that Jesus is also a mythical character.
Israel is only one of the best documented and earliest historically documented civilizations!
The Romans wrote about them. They erected monuments with sculpted depictions of their battles with the Jewish Israelites!
It's hilarious! The Muslims are fake of course.
Wrong. There was no Israel in 1709. Clip of "The West Wing - Holy Land Map" Can you believe that comments had to be disabled because of so many anti-Israel comments? Israel is not very popular in the world anymore. Watch this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k9IlR3-_-A |
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Sure...There were many conquests of the land of Israel.
But there were always Jews there and it was always the land where Israel was founded as a Jewish state by Jews. And everyone knew since antiquity that this was the land of Israel the homeland and birthplace of the Jews. The region was part of the Ottoman empire in 1709. There was no Jordan, no Syria, no Lebanon, no Palestine, no Iraq. Here is a video of the evolution of the region over time and through several different conquests. http://youtu.be/lS2ZVrnnO1w And here is a video which outlines some of what's needed to resolve the issue of safe and defensible borders for Israel in any new peace agreement. http://youtu.be/rfOpioIFZAU |
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Edited by
s1owhand
on
Tue 06/12/12 07:28 PM
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The Basic Problem in the Middle East is the simplest problem to describe.
Israel would like to exist and recognizes the right of the Palestinians to have a state. The Palestinians however and many other Muslims and Arabs do not recognize the right of a Jewish state of Israel to exist. Same problem as before 1948. No recognition, no peace, no negotiations - this is the policy of the Palestinians. The motto of Hamas is "We love death as much as the Jews love life." http://youtu.be/63hTOaRu7h4 |
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Christianity, Judaism and the Islam religion are all FAKE and false religions built on the back of the myth of King David and Abraham who are only found written about in so called "Jewish texts." Outside of those "Jewish" texts, there is no hard evidence that King David or Abraham or Solomon or any of those characters were anything other than myth. Therefore not only are King David and Abraham invented, the Jewish as a people are also completely invented. (There are no "chosen people" of the god of Abraham.) There was no Exodus. There was no Joshua or Moses. All fiction. And of course that truth brings down the whole house of cards and the New Testament also, which means that Jesus is also a mythical character.
Israel is only one of the best documented and earliest historically documented civilizations!
The Romans wrote about them. They erected monuments with sculpted depictions of their battles with the Jewish Israelites!
It's hilarious! The Muslims are fake of course.
Wrong. There was no Israel in 1709. Clip of "The West Wing - Holy Land Map" Can you believe that comments had to be disabled because of so many anti-Israel comments? Israel is not very popular in the world anymore. Watch this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k9IlR3-_-A Jenniebean Watch this video. It is where you will be soon anyway. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqTcXu3swSE&feature=related |
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Edited by
HotRodDeluxe
on
Wed 06/13/12 12:35 AM
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Hotrodelux:
...you are the one stating emphatically that they didn't exist, yet, you do not know that, nor can you prove it, and yet, you claim it as evidence to support your argument. Can't you see that this is illogical and fallacious?
1. You do not know what I know or do not know.
So, you're just making this stuff up then? 2. My claim is that King David, Solomon, Abraham, Joshua, Moses... none of these people were real. There is no credible evidence to suggest they were, and no reason to believe they ever existed.
I've been over this ad nauseum and you clearly don't understand, but then, you've never done the study, obviously. I don't have to prove it either. I am not the one making the claim or assuming that they were real historical figures. Like King Arthur and his quest for the holy grail, King David is a romantic fiction created and written only in "Jewish" texts.
Again, you're missing the point. Lack of evidence is not evidence, this is, of course, true. (I never said it was.) But I do not need evidence to prove someone or something did or does not exist, speaking scientifically.
As I've been laboriously trying to explain, literary evidence is a form of evidence. If there is evidence that certain artifacts found and have been claimed to be "evidence" of the existence a King David, and they are discovered to be a forgery, then I believe that would be hard evidence of a fraud which would support the claim that King David is a fictional character.
Not at all. It would only be evidence that the artefact was a fraud. It would also be evidence that whoever perpetrated this forgery probably has a strong vested interest in continuing the fraud and perpetrating the mythical King David as a real historical person.
Not at all. It would only be evidence that the artefact was a fraud. |
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The war is not about religion at all. It is only about religion. The Arabs did not make peace when they were given responsibility over the West Bank. They did not make peace when they were given the Gaza strip. It is not about land. They object because it is a Jewish state. Religion is used by the elite to manipulate the masses. The Arabs are smart enough to know that the Jews invading their land are not religious people. The term "Jew" today is not about religion, its about certain bloodlines of a certain tribe of white Europeans who claim to be Jewish.
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I know it has nothing to do with the website, because this find is well documented. When people are motivated by hatred and prejudice, any evidence you may produce is immaterial, for their minds are made up. It is easier for these people to believe in conspiracy theories promulgated on the internet, than it is to do the hard yards and find the truth with real study. Hotroddelux: This remark (in bold) is uncalled for and malicious.
You supply no logical evidence to dispute it. {quote]THE WEBSITE gives no details, and displays the article title making a false claim that: "Archaeologists Uncover King Solomon's Copper Mines." News flash: NO, THEY DIDN'T. And the website is loaded with advertisement links, and blinking display ads, and it is totally and clearly a very biased European Jewish website. (Cheesy IMO) It is simply not an unbiased scientific source for any kind of Science or Archaeology. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE WEBSITE! I didn't even look at it. The Bronze Age Copper Mines are contemporary to the literary evidence. And if you are implying I am motivated by "hatred and prejudice" please explain why you believe that and why you would say such a thing about anyone you don't know?
a). Anti-semitism is a form of prejudice. b). You participate in all anti-semitic threads What would I be "prejudice" against? The Jewish religion? --Not possible since I know nothing about it, and I don't have any concern over what gods people want to worship ---The race of white European Jews? ---Not possible since they are just as white as me. We are both Caucasians, the same race. No prejudice there.
Really? You say that "the find is well documented." What does that mean? Where is it well documented?
The Bronze Age Copper Mine excavations are well documented in Archaeological Review. Are the artifacts made available to unbiased Archaeologists to see whether or not they are simply more forgeries?
Of course, the papers, artefacts and findings are open to peer review. There are many lies in history that are "well documented." That does not mean they are true.
True, just look at Erich Von Daniken. |
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Here is a better article about the copper mine they found. I read it and I'm not surprised that they don't really have any actual artifact that suggests who owned or operated the copper mine. I might add, that copper mines in that area and in Africa are not that uncommon. That it may have been owned by the Biblical Solomon is just someone's wishful thinking. The mine itself could have been owned by anyone and the stories of Solomon could have still been pure fiction. Also, no one has yet ever pinned down the actual time that King David lived. The reason is .... because he didn't. King Solomon's (Copper) Mines? http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/10-22KingSolomon.asp The mines are contemporaneous to the literary evidence. I never said they are King Solomon's Mines, you projected that. You clearly don't understand this subject whatsoever. |
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@Jeanniebean Are the artifacts made available to unbiased Archaeologists to see whether or not they are simply more forgeries? @Hotrod Of course, the papers, artefacts and findings are open to peer review. @slohand A fragment of an Aramean victory stele discovered in 1993 at Tel Dan and dated c.850–835 BC Hotrod Is this artefact open to peer review? Slohand introduced this to prove the existence of King David |
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Edited by
HotRodDeluxe
on
Wed 06/13/12 03:50 AM
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@Jeanniebean Are the artifacts made available to unbiased Archaeologists to see whether or not they are simply more forgeries? @Hotrod Of course, the papers, artefacts and findings are open to peer review. @slohand A fragment of an Aramean victory stele discovered in 1993 at Tel Dan and dated c.850–835 BC Hotrod Is this artefact open to peer review? Slohand introduced this to prove the existence of King David Yes, please see the attached notes: http://www.enotes.com/topic/Tel_Dan_Stele It may prove the existence of King David (there is no general consensus at this point), but even if it doesn't, it doesn't disprove the existence of David either. http://www.bridgemanart.com/asset/449460/Iron-Age-9th-Century-BC/'House-of-David'-inscribed-on-a-victory-stele-Tel |
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Here is a "pro Bible" take on the situation.
The mining site now being investigated is part of a complex that incorporated 100 structures including a mine, a smelter, and a large fortress to protect it. The area, located 30 miles south of the Dead Sea and 30 miles north of the famed ruins of Petra in modern-day Jordan, is said to be the largest Iron Age copper factory in the Middle East. The site was so rich in copper that mining took place there for hundreds of years. For Bible scholars, the discovery of the mine is important because it reveals a possible source for the stockpiles of brass King Solomon is said to have used in the construction of the first temple (1 Kings 7). More famous for the gold, silver and gems that flowed into the kingdom, the Bible says Solomon acquired such quantities of brass that it became a common material, not worthy of being numerated: “The [brass] vessels were unnumbered … because they were exceedingly numerous, and it would have been an endless thing to keep the account of them; neither was the weight of the brass, when it was delivered to the workmen, searched or enquired into; so honest were the workmen, and such great plenty of brass they had, that there was no danger of wanting” (Matthew Henry Commentary). Although the Bible doesn’t specifically mention where the copper, which was used to make brass, came from, 1 Kings 7:46 relates that the molding of the copper into temple vessels was done “n the plain of Jordan … in the clay ground between Succoth and Zarthan.” Logistically it makes sense that the copper would be sourced from the closest available mines. Is it possible this is the very mine that supplied the copper used for the temple vessels, the ornaments and the two massive pillars, named Boaz and Jachin, that stood on the porch of the temple? Some scientists are now beginning to think so. Back when the mine was first discovered in the 1930s, archaeologists dated it to the early 10th century b.c., the time of King David and Solomon. In the 1970s, new researchers redated the site to at least 300 years after the reign of Solomon, assigning a new date that fit neatly with the prevailing belief that there were no complex societies in Israel or Jordan (biblical Edom) capable of building fortresses and monuments or other technologically advanced construction, such as a large Iron Age mining operation, during the time of David and Solomon. It’s hard to argue with stones, however. New technology and further digging is proving that not only was the mine fully operational during the time of Solomon but was most likely also functioning during the time of David. “This is the most hotly debated period in biblical archaeology today,” said archaeologist Thomas E. Levy of the University of California–San Diego, who reported the new radiocarbon dates for the copper smelting operation in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (Los Angeles Times, October 28). “We’re not answering the question” of whether King Solomon actually existed, he said, “but we’ve brought empirical data that shows we have to reevaluate those questions.” According to archaeologist William Schniedewind of the University of California–Los Angeles, so far, “The scientific evidence seems to be going in [Levy’s] favor” (ibid.). And although all of the most recent results have not yet been released, much of what has been made public is quite compelling. Among the evidence unearthed is charcoal, a product of the wood burned to produce heat for the smelting of copper. Two years ago, after dating the charcoal, Levy reported radiocarbon dates that indicated that mining was taking place in the 10th century b.c.—the time of kings David and Solomon. His findings ignited criticism from several Bible skeptics, including Tel Aviv University archaeologist Israel Finkelstein, who said it was impossible for these early dates to be correct because no nearby habitations dated to that time period had been found. So Levy set out to collect more data. Since then, his team has excavated through a 20-foot layer of slag near the center of the site, carefully documenting the locations of each bit of charcoal and other artifacts that were found. The charcoal was then dated by an Oxford University physicist. The results are very intriguing. According to the Los Angeles Times, “the bottom stratum of the site revealed a period of extensive mining that lasted for about 40 years around 940 b.c. and produced 9 feet of slag. There was then a major disruption in mining about 910 b.c., followed by resumption in the 9th century b.c.” (ibid., emphasis mine). Here is where it gets really interesting for Bible critics. In the layers associated with the disruption, Levy’s team found artifacts including an Egyptian scarab from the Eastern Nile region and an amulet linked to the Egyptian goddess Mut. And guess which general time period the layers and finds associated with the mining disruption correlate with? The period, as recorded in 1 Kings 14:25, in which the Bible says Israel and Judah were invaded by Shishak, the Egyptian pharaoh, who began raiding and conquering much of Palestine beginning around 925 b.c., after Solomon’s death. And secular records in Egypt also seem to confirm this, documenting that Shishak’s troops occupied the city of Hazevah, which is about 8 miles from the mining complex. So now skeptics are left with an advanced mining center, complete with charcoal-layered mining slag piles and artifacts that confirm the biblically recorded invasion of Israel by Egypt—and all dated to a time period that conventional theory says shouldn’t have existed. Actually, when you start counting, it is pretty astounding the number of Bible-confirming archaeological discoveries that have emerged over the past couple of years. Back in 2005, in an earth-shattering announcement, archaeologist Eilat Mazar revealed the discovery of King David’s palace. And in case you are wondering, David’s palace too was found located just as the Bible described it. Excavations are still ongoing, but the many exciting discoveries include bullae belonging to biblical personages and, most recently, the secret tunnel that David’s army commander Joab most likely used in conquering Jerusalem. In 2007, Nehemiah’s wall was found. This discovery likewise set off a firestorm of activity among Bible skeptics who had continually pointed to the lack of archaeological evidence supporting the book of Nehemiah’s claim that the returning exiled Jews rebuilt Jerusalem’s city wall and restored the gates of the temple. Read more at http://www.thetrumpet.com/?q=5639.3984.0.0 |
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What would I be "prejudice" against? The Jewish religion? --Not possible since I know nothing about it, and I don't have any concern over what gods people want to worship ---The race of white European Jews? ---Not possible since they are just as white as me. We are both Caucasians, the same race. No prejudice there.
Well if you nothing about the Jewish religion then how exactly again are you an authority on who are supposedly fake Jews and how do you know that they are not really Jewish?
Is it the same way that since you know nothing about Engineering that you know for certain that all the Engineering analysis of the WTC Towers attacks were fake?
You are struggling slo..
I know! I can hardly breathe from laughing at some of this stuff on this thread! It is an effort.
But here again is the real issue that has to be resolved in this conflict. Palestinians want to kill and exterminate the Jews and they do not recognize Israel's right to exist as a Jewish state. http://youtu.be/63hTOaRu7h4 |
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The mining site now being investigated is part of a complex that incorporated 100 structures including a mine, a smelter, and a large fortress to protect it. The area, located 30 miles south of the Dead Sea and 30 miles north of the famed ruins of Petra in modern-day Jordan, is said to be the largest Iron Age copper factory in the Middle East. The site was so rich in copper that mining took place there for hundreds of years. For Bible scholars, the discovery of the mine is important because it reveals a possible source for the stockpiles of brass King Solomon is said to have used in the construction of the first temple (1 Kings 7). More famous for the gold, silver and gems that flowed into the kingdom, the Bible says Solomon acquired such quantities of brass that it became a common material, not worthy of being numerated: “The [brass] vessels were unnumbered … because they were exceedingly numerous, and it would have been an endless thing to keep the account of them; neither was the weight of the brass, when it was delivered to the workmen, searched or enquired into; so honest were the workmen, and such great plenty of brass they had, that there was no danger of wanting” (Matthew Henry Commentary). Although the Bible doesn’t specifically mention where the copper, which was used to make brass, came from, 1 Kings 7:46 relates that the molding of the copper into temple vessels was done “n the plain of Jordan … in the clay ground between Succoth and Zarthan.” Logistically it makes sense that the copper would be sourced from the closest available mines. Is it possible this is the very mine that supplied the copper used for the temple vessels, the ornaments and the two massive pillars, named Boaz and Jachin, that stood on the porch of the temple? It really is very interesting. The Bible comes from a time when oral history was transitioning to written history. It should viewed as the very earliest attempts of people to wrestle with ethics and document history and philosophical thought. It is not surprising given that many geographical places mentioned in the Bible have been located and fit reasonably within the descriptions that other events have basis in fact. Certainly there was the Temple and a Jewish kingdom there for centuries. Archaeologists and historians are in the process of learning more about the timelines and nature of the societies discussed. |
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