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| Topic: CREATION VERSUS EVOLUTION MADE CLEAR !!! | |
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Also, when dealing with someone who truly believes that Evolution is the work of Satan, they will never be objective enough to actually learn the facts, and instead will cling to the fundamentalist "understanding" to continue to refute it. I keep hearing this term "facts" used with evolution. What does this term - "facts" mean? WHAT FACTS! |
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they like to ignore the word theory...or say it really fast and pretend its not there.....i dont see how it's easier to believe that our existence is scientifically impossible then it is to believe in a higher power of any sort
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From Eljay: "Most likely for the same reason you won't read anything by Kent Hovind unless it's from someone attempting to discredit him". Kent Hovind, is in jail for tax evasion. What has that got to do with his lectures on Evolution? And..... From Wik: Hovind maintains that biology textbooks are lying and that he considers evolution to be a religion. Specifically, he claims that "all" evidence "used to support the evolution theory is [sic] errors." His reason is that there is a conspiracy "brainwashing" youth and that "evolution theory supports communism, Nazism, socialism, and the New World Order." In addition, he claims "I am not trying to get the evolution theory out of the schools." He has claimed that everything is a religion, including mathematics. Evolution is a religion. You need more faith to believe in Evolution than you ever would Christianity. Most people who believe in Evolution do so with a blind faith. Hovind has several conspiracy theories about the U.S. government. He believes that the cyanide-releasing compound Laetrile is a "cancer cure" and argues that the US government is conspiring to suppress a cure for cancer. On his radio program he has said that the U.S. government was behind the 9/11 attacks by Al-Qaeda terrorists killing nearly 3000 people and that a "lot of folks were told not to come to work." I'm unaware of this. What's your source for this so I can check it out? He also believes the Oklahoma City bombing was carried out by the government. "Did you know the Federal Government blew up their own building to blame it on the militias and to get rid of some people that weren't cooperating with the system?"Regarding UFOs Hovind recommends books by conspiracy theorists who believe "some UFO’s are U.S. Government experiments with electrogravitic propulsion as opposed to jet propulsion, while others are Satanic apparitions." Again - unaware of this - Source? Additionally, Hovind believes that the Federal Reserve, the Council on Foreign Relations, the United Nations, and various other groups are actively planning to create a one world government and that the 1993 World Trade Center attack was staged by the US Government in order to pass "anti-terrorism" legislation that restricts civil liberties. He says, "I love my country, but fear my government. And you should too."He also believes there is no such thing as the separation of church and state, and opposes public schools. The "One World Government" is not something new. This has been going on for some time, and has even been put into motion in Europe. Again - I don't know of his statements on the World Trade Center Stuff. What's the source for this. There's no such thing as the separation of church and state other than a mis-interpreted ruling by the courts over a letter by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists. There is nothing in the constitution about separation of church and state. It says the governemnt shall make no laws concerning the practice of religion... Something the courts have been ignoring for years - as they make laws and rulings against religion all the time. The courts have become un-constitutional, and the lame-duck Congress we've had for decades does nothing about it. Public schools are useless, and a joke. I know this first hand. Went to them, and taught in them. They're glorified baby-sitters, and expensive day care centers run on tax dollars. |
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From Eljay: "Most likely for the same reason you won't read anything by Kent Hovind unless it's from someone attempting to discredit him". Kent Hovind, is in jail for tax evasion. What has that got to do with his lectures on Evolution? And..... From Wik: Hovind maintains that biology textbooks are lying and that he considers evolution to be a religion. Specifically, he claims that "all" evidence "used to support the evolution theory is [sic] errors." His reason is that there is a conspiracy "brainwashing" youth and that "evolution theory supports communism, Nazism, socialism, and the New World Order." In addition, he claims "I am not trying to get the evolution theory out of the schools." He has claimed that everything is a religion, including mathematics. Evolution is a religion. You need more faith to believe in Evolution than you ever would Christianity. Most people who believe in Evolution do so with a blind faith. Hovind has several conspiracy theories about the U.S. government. He believes that the cyanide-releasing compound Laetrile is a "cancer cure" and argues that the US government is conspiring to suppress a cure for cancer. On his radio program he has said that the U.S. government was behind the 9/11 attacks by Al-Qaeda terrorists killing nearly 3000 people and that a "lot of folks were told not to come to work." I'm unaware of this. What's your source for this so I can check it out? He also believes the Oklahoma City bombing was carried out by the government. "Did you know the Federal Government blew up their own building to blame it on the militias and to get rid of some people that weren't cooperating with the system?"Regarding UFOs Hovind recommends books by conspiracy theorists who believe "some UFO’s are U.S. Government experiments with electrogravitic propulsion as opposed to jet propulsion, while others are Satanic apparitions." Again - unaware of this - Source? Additionally, Hovind believes that the Federal Reserve, the Council on Foreign Relations, the United Nations, and various other groups are actively planning to create a one world government and that the 1993 World Trade Center attack was staged by the US Government in order to pass "anti-terrorism" legislation that restricts civil liberties. He says, "I love my country, but fear my government. And you should too."He also believes there is no such thing as the separation of church and state, and opposes public schools. The "One World Government" is not something new. This has been going on for some time, and has even been put into motion in Europe. Again - I don't know of his statements on the World Trade Center Stuff. What's the source for this. There's no such thing as the separation of church and state other than a mis-interpreted ruling by the courts over a letter by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists. There is nothing in the constitution about separation of church and state. It says the governemnt shall make no laws concerning the practice of religion... Something the courts have been ignoring for years - as they make laws and rulings against religion all the time. The courts have become un-constitutional, and the lame-duck Congress we've had for decades does nothing about it. Public schools are useless, and a joke. I know this first hand. Went to them, and taught in them. They're glorified baby-sitters, and expensive day care centers run on tax dollars. It doesn't take much searching to find his quotes on all of these things. And now I know the thought prosses you are comming from. |
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they like to ignore the word theory...or say it really fast and pretend its not there.....i dont see how it's easier to believe that our existence is scientifically impossible then it is to believe in a higher power of any sort it's not. all of this started for something (the "dot") which can't be explained anymore than creationism. at some point we have to say "don't know" |
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Edited by
feralcatlady
on
Mon 03/02/09 08:26 AM
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Evolution does not say that man evolved from chimps, but that they had a common ancestor. Perhaps you should study what evolution actually says before you make your claims. So how exactly do you have a "common ancestor" with another creature and not share the same gentics? Makes no sense to me. You understand you are not a chimp correct? A hominid is any member of the biological family Hominidae (the "great apes"), including the extinct and extant humans, chimpanzees, gorillas, and orangutans. This was our common ancestor. Forensic artists made this model from her skeletal remains. 
This is a fleshed out model rendition of Lucy. "Lucy" (Australopithecus afarensis) dating back about 3 million years. Ok let's be real specific.....This is from Krisma......your saying we are part of the primate family.......So tell me then Darwin's theory of evolution is what to you exactly...... |
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What if God created humans THROUGH evolution? Like say, for example, God made whatever we supposedly evolved from? Wouldnt that still technically be God creating man "in his own image"? Or would it still be an evil, ludicrous theory to Christians?
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What if God created humans THROUGH evolution? Like say, for example, God made whatever we supposedly evolved from? Wouldnt that still technically be God creating man "in his own image"? Or would it still be an evil, ludicrous theory to Christians? Well the only problem with that is that it flies in the face of the 'word of God' (assuming the Bible is the 'word of God') According to the Bible God created the animals, and then he created Adam from the dust of the Earth. Clearly this was a SEPERATE act of creation from having created the animals. I mean, once evolution comes into the picture the biblical doctrine has to be toss out the window. Either that,... OR,... The Biblical doctrine must be taken to be TOTALLY NON-LITERAL. But as soon as we do that then it no longer has any meaning because if it's just a matter of vague personal interpretation then it can't be claimed to be the BASIS of morality since eveyone will take their own views on what it might mean. In fact, this is precisely why I call Christinaity (and Protestantism in particular) a 'train-wrecked' religion. First off, the Bible starts out with a supposedly unchanging God who is concerned about human BEHAVIOR. But then it ends up being all about a God who is soley interested in what a person BELIEVES. That's a train-wreck for all of Christianity whether Catholicism or Protestantism. However, the Protestants protested against Catholicism. That's why they are called "Protestants". And specifically what they protested against was the idea that the Pope (or any mortal man) should speak for God (i.e. be the authoritive interpreter of the Bible). Protestantism claimed that ONLY THE HOLY SPIRIT can speak to men through their hearts (or souls). That means that no mortal man should be permitted to claim to have the only correct interpretation of the Bible. Ok fine. By that definition I could read the Bible and say that based on what I've read, and felt in my heart, there is no way that Jesus was the son of the God of Abraham. I could actually claim to be a Protestant and state that this is my personal interpretation based on what I feel coming from the Holy Spirit. Yet Protestantism denies my right to do that. What Protestantism has actually become is a myriad of opposing demoninations all of whole claim to be 'Paper Popes', each holding the 'correct' interpretation of the scriptures. So the whole religion is a train-wreck. All that the Protestants ended up doing is demaning to become individual Paper Popes. And they shove THEIR personal interpretations in eveyone else's faces as the "word of God". So where's the value in such a train-wrecked religion? Especially considering that the entire BASIS of the whole thing is that we need to be SAVED from the WRATH OF GOD! Well, if we all have our own personal ideas of what needs to be done to be saved from the wrath of God then what good is the religion? Is there a God who has SPECIFIC RULES? (i.e. the book MUST BE TAKEN LITERALLY) Or is it just a free-for-all? (i.e. Everyone decides on a personal level what they think God might want from them) If it's the LATTER then why bother with a book at all? Also, if God speaks to use through our hearts (via the Holy Spirit) then again, why bother defending a dogma that no mortal man is premitted to interpret (according to the Protestants!) Personally I think the whole thing is nothing but a totally irreverent circus that just breeds prejudice, judgement, and religious intollerance. And what good does that serve anyone? 
And look at this very thread. This dogmatic circus has people rejecting observations of how the universe actually behaves. It's ridiculous they'd rather believe in a totally ambigous book that no two people can agree on, than accept actual observation of the world we actually LIVE IN. |
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from.
There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. |
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From Eljay: "Most likely for the same reason you won't read anything by Kent Hovind unless it's from someone attempting to discredit him". Kent Hovind, is in jail for tax evasion. What has that got to do with his lectures on Evolution? And..... From Wik: Hovind maintains that biology textbooks are lying and that he considers evolution to be a religion. Specifically, he claims that "all" evidence "used to support the evolution theory is [sic] errors." His reason is that there is a conspiracy "brainwashing" youth and that "evolution theory supports communism, Nazism, socialism, and the New World Order." In addition, he claims "I am not trying to get the evolution theory out of the schools." He has claimed that everything is a religion, including mathematics. Evolution is a religion. You need more faith to believe in Evolution than you ever would Christianity. Most people who believe in Evolution do so with a blind faith. Hovind has several conspiracy theories about the U.S. government. He believes that the cyanide-releasing compound Laetrile is a "cancer cure" and argues that the US government is conspiring to suppress a cure for cancer. On his radio program he has said that the U.S. government was behind the 9/11 attacks by Al-Qaeda terrorists killing nearly 3000 people and that a "lot of folks were told not to come to work." I'm unaware of this. What's your source for this so I can check it out? He also believes the Oklahoma City bombing was carried out by the government. "Did you know the Federal Government blew up their own building to blame it on the militias and to get rid of some people that weren't cooperating with the system?"Regarding UFOs Hovind recommends books by conspiracy theorists who believe "some UFO’s are U.S. Government experiments with electrogravitic propulsion as opposed to jet propulsion, while others are Satanic apparitions." Again - unaware of this - Source? Additionally, Hovind believes that the Federal Reserve, the Council on Foreign Relations, the United Nations, and various other groups are actively planning to create a one world government and that the 1993 World Trade Center attack was staged by the US Government in order to pass "anti-terrorism" legislation that restricts civil liberties. He says, "I love my country, but fear my government. And you should too."He also believes there is no such thing as the separation of church and state, and opposes public schools. The "One World Government" is not something new. This has been going on for some time, and has even been put into motion in Europe. Again - I don't know of his statements on the World Trade Center Stuff. What's the source for this. There's no such thing as the separation of church and state other than a mis-interpreted ruling by the courts over a letter by Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists. There is nothing in the constitution about separation of church and state. It says the governemnt shall make no laws concerning the practice of religion... Something the courts have been ignoring for years - as they make laws and rulings against religion all the time. The courts have become un-constitutional, and the lame-duck Congress we've had for decades does nothing about it. Public schools are useless, and a joke. I know this first hand. Went to them, and taught in them. They're glorified baby-sitters, and expensive day care centers run on tax dollars. It doesn't take much searching to find his quotes on all of these things. And now I know the thought prosses you are comming from. Well - evidently you've had difficulty if this is your idea of providing your sources for the comments you made on him. I'm curious as why you would expect anyone to believe there legitimate statements if you won't allow the opportunity to have them checked out for oneself? For all I know - you're the source, and you just made this stuff up. |
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What if God created humans THROUGH evolution? Like say, for example, God made whatever we supposedly evolved from? Wouldnt that still technically be God creating man "in his own image"? Or would it still be an evil, ludicrous theory to Christians? Then it's a different God from Genesis. What God are you refering to? |
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Edited by
Eljay
on
Mon 03/02/09 09:30 AM
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from. There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. You are blaming religion for the people who abuse it. Do you think prescription drugs are evil? Lot's of people abuse them. Stalin killed millions in the name of Atheism. Does that make all people who do not believe in God evil because Stalin was? The way to my inner happiness and well being is to not follow anyone, and I don't admire anyone for their philosophies. It's their actions I admire. I couldn't care less what they believe. |
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from. There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. You are blaming religion for the people who abuse it. Do you think prescription drugs are evil? Lot's of people abuse them. Stalin killed millions in the name of Atheism. Does that make all people who do not believe in God evil because Stalin was? The way to my inner happiness and well being is to not follow anyone, and I don't admire anyone for their philosophies. It's their actions I admire. I couldn't care less what they believe. Yes many have followed religion as the true path of rightenous on how we should act, be, and live. Many use religion as a excuse for their actions also. It is recorded in history many times and it is your choice to see it how it is. If you don't believe it to be true then you can bypass history as much as you want, yet you will have many who will always disagree with it. If you don't follow anyone is also a good path. I have not followed anyone at all and lived under one rule all my life, which is "don't do that what you don't want done to you." This was and is primarily sufficient for me to live a productive life full of happiness and inner peace, yet I also enjoy those who have lived similiar paths and even truly helped those find a peaceful way of life in which I can proudly say they are great people to admire. There is nothing wrong with this. One of them I can say now is a friend at the miccosokee tribes of indians here in florida who is a chief of 93 years old. I can say that he is a great example who has shown many how to deal with the atrocities their culture had suffered by your ancestory and how they deal with it today. |
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from. There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. You are blaming religion for the people who abuse it. Do you think prescription drugs are evil? Lot's of people abuse them. Stalin killed millions in the name of Atheism. Does that make all people who do not believe in God evil because Stalin was? The way to my inner happiness and well being is to not follow anyone, and I don't admire anyone for their philosophies. It's their actions I admire. I couldn't care less what they believe. Why is it, that when someone mentions the evils that were done so, in the name of religion, then you(or someone else) flies in here with the claim that you cannot judge a religion based on those that "abuse" the beliefs of that religion, to cause harm. But, then you will make the completely incorrect statement that those killed in Stalin's Russia were killed in the name of Atheism. So, why are historically accurate cases where Religion/religious beliefs was the main cause behind one's actions not allowed to speak for all religion, but killings where the main cause is Socio-Political, you are allowed to make a blanket statement condemning something that you don't agree with, and/or choose not to understand? |
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Also, when dealing with someone who truly believes that Evolution is the work of Satan, they will never be objective enough to actually learn the facts, and instead will cling to the fundamentalist "understanding" to continue to refute it. I keep hearing this term "facts" used with evolution. What does this term - "facts" mean? WHAT FACTS! http://www.worsleyschool.net/science/files/evolution/facts.html http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-fact.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_as_theory_and_fact Not that you will actually look at any of these . . . |
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Edited by
MorningSong
on
Mon 03/02/09 01:23 PM
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In CONCLUSION : As was stated at the beginning of this thread: According to God's Word, "Everything Reproduces AFTER... ITS...OWN...KIND!!" meaning: Evolution Into a WHOLE OTHER SPECIES Will NEVER EVER HAPPEN!! Simply BeCause God's Word Does NOT Lie. NOW.... Can Evolution Take Place WITHIN a Species? Yes!!! YES!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! YES!!! BUT>>>>>........ WITHIN the Species ONLY!! Simply Because..... Evolution WITHIN a Species, STILL REMAINS... OF ... IT'S... OWN... KIND!!! So Simple to understand . So why is this subject still being argued over , on this thread?? How about we Lay this subject to rest now , folks....  
(((((((( Hugs from the Heart)))))
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Final Note:
There is no such thing as Evolution. As mentioned before, The correct terminology for the changes taking place WITHIN a species, should have all along been called Devolution.... instead of Evolution ..... simply because everything in creation is devolving... and not actually evolving ... atall.
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Edited by
MahanMahan
on
Mon 03/02/09 10:05 PM
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Good day MorningSong!
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from. There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. You are blaming religion for the people who abuse it. Do you think prescription drugs are evil? Lot's of people abuse them. Stalin killed millions in the name of Atheism. Does that make all people who do not believe in God evil because Stalin was? The way to my inner happiness and well being is to not follow anyone, and I don't admire anyone for their philosophies. It's their actions I admire. I couldn't care less what they believe. Yes many have followed religion as the true path of rightenous on how we should act, be, and live. Many use religion as a excuse for their actions also. It is recorded in history many times and it is your choice to see it how it is. If you don't believe it to be true then you can bypass history as much as you want, yet you will have many who will always disagree with it. If you don't follow anyone is also a good path. I have not followed anyone at all and lived under one rule all my life, which is "don't do that what you don't want done to you." This was and is primarily sufficient for me to live a productive life full of happiness and inner peace, yet I also enjoy those who have lived similiar paths and even truly helped those find a peaceful way of life in which I can proudly say they are great people to admire. There is nothing wrong with this. One of them I can say now is a friend at the miccosokee tribes of indians here in florida who is a chief of 93 years old. I can say that he is a great example who has shown many how to deal with the atrocities their culture had suffered by your ancestory and how they deal with it today. "Don't do that which you don't want done to you" is another way of stating "The Golden Rule", is it not? So you're living your life by christain principles. I think you will find that a closer look at the atrocities of "religion" are not representative of Chistianity at all. Just the abuse of religion. How does that - in any way - show an allegience to Christ? You are using the common misconception that religion and chritainity are interchangable terms. They are not. |
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With the many atrocities in the name of God that has been reflected in the history of mankind, I cannot understand how anyone can follow such a idealogy in the first place regardless of what the religion or faith it comes from. There are truly people who can live peaceful amongst each other who are non religious or spiritual that have better belief systems then the gods that many have worshipped. Clearly a mediterrenean mythology as harmless as it may look is truly as dangerous as history has told it. When people start screaming "Because God whilsts it" then it is already a lost cause as we know in history people have lost their lives just because they are from a different culture, belief system, or lifestyle that is not adapted to the religion that seeks to spread across the globe by any means necessary. I admire those spiritual paths that do not seek by any means possible to influence their idealogies onto others, but instead practice for their own well being and inner happiness. Those are the people we should admire and follow and only few have made in the books of history as we know it. You are blaming religion for the people who abuse it. Do you think prescription drugs are evil? Lot's of people abuse them. Stalin killed millions in the name of Atheism. Does that make all people who do not believe in God evil because Stalin was? The way to my inner happiness and well being is to not follow anyone, and I don't admire anyone for their philosophies. It's their actions I admire. I couldn't care less what they believe. Why is it, that when someone mentions the evils that were done so, in the name of religion, then you(or someone else) flies in here with the claim that you cannot judge a religion based on those that "abuse" the beliefs of that religion, to cause harm. But, then you will make the completely incorrect statement that those killed in Stalin's Russia were killed in the name of Atheism. So, why are historically accurate cases where Religion/religious beliefs was the main cause behind one's actions not allowed to speak for all religion, but killings where the main cause is Socio-Political, you are allowed to make a blanket statement condemning something that you don't agree with, and/or choose not to understand? But you're making my point. Why do you attribute the attrocities of the Crusades or Jihad as anything but a Socio/political cause cleaverly misrepresented as a religious issue? Neither are adhering to the religious principles to which they are claiming justify their actions. Wouldn't you agree that this is seen as it's most obvious with the examples of Stalin and Hitler? Both of these men claimed that their actions were justified by religion. Hitler claimed he was doing God's work, Stalin was an adherant of the religion of Evolution. |
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