well "Skyhook" no need to go through all that trouble when all you have to do is provide evidence that your out of body experience were anything beyond a dream state ..

clearly since you are an expert in using the dictionary you can compute what "beyond a state dream" means ...hopefully

either you can or you can't ..if you can then do so but if you can't just admit it ..it will only sting for a while

Since you have rejected the dictionary definition of the word "evidence", you're right - I cannot provide you with something that fulfills the definition of a word that has no definition.

"Skyhook" ..when did I reject any definition of evidence ..I simply ask for evidence beyond your experience being a dream ..so let's take a look at the evidence you supplied so far ..

(1)..you say that you saw yourself six feet from your out of body self

(2)..you said that you hover

(3) .. you said that Princton did research

so what in any of the evidence that you supplied provides evidence that what you experienced was beyond a dream ..

When a person has an OOBE, in the case that they're still on our "plane" they view what is around them in real time without people [for the most part] being able to see them.

When a guy falls asleep and somehow has an OOBE and meanders around into his living room to find his brother watching tv and dropping 3 pieces of cheetohs on the floor only to pick them up and eat them even though they are dirty, then wake up and ask his brother if all that happened for his brother to say HOW THE HELL? that right there is the proof.

It's happened too many times, with accounts written by real people in books that all share that experience and try to find a deeper meaning to it, or simply express that they too have had the OOBE. It's possible that a dream similar to an OOBE can happen, but like I said, if a person has that experience, and notices all that is happening in real time, then asks people if all that really happened and it did, then how could it be a dream? Not possible. there is a link between sleeping and OOBE I'll say that, but the 2 are not the same. Sleep can be noted as one of the most meditated states a human can be in. Of course, what you see while you sleep, you are most likely not meant to remember for whatever reasons they may be if any.

The sad part is that only people who have had the same experiences will believe such proof, because that is the only proof available. It of course, is not a dream if all that happened in real time.


A person cannot gain new unknown knowledge in the aspect you describe it as funches. I do get what you are saying though, in a sense it's almost like saying..well..you experienced that...at least show me that it means something, otherwise its useless and pretty much the same as a dream. For a person to travel such far distances, levitation, hovering, in that OOBE state, they are not in physical human form. It is impossible to bring that knowledge and movement skills back with you. The only way you can bring such abilities with you is if you experienced and learned them in human form which is up to you to think weather its nuts to think its possible or not.

The only new unknown knowledge people have from that experience, is the ability to harness the experience, and create the experience at "will". Once that can be established, that is considered the new unknown knowledge.

Sounds like a short-acting tryptamine. (or like Robin said, acid).. but the S.A.T's are more known for the "out of body experiences".. especially ayahuasca or DMT.

Dimethyl-tryptamine (DMT) is a naturally occurring substance in your brain... you probably just had an overload, or a temporary leak.

enjoy!

lol I addressed that in another thread just yesterday captain, funny how you brought that up. That's why I said OOBE is related to sleep, the mechanics all work together in different ways to perform different things.

It's true, it could be a temporary leak or overload, but that just shows what a human is actually capable of. Magnificent isn't it?

Life is all about learning, especially about learning of yourself. There are gateways in our own bodies alone that most people would think are unimaginable.

DMT imho aint no drug either. you're not inducing yourself with something that already isn't naturally occurring in your own body. True you might be amplifying it and "tampering" with its level, but that's just like a guy working out and taking creatine, but of course not as simple lol

So here is the definition of "evidence" that I am using (from the American Heritage College Dictionary - Fourth Edition):
"evidence": 1 - A thing or things helpful in forming a conclusion or judgment"

Now by that definition I can say that “seeing my body from six feet away” is “a thing that helped me form the conclusion” that I was not located at a point within my body.

ok ..I will go with your definition of what "evidence" is ..

so "Skyhook" can you provide "a thing or things helpful in forming a conclusion or judgement" that your out of body experience was beyond a dream?

Just a thought. Have you ever seen yourself in a dream? I haven't.

Has anyone ever seen their own body lying on their bed in a dream?

JB

"AhaloAskewed" going by the evidence presented and the replies to the questions asked about an out of body experience or remote viewing ..the answers and the evidence regarding those experiences appears to be no different then when someone claim that Jesus visited them or that they saw God ..

"JennieBean" ..waking up from a Dream can induce instant memory loss which means you don't remember every dream you have

1) In all my life, I don't remember ever having a dream wherein I saw my body from outside of it
2) In all my life, I don't remember ever having a dream where I remembered everything so vividly and clearly.

That's enough evidence for me.

This statement is unproven and it has nothing to do with my question.

I have never had a dream where I saw myself in sleeping in my bed or anywhere else.

I remember my dreams very well, and I keep a dream journal.

JB

"Skyhook"s ..so are you saying that it's enough evidence for you yourself or enough evidence to convince your out of body self or enough evidence to convince both yourselves ..

anyway of course it would be enough evidence to convince both yourselves since both yourselves are the ones having the same delusion ...

but then again delusion may explain why both yourselves seem not to be able to grasp the concept that both yourselves were constantly being asked to provide evidence beyond it being a delusion

but anyway the evidence that both yourselves presented didn't indicate any evidence that both of you "skyhooks" wasn't experiencing anything beyond a delusion

"JennieBean" ..if you could remember your dreams you wouldn't need a journal ..people keep journals in an attempt to write down a REM dream before they forget but REM occurs more than one time during a sleep period

but anyway you go through two stages of sleep ..one is REM the other is NREM sleep ..NREM takes place in four stages and REM or DREAM sleep happens after the fourth stage of NREM sleep and the cycle repeats itself which mean you are sleep when the cycles are taking place until you wake up whichs means you don't remember all your dreams

Thank you for the education but I know that. I wake up every two or three hours and jot down my dreams. If I did not remember them I would not be able to write them down. If I did not write them down, I would eventually forget them.

I did not say I remembered all my dreams but of the dreams I did remember and and wrote down I have NEVER had a dream in which I looked at my body on the bed alseep. Never.

"JennieBean" you are claiming "remote viewing" and you don't have to dream seeing your own body to do that ..to "remote view" you only have to be able to view the surroundings and happenstances that occurs during a dream ...and surely theres no denying that since those occurences are written into your journal

also you indicated that you wake up every three hours to write in a journal only suggest that you have trouble sleeping and may be sleep deprived and sometimes wake up during the time between a deep stage4 NREM episode and just before you enter into REM sleep which probably lead you to believe that you may have remote viewed

in your attempt to supply "Skyhook" with inaccurate out of body evidence you had to realize that you don't remember all your dreams which means you may have seen yourself in your dreams and just don't remember

Funches the conversation was about whether or not I had or ever remembered seeing myself or my body while dreaming. We were not discussing remote viewing. You are changing the subject. A very poor argumentative tactic.

I am not sleep deprived. I get well over 8 hours of sleep every night. I simply have the power to consciously wake myself up after a dream so I can write it down. If I don't like the dream I am having I can change it or wake myself up at will. This simply comes from practice.

JB

"JennieBean"..it was you that said that you don't "remember" ever seeing yourself in a dream..since you don't remember every dream means that you have no idea if you ever did see yourself in a dream so why would you even bring it up but as to supply inaccurate information ..

and maybe others don't remember seeing themselves in a dream but those that do remember may simply believe it was an out of body experience ..

like I said those into spirituality always believe their dreams open them up to The Netherworld and that may be so but they never can provide any evidence beyond it being a dream

Funches,

If you "don't remember" an experience it is the same as if the experience never happened and there is no evidence that the experience ever happened thus chances are the experience never did happen.

I don't know of anyone who has ever seen themselves in a dream. If you remember your dreams funches and if you have ever had an out of body experience that you remember you would know the difference. You are arguing about something you have never experienced hence you are arguing about something you have no knowledge of, hence you have no credibility or no reason to even be posting in this thread about out of body experiences.

You have made your position clear that you don't believe there is any such thing and that people are just dreaming or having a delusion and everyone knows this is your opinion so why do you keep posting in this thread, as you have absolutely nothing to offer or add other than your opinion.

JB