As mentioned before, I am not a fan or critic of Scientology. I kind of see it as a group of people with like goals and values, like a religion such as JW, or Catholics or Jewish, or Christian, or Muslim, or like a non religion like atheists.

I do hear criticism of them, but of those I know are members, they seem to be living pretty upstanding productive lives. I dont know any personally, only those reported on. Every religion and non religions is made of individuals, and these individuals can make poor choices. But I dont think that should reflect on the group unless it is shown that in the groups public philosophies, they are encouraging or mandating those choices.

all that is to say, for those who have documented information from more than just x-members negative claims or current members praises, I am curious what is the negative or positive Documented information about this group as a whole.

I have personal experience with them. I dated a woman I loved. We were engaged and because I wouldn't join the Church (at the time I didn't criticize) I was "Declared", which means I was a suppressive person and she could have no contact with me if she wanted to stay within the COS.

I have been an advocate for the victims of Scientology for years, way before Going Clear came out or the Aftermath came out. I know other victims like Mark and Claire Headley, Tony Ortega etc. I have talked to other survivors first hand and its a dangerous cult that only cares about money. If you cant afford their "Religious Services" where the basic package is $50,000 they used what is slave labor. of the person is lucky they make $0.20 cents an hour. They do not give back to the community and their Narconon program has proved so lethal they State and City Governments have been shutting them down over the many deaths across the United States.

Their anti Psychiatry stance is dangerous and they also are violating Stolen Valor laws by promoting a false military history of LRH and claiming he was awarded medals, ribbons and awards which never happened. They use this as the basis of recruiting people claiming he healed himself from his massive combat injuries (he never saw combat) with Dianetics. In fact his first station in Australia the US Ambassador complained to the Navy about him and not wanting him thee then shortly after the was PNG'D (Persona Non Grata) by the Australian Government. That is one of the worst things that can happen to a Military or Government representative. That took about two weeks. He was relieved of every command he held and damn near started an armed conflict with Mexico, a key partner of ours at the time. It was an international incident that the President of the United States had to personally get involved with to squash. He was then given crap duties to finish out his term which he then complained of tummy aches so he finished out his Navy career in a military hospital in Alameda, California. He then also repeatedly wrote to the DOD asking for Psychiatric help which was denied which is partly why Scientologists are taught to hate Psychology.

During World War II we were massively understaffed and were refitting personal watercraft, fishing boats and cruise liners to be military craft. All's it took to become an Officer or a Commanding Officer of one of these vessels is a recommendation of from a Congressman or Senator or other high ranking Official. Hubbard found one that was a huge fan of his science fiction writing and appealed to him claiming he had Captained massive naval expeditions to the Caribbean and to Alaska. Both were a failure, the one to the Caribbean they never made it out of the States, everyone of the crew left when they got to their first port in North Carolina because of Hubbard's incompetence. Then the Alaska one he never made it out of the Area because he damaged the vessel because he didn't know what he was doing. That Congressman or Senator later said he gave LRH a signed paper on letter head and told him your the writer write your own letter of recommendation. SO that's how he became a CO of a vessel. He was also given very little training at the time. It's not like it is now. We had to get people out there and fast.

Also the COS committed the worst case of Domestic Espionage in our Countries history!

Okay. This guy was fraudulent, and THAT is the basis for hating the group?

I know absolutely nothing about them or any members personally.

But like you, I rather admire some of the people whose names
appear regularly in the media.

I am imagining bad seeds in about every organization I can
think of.

I would blame the organization if that was policy.

It seems like they're not getting away with low wages here


http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/church-of-scientology-underpaying-staff-1.4972447

Our US labor laws allow compensation to volunteers if it does not exceed $500 per year. They would have screwed up tying a pay RATE to the number of hours worked though, even here.

Labor laws are pretty clear here

You're either a volunteer or not... can't be both

cool too.

ours are clear as well, but not so black and white, they do allow volunteers to be compensated, which is kind of nice for someone only intending to be 'volunteering' from the good of their heart. its kind of like, for me, if i opened a door for an older person and when i came back out, they had an envelope on my car with $50. Im not gonna think worse on them about that type of appreciation, for sure.

but if I am doing it as my job, like a doorman, in expectation of some pay, than I expect what the law states for a paid employee.

but yeah, Canada seems cool. Im not mad at them for making it black and white either. For me, either way works.

Yea, the only reason i'd lean one way is, way too much abuse in the past


We have a long history with such religious groups bringing in millions, paying no taxes, no payroll and sit on multi million dollar properties. tsk tsk

indeed.

We have similar problems with non religious entities here as well, with the exception of the payroll part, we call them loopholes though ...

I read Battlefield Earth, enjoyed it.
I read Dianetics, didn't.
I did find certain aspects of it interesting but most of it struck me as bullshiat.

I remember a big stink years ago when Tom Cruise was jilted because of his views about Scientology.
Personally, I don't give Scientology and more credence than any other religion.
To me, all religions do the same thing, convince others on how they should behave and think based on unfounded beliefs.

All that being said, I also have no issue with anyone's belief in their chosen religion. So, if you are a Scientologist, good for you. I hope you find the contentment you need to live with inner peace.

John, thank you for sharing. I just sent that over to Tony Ortega. I am curious to get his opinion on it.

People have tried filing a similar lawsuit here in the US but the Court of Appeals shot it down.

That's what the COS is doing. They are buying property like crazy and when they open you go by there and there is never anyone in there. It's one big scam.

Wow, that was quick. I copied Tony Ortega on the article you posted John and he replied with the article listed below..... Mr. Ortega is a leading expert on the abuses and criminal activity of Scientology and David Miscavige and exposing them. He already covered the article you posted on his website The Underground Bunker.

https://tonyortega.org/2019/01/09/government-comes-down-hard-on-scientology-in-canada-where-worker-abuse-matters/?fbclid=IwAR0D2egq_sX9RHAxl6m1QV2QSHMYV11-haH7wpjkV7gLklOWd-CyKz2lTes

Did you notice what he named the evil Alien race in that book and movie? They were a play on the work Psychiatrist.

HHHMMMMmmmmmm.......

a religion that was started by a science fiction/fantasy writer who actually wrote a book on what he would do if he started a religion....??????


I DO have to admit,though...

it makes JUST AS MUCH sense as the belief that a jewish zombie that was his own father can make you live forever if you symbolically eat his flesh,and telepathically accept him as your master so that he can remove an evil force from your soul that is present in humanity because the rib woman was convinced by the talking snake to eat from the magical tree!!!

I think that the simple fact that there is absolutely no evidence that ANY of 'gods',or 'supreme beings' exist,except for the fact that a HUMAN BEING who has NEVER met or seen them,or even KNOWS anybody that knows anybody that knows anybody that knows anybody [TIMES A MILLION!!] who has ever met,or seen them tells you that they are real pretty much disproves ALL religions,doesnt it?
[including scientology!!]

I can tell you that the sky is green,and that fire doesn't REALLY burn you if you sit down in it and go to sleep,but,even if I write a book claiming that,and get a 100 million other people to repeat this story,that STILL doesn't mean that it is true.
it just means that there are 100 million people out there who are repeating something thst they heard FROM ANOTHER HUMAN BEING who has an overactive imagination,and is probably trying to manipulate you for their own purposes.
[like L Ron Hubbard!!]

L. Ron Hubbard, the guy who wrote 'Dianetics',
as well as, other books Scientology bases their religion
on...

Adamantly stated, that he didn't want anyone
"creating" a religion, based on his writings.


I do try, not to disparage anyone's faith,
or claim of a faith.
I have nothing negative,
or positive, to say about them.

Fake religion.

yeah, plus there are 'other' references that can be gleaned from the work.


Yeah, I really didn't and haven't associated Scientology with LRH except in the proclaimed accountings by the followers.
Makes me think that if he were alive right now, he would disown the lot of them.
This makes me realize that people are batshiat crazy when it comes to belief systems.
But, if it gives you the inner peace you need for you to live life, who am I to criticize?
I mean, no matter which religion you subscribe to, its a purely personal endeavor or you are just a gullible fool.

If your belief system isn't giving you the inner peace for a contented life, I only ask why? But, really, its all your own decisions to believe what you will.

Personally, I have found that reality is the best for me. That's because reality is reality no matter who believes it and you can depend on it no matter the circumstances. It doesn't need elaborate explanations to explain it because it is whether it can be explained or not. It requires nothing and delivers nothing but itself.