Guys, it's not that I dislike digression, but I think it'd be better if we stick to the subject.

My thread was never about the existence of God(s) or not. I leave that to anyone's opinion, and the fact there's been many religions throughout history proves people might believe in God(s), and not share the same religions. After all, Polynesians, Africans, Asians,or more recently Aztecs, all believed they knew the truth with similar fierce.

The subject was about the roots of modern religions, and never about God(s), which is a radically different.

Well, sticking to the subject then, I think that Pantheism is the only religion that can be fully understood and believed without any need for faith.

Pantheism is simply the view that the universe is God. It’s pretty obvious that we evolved out of the universe, and that we are this universe (after all, where else would we have come from?).

When we die there is no where to go but back into the universe. And this necessarily includes everything that we are. Our entire essence. There is no need to make up any fictitious deities or places such as heaven or hell. With pantheism what you see is what you get.

It’s the only religion that doesn’t require faith. However, it does require some ability to think.

I find it extremely odd that so many people reject Pantheism because they can’t comprehend it, yet they will believe in the most outrageous fairytale of mythological deities who fight for possession of their souls to be taken away to unseen places called heaven and hell.

To me, the idea that we came out of the universe, and return to it, again and again in a process of eternal reincarnation has much more observational evidence behind it, and requires no outrageous fairytales of jealous deities who fight for the possession of the souls of flawed inherently sinful men.

I mean, when you stop and think about it, such a scenario is outrageously comical. Jealous deities that no one has ever actually seen! Yet people would rather believe in those kinds of silly fairytales rather than just embracing what’s right before their very eyes.

To view the universe as god would force us to cherish the planet we live on as being our very mother! She gave birth to us, as did the rest of the universe via the elements created in the stars. The universe would be cherished as our creator!

Instead, we worship idols of dead men and spit on the planet that has given us our very life.

We have turned our back on god to worship idols. We have become a species of idol worshipers using ancient mythological doctrines as a basis for bigotry and judgment. We have ended up doing precisely what many of these doctrines warned us not to do!

We have turned our back on the one true god, the universe, our mother, our REAL creator!

No faith required, just open your eyes and see.

IN MY OPINION THERE ARE SOME RELIGIONS OUT THERE THAT DONT MAKE SENSE AT ALL, AND THERE ARE SOME THAT ARE BELIEVABLE. I AMA CHRISTIAN MYSELF, AND ALSO IN MY OPINION, CATHOLICS ARE KINDAS STUPID. THEY BELIEVE THAT ITEMS SUCH AS CROSSES CAN PROTECT YOU FROM POSSESION. AND, ASLO, SOMETHING ELSE THAT REALLY DOESNT MAKE SENSE ABOUT THE CATHOLIC FAITH (JUST SO YOU KNOW I LEARNED THIS FROMA FRIEND WHO WAS CATHOLIC) CATHOLICS ALSO BELIEVE THAT IF YOU DIE WITH SOME SORT OF PENNAT OR NECKLACE, OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES, ANYWAYS THEY BELIEVE IF YOU DIE WITH IT ON YOU, YOU AUTOMATICALLY FO TO HEAVEN WHICH COMPLETELY CONTRADICTS THEY'RE BELIEF IN JESUS CHRIST.

Christ is not a myth.

Robm wrote:
“An important side note, however, is that current scientific research and archeological exploration continues to prove more and more of what is written in the bible.”

This is totally irrelevant for those who believe that the Bible was written by men without any inspiration from god. They don’t have any doubt that the stories were sparked by real events and real places. So evidence of such things is not the slightest bit impressive, on the contrary it’s expected. That in no way gives any credence to the claims of divine intervention.

So the idea that such evidence supports the religious connotations of the Bible is totally without merit. It’s unimpressive. Even the stories of Greek Mythology were often sparked by real events, that doesn’t give their divine claims any merit at all. Same holds true for the Bible.

Robm wrote:
:Now, my questions for everyone who doesn't believe are:
If god is all powerful, could he not have made thousands of reasons for you to doubt?”

Why would God want to make reasons for us to doubt?

Robm wrote:
“If he wants you to live in faith, and not proof, would he not have in wisdom done so?”

There is absolutely no reason whatsoever why any human should have faith in any particular religion over any other. So if God wants us to have faith how are we supposed to know which religion to have faith in?

Why would God play guessing games with us?

“If he could create the earth, could he not create the earth with dinosaur bones, evidence that rocks are millions of years old, and anything else you want to mention?”

Why would God want to deceive us? You’re suggesting that God would favor someone who rejects actual experience in favor of superstitions and myths? Is there anywhere in the Bible where it suggests that men should deny actual experience in favor of believing in mythology?

Robm wrote:
”Just some thinking material for anyone who wants a different perspective.”

These are the most absurd suggestions I’ve heard in a long time.

A person would have to believe that God is pretty pathetic to believe that God purposefully deceives us just to test our faith in believing arbitrary mythologies over actual real experience.

This kind of thinking belongs in the Dark Ages, because if everyone was this naïve that’s precisely where we’d be forever.

Abra.....

As it is your belief, to believe that the Bible was written without the inspiration of God....

I Believe it was soley the Word of God written by man. And also remember that alot of these men that wrote the Word of God were very educated men. For example Isaiah was from a very distinguished Jewish Family. His education is evident in his impressive vocabulary and style. Matthew was a tax collector of the Roman empire.....Nehemiah was one of the King's advisors.....Jonah was a prophet of the Northern Kingdom. Ezra was a direct priestly descendant of Aaron through Eleazar, phineahas, and Zadok. He studied and practiced and taught the law of the Lord as an educated scribe. So I tend to believe that what was written did not have to many mistakes, and I also feel that even in the re-writing of the scared book, that God would of not let translations be so wrong as to change what he wanted the world to know through his words.

Relevant I would say yes.

Greek mythology

Greek mythology The body of traditional tales concerning the gods, heroes, and rituals of the ancient Greeks. Critical Greeks, such as Plato in the 5th-4th century BCE, recognized
the considerable element of fiction in the myths.

God never ever makes reasons for us to doubt satan does.

I also say to you and anyone else. Religion is not important....what is is the understanding knowing that God gave his only son to die on the cross for our sins. God wants us to have unconditional faith in Him and His word.

God knows all....He is, was, and always will be. He doesn't guess about anything.

God will test faith....as it is said he will plant you in the desert and test your faith. He tested the faith of many throughout time. Including his Son Jesus Christ, Moses, Noah, and these men kept their faith and believed in everything that Gold told them.

Have you ever Abra picked up a Bible, read it, grasped it, applied it to your life???????????

coryM18
thanks for calling me stupid.
but stupid is not the one who is being called stupid, stupid is the who call someone elwe stupid without reasonable cause.
revise your definitions my friend

Feralcatlady wrote:
“Have you ever Abra picked up a Bible, read it, grasped it, applied it to your life???????????”

More than you can ever know.

I actually have higher morals that what Christianity teaches anyway so why would I want to apply the Bible to my life? To do so would only bring me down.

Just look at how many bigoted hateful Christians there are. The Bible creates monsters!

One guy even uses it as an excuse to punish little children and tell them that they are horrible sinners giving them a guilt complex and plaguing them with unnecessary shame and paranoia for the rest of their lives.

The book is pure evil and makes monsters out of people. You can see examples of this all over the place.

I try to save people from this terrible fate.

I want to thank you Feralcatlady for her words.
She is making a point that i have been trying to make for several months without coming out with the strong idea of hell, as some other people do.
She has more eloquency than i do.

James wrote:

The Bible creates monsters!
Don't generalize, I'm not a monster. The way you word your opinions tend to generalize. First, mistake.
My dear friend I honestly believe you failure comes from an excesive use of math. In math and algebra we tend to generalized things and concepts.

James wrote:

I try to save people from this terrible fate.
Dear friend, don't try save me, let me burn in the eternal hell that your beliefs are condemning me.

James wrote:

The book is pure evil and makes monsters out of people. You can see examples of this all over the place.

Then again my brother you are failing. You are seeing what seems to be. You need to go to the roots. the other day I told you that i would invite you to my country. Don't worry for the expenses, I would pay for the ticket, u can stay in my parents house, and spend a week with our activities in my church.
I promise you that you will keep being a non-christian because my intention is not make u change ur beliefs, my intention is stop you from generalizing.

Your friend.

Miguel

P.D. You are always going to be my friend, but i will always point out anytime you fail with generalization.

Miguel wrote:
”The way you word your opinions tend to generalize. First, mistake.”

Sorry Miguel, this is your mistake. I never said that every one who reads the Bible is a monster, I simply said that the Bible creates monsters.

I made you generalization, YOU DID!

Miguel wrote:
“Dear friend, don't try save me, let me burn in the eternal hell that your beliefs are condemning me.”

I’m not trying to save you personally in the same sense that Christians try to save people. I’m speaking about doing my part to help humanity as a whole move out of the dark ages. I’ve told you on many occasions that I don’t care what you personally believe.

Miguel wrote:
“my intention is stop you from generalizing”

I don’t generalize. Are you a monster? If not, then I wasn’t talking about you right?

Besides, when Christians say that Christianity is the ONLY religion and that Christ is the ONLY God, they are tossing out a blanket generalization that all other religions are wrong. Then when someone suggests that maybe Christianity might be wrong they start crying,…

STOP MAKING GENERALIZATIONS!



Actually Miguel it is the continued rhetoric of Christians who proclaim that he Bible is the ONLY word of God and that Jesus is the ONLY way, etc, etc, etc, that BEGS for people to denounce Christianity.

Christianity is CONSTANTLY denouncing everyone else’s religion by claiming that it is the ONLY word of God!

When Christians stop claiming that their religion is the ONLY one, then I’ll stop claiming that mine is the ONLY one.

After all Feralcatlady has already denounced other religious figures to claim that Jesus is the ONLY one who is still valid. That’s the same as making a blanket statement that all other God’s are wrong. So jump on her for a while if you don’t like generalizations.

Touché

I take it some of you out there cannot understand what "FAITH" is and why we have it. To believe in something regardless of whatever rewards or consequences. You seek knowledge because it is your nature, yet even man himself can lie to others as well as himself. Man is imperfect, yet you want to trust in his words. This is why some of us choose to have "FAITH". There are some of us who have experienced things on numerous occasions to refuse they are just a coincidence. If you have no experienced these things, or cannot understand what that must be like, then I am sorry.

Before going off and trying to blow up the idea of religion, perhaps you can use your knowledge to explain why the earth is the only planet like it is in the solar system. Why earth was designed specifically for life. Why we have feelings. Why we all look different. Why we have dreams. Why all of our goals are not the same. Why we like to have sex. Why we like to laugh. Why doing certain things feel good to us. Why we have oxygen. Why we need oxygen. How we can survive on earth. Why we have happiness. Why we have anger. And so on........

Sorry, but I truly cannot understand why someone would go through great lengths to even waste their time trying to prove religions are based off lies, when they themselves never believed or even wanted to. It is like a straight man sleeping with many gay men to expose and frown upon gay sex. Time wasted and meaningless.

you have not kill me yet, gentleman.

James wrote:

Sorry Miguel, this is your mistake. I never said that every one who reads the Bible is a monster, I simply said that the Bible creates monsters.

No, Sir. The bible per se does not create monster (genera;ization). The one who reads becomes a monster for his/her own choice.
I read the same bible, and i have gotten an absolutely different message from the fundamentalists. Why?
Because of my life experience as a christian.
The only thing in which i will agree with you, is in the fact that not only christians will be saved.
(And go ahead other christians crucify me for this one)
I refuse to believe that the aborigin from africa or australia or any human being who in his/her entire life hasn't been expose to the word of my Lord is going to be condemned.
For me, and I strongly believe this, the ones who are going to be condemned are those who have blasfemy against the Holy Spirit.

ahh sooo need strumpets and crumpets and tea in here...ego's getting bruised

my ego is a little one
but if u want we can have a mudd party

ahh you know how ilove mudd parties my brother!!

Abracadabra,

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One guy even uses it as an excuse to punish little children and tell them that they are horrible sinners giving them a guilt complex and plaguing them with unnecessary shame and paranoia for the rest of their lives.
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I asked you to stop, so now I have reported you. I have never told my daughter that she's a sinner, she's six years old and wouldn't understand. But I have disciplined her when she was disobiedient. You took what I said out of context and you should be ashamed. You are the first person I have ever reported on this site, you have reached a new low in posting.

omg

Spider wrote:
"I asked you to stop, so now I have reported you."

I have no clue what you are talking about Spider. If you have some kind of paranoia or guilt complex I suggest you seek professional help. There was no mention of anyone specific in the post you’ve quoted. I just said “some guy”. Why you think it might apply to you is totally beyond me.

"I actually have higher morals that what Christianity teaches anyway so why would I want to apply the Bible to my life?"

"Why you think it might apply to you is totally beyond me. "

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Exodus 20:16
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.
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