Topic: Where in the Genesis is Jesus - part 2
no photo
Fri 01/06/12 01:26 PM

Those are not concepts lol. God is our father because he created us, not through some concept or anything of such.


nope...according to your belief only Adam was created.....everyone else including you popped out of a womb or a rib

this is why calling God your Father is regarded as a concept not actuality

CowboyGH's photo
Fri 01/06/12 07:49 PM



Again, who ever said anything about running to a doctor for being sick. I have never once ran to the doctor for being sick. What in the world are you talking about?


didn't you claim that you took medication .....perhaps it was for amnesia


Never claimed that.

CowboyGH's photo
Fri 01/06/12 07:51 PM


Those are not concepts lol. God is our father because he created us, not through some concept or anything of such.


nope...according to your belief only Adam was created.....everyone else including you popped out of a womb or a rib

this is why calling God your Father is regarded as a concept not actuality


God creates us in the womb.

Jeremiah 1:5

5Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

s1owhand's photo
Sat 01/07/12 02:38 AM


Genesis 1
In The Beginning God created The Heavens and The Earth..


Since Jesus is God then there is your reference to Jesus in Genesis.
Doesn't matter what you call God. It's still God.

laugh

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 04:12 AM
Edited by MorningSong on Sat 01/07/12 04:47 AM

This will help explain :


..............: "If Jesus was God, why did He say "The Father is greater than I" in John 14:28?"................


Answer: The phrase “the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28) was spoken by Jesus during the upper room discourse, and the greater context is the promising of the Holy Spirit to the disciples after Jesus’ resurrection.

Jesus says repeatedly that He is doing the Father’s will, thereby implying that He is somehow subservient to the Father.


The question then becomes how can Jesus be equal to God when by His own admission He is subservient to the will of God? The answer to this question lies within the nature of the incarnation.



During the incarnation, Jesus was TEMPORARILY “made lower than the angels” (Hebrews 2:9), which refers to Jesus’ status. The doctrine of the incarnation says that the second Person of the Trinity took on human flesh.


Therefore, for all intents and purposes, Jesus was fully human and “made lower than the angels.” However, Jesus is FULLY DIVINE ,TOO .


By taking on human nature, Jesus did NOT relinquish His divine nature—GOD CANNOT STOP BEIN GOD. How do we reconcile the fact that the second Person of the Trinity is fully divine yet fully human and by definition “lower than the angels”?


The answer to that question can be found in Philippians 2:5-11. When the second Person of the Trinity took on human form, something amazing occurred. Christ “made himself nothing.”


This phrase has generated more ink than almost any other phrase in the Bible. In essence, what it means is that Jesus voluntarily RELINGUISHED the prerogative of freely exercising His divine attributes and subjected Himself to the will of the Father WHILE ON EARTH.


Another thing to consider is the fact that subservience in ROLE does NOT equate to subservience in ESSENCE !!!


For example, consider an employer/employee relationship. The employer has the right to make demands of the employee, and the employee has the obligation to serve the employer. The roles clearly define a subservient relationship.

However, both people are still human beings and share in the same human nature. There is no difference between the two as to their essence; they stand as equals. The fact that one is an employer and the other is an employee does nothing to alter the essential equality of these two individuals as human beings.


The same can be said of the members of the Trinity. All three members (Father, Son and Holy Spirit) are essentially EQUAL; i.e., they are ALL DIVINE IN NATURE .

However, in the grand plan of redemption, they play certain roles, and these roles define authority and subservience. The Father commands the Son, and the Father and the Son command the Holy Spirit.


Therefore, the fact that the Son took on a human nature and made Himself subservient to the Father IN NO WAY DENIES THE DEITY OF THE SON , NOR DOES IT DIMINISH HIS ESENTIAL EQUALITY WITH THE FATHER !!!

The “greatness” spoken of in this verse, then, relates to ROLE, NOT to ESSENCE.


:heart::heart::heart:




gotquestions.org




no photo
Sat 01/07/12 04:32 AM



Genesis 1
In The Beginning God created The Heavens and The Earth..


Since Jesus is God then there is your reference to Jesus in Genesis.
Doesn't matter what you call God. It's still God.

laugh


WHY IS JESUS GOD?

BECAUSE JESUS IS EQUALLY AS MUCH GOD , AS THE FATHER AND

HOLY SPIRIT IS GOD...BECAUSE THE 3 PERSONS WITHIN THE ONE

GOD,ARE ALL GOD.


THERE ARE 3 PERSONS

IN

ONLY

ONE

GOD .


ONE ENTITY ONLY!!!

ALL 3 PERSONS (FATHER,SON, HOLY SPRIT)MAKE UP ONLY ONLY ONLY ONE ENTITYY !!!

ONE SUPREME BEING !!

ONE GOD ALMIGHTY!!!

THERE IS ONLY ONE GOD WE SERVE!!!!!


{ REPEATING THIS BECAUSE I AM PRAYING GOD WILL MAKE THIS VERY

CLEAR TO ALL ).



:heart::heart::heart:

.

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 04:46 AM
Edited by MorningSong on Sat 01/07/12 04:54 AM
FAITH TO BELIEVE IN GOD, DOES NOT COME FROM MAN,BUT

ONLY FROM GOD !!!

NO MAN CAN GENERATE THAT KIND OF FAITH ON HIS OWN .

GOD IS THE ONLY ONE WHO BRINGS FORTH FAITH TO BELIEVE IN GOD!!!!!

HOW?

THRU HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD.

(NOTICE ALSO HOW HEARING COMES, BY THE HEARING OF THE WORD).


FAITH NEVER COMES FROM MAN..IF MAN COULD GENERATE THAT KIND OF

FAITH TO BELIEVE, THEN THAT WOULD BE LIKE SAYING

THAT MAN COULD GET SAVED BY HIS VERY OWN EFFORTS !!!.

IMOSSIBLE!!!


OUR OWN WORKS AND OWN EFFORTS CANNOT EVER CREATE THE GOD KIND

OF FAITH TO GET US SAVED.

EVER!!!!

FAITH COMES FROM GOD ONLY...THRU THE HEARING OF HIS WORD.

FAITH COMES BY HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD !!!!


NOTICE !!!!

FAITH COMES BY HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD....NOT BY

HEARING MAN'S OPINIONS ON A FORUM...OR BY HEARING OTHER

INTERPRETATIONS....BUT ONLY ONLY ONLY BY THE HEARING OF THE

WORD OF GOD !!!!


THE ENTRANCE OF GOD'S WORD GIVETH LIGHT !!!

AGAIN....NO MAN CAN GET THE GOD KIND OF FAITH TO BELIEVE ,BY HIS OWN EFFORTS !!!!

EVER !!!

IT COMES ONLY FROM GOD.



:heart::heart::heart:

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 04:58 AM




Again, who ever said anything about running to a doctor for being sick. I have never once ran to the doctor for being sick. What in the world are you talking about?


didn't you claim that you took medication .....perhaps it was for amnesia


Never claimed that.


so when you posted that you were in a car accident and had medical issues and took medication...it was all a lie


s1owhand's photo
Sat 01/07/12 05:24 AM

Genesis 1
In The Beginning God created The Heavens and The Earth..


Since Jesus is God then there is your reference to Jesus in Genesis.

The reference to Jesus is in the first line of Genesis.

yawn

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 05:29 AM
Edited by MorningSong on Sat 01/07/12 06:28 AM
..............Question: "How can salvation be not of works when faith is required? Isn't believing a work?"...............


Answer: Our salvation depends SOLELY UPON JESUS CHRIST. He is our substitute, taking sin’s penalty (2 Corinthians 5:21); He is our Savior from sin (John 1:29); He is the AUTHOR AND FINISHER OF OUR FAITH (Hebrews 12:2).

The work necessary to provide salvation was FULLY ACCOMPLISHED BY JESUS HIMSELF, who lived a perfect life, took God’s judgment for sin, and rose again from the dead (Hebrews 10:12).



The Bible is quite clear that our own works do NO NOT NOT help merit salvation !!! We are saved “NOT because of righteous things we had done” (Titus 3:5).


“NOT by works” (Ephesians 2:9). “There is no one righteous, not even one” (Romans 3:10).

This means that offering sacrifices, keeping the commandments, going to church, being baptized, and other good deeds are INCAPABLE OF SAVING ANYONE !!!

No matter how “good” we are, we can never measure up to God’s standard of holiness by our own works(Romans 3:23; Matthew 19:17; Isaiah 64:6).


FAITH is declared to be the SOLE condition for salvation (John 1:12; Acts 16:31).WE ARE SAVED BY FAITH AND NOT BY WORKS.



Grace is God’s giving us something we CANNOT EARN or deserve. According to Romans 11:6, “works” of any kind DESTROYS grace—the idea is that a worker earns payment, while the recipient of grace simply receives it, unearned.

Since salvation is ALL of grace, it CANNOT BE EARNED. Faith, therefore, is a non-work. Faith cannot truly be considered a “work,” or else it would destroy grace. (See also Romans 4—Abraham’s salvation was dependent on FAITH IN GOD , as opposed to any work he performed.)


Suppose someone anonymously sent me a check for $1,000,000. The money is mine if I want it, but I still must endorse the check. In no way can signing my name be considered earning the million dollars—the endorsement is a non-work.

I can never boast about becoming a millionaire through sheer effort or my own business savvy. No, the million dollars was simply a gift, and signing my name was the only way to RECEIVE it. Similarly, exercising FAITH is the only way to receive the generous gift of God, and faith cannot be considered a work worthy of the gift.

TRUE FAITH cannot be considered a work because TRUE FAITH involves a CESSATION OF OUR WORKS IN THE FLESH .

TRUE FAITH has as its object JESUS AND HIS WORK ON OUR BEHALF(Matthew 11:28-29; Hebrews 4:10).


To take this a step further, TRUE FAITH CANNOT be considered a work because
EVEN FAITH IS A GIFT FROM GOD,AND NOT SOMETHING WE PRODUCE ON OUR OWN !!!!!

“For it is by GRACE you have been SAVED, THROUGH FAITH—and this NOT from yourselves, it is the GIFT OF GOD” (Ephesians 2:8).

“NO ONE can COME to me UNLESS the Father who sent me DRAWS him” (John 6:44).

Praise the Lord for HIS POWER TO SAVE and for HIS GRACE to make SALVATION A REALITY !!!!


:heart::heart::heart:




gotquestions.org



no photo
Sat 01/07/12 05:42 AM
Edited by MorningSong on Sat 01/07/12 05:52 AM



Those are not concepts lol. God is our father because he created us, not through some concept or anything of such.


nope...according to your belief only Adam was created.....everyone else including you popped out of a womb or a rib

this is why calling God your Father is regarded as a concept not actuality


God creates us in the womb.

Jeremiah 1:5

5Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


God CREATED EVERYTHING THERE WAS TO CREATE, in

SIX DAYS.....and rested on the SEVENTH day.

God made everything to REPRODUCE AFTER ITS OWN KIND.




"FORMED " does NOT have the same meaning as "CREATE".

God CREATED the first man ADAM .

God CREATED Eve from the RIB ( or side) of Adam.


God FORMED us in the Womb(all people that came AFTER adam and eve) .



:heart::heart::heart:

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 05:45 AM

God creates us in the womb.


God creates Adam.. you were formed from a seed

you're confusing create and form

according to your belief Humans didn't exist until God supposedly "creates" one

Eve was "formed" from a human and all other life was not created or formed by God but came from Adam and Eve's incestous seed

and this is why God is not your Father ....simply because you are not from his seed ...

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 05:53 AM

Jeremiah 1:5

5Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.


Cowboy...perhaps it was unwise for you to present this passage....it tells of how Jeremiah and everyone is "The Word" that was turned Flesh ....it also displays how there is no "Free Will" only God's Will


no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:03 AM
Since Adam and Eve were the first (and only) human

beings, their children would have no other choice than to

intermarry. God did not forbid inter-family marriage until much

later when there were enough people to make intermarriage

unnecessary (Leviticus 18:6-18).


The reason that incest today often results in genetic abnormalities

is that when two people of similar genetics (i.e., a brother and

sister) have children together, there is a high risk of their

recessive characteristics becoming dominant.


When people from different families have children, it is highly

unlikely that both parents will carry the same recessive traits.

The human genetic code has become increasingly “polluted” over the

centuries as genetic defects are multiplied, amplified, and passed

down from generation to generation.


Adam and Eve did not have any genetic defects, and that enabled

them and the first few generations of their descendants to have a

far greater quality of health than we do now. Adam and Eve’children

had few, if any, genetic defects.

As a result, it was safe for them to intermarry.


:heart::heart::heart:





gotquestions.org




no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:06 AM



Genesis 1
In The Beginning God created The Heavens and The Earth..


Since Jesus is God then there is your reference to Jesus in Genesis.
Doesn't matter what you call God. It's still God.

laugh


"can the father create a cross that Jesus can't lift"

that simply question displays how those that try to claim that Jesus is God is ....er....perhaps...er....delusional?

but anyway...the quest is to find where Jesus unquestionably indisputably makes his first biblical debut....

so far there is evidence that he was perhaps the serpent in the Garden ....the serpent was the first in the bible to used parables and could hold a pretty good conversation

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:15 AM
..............Question: "If God knew that Satan would rebel and Adam and Eve would sin, why did He create them?"................



Answer: This is a two-part question. The first part is “Did God know Satan would rebel and Adam and Eve would sin?” The answer lies in what the Bible teaches about God’s knowledge. We know from Scripture that God is omniscient, which literally means “all-knowing.” Job 37:16; Psalm 139:2-4, 147:5; Proverbs 5:21; Isaiah 46:9-10; and 1 John 3:19-20 leave no doubt that God’s knowledge is infinite and that He knows everything that has happened in the past, is happening now, and will happen in the future.



Looking at some of the superlatives in these verses—“perfect in knowledge”; “his understanding has no limit”; “he knows everything”—it is clear that God’s knowledge is not merely greater than our own, but it is infinitely greater. He knows all things in totality. Isaiah 46:10 declares He not only knows everything, but He controls everything as well. How else could He “make known” to us what would happen in the future and state unequivocally that His plans will come to pass? So, did God know that Adam and Eve were going to sin? Did He know Lucifer would rebel against Him and become Satan? Yes! Absolutely! Were they out of His control at any time? Absolutely not. If God’s knowledge is not perfect, then there is a deficiency in His nature. Any deficiency in God’s nature means He cannot be God, for God’s very essence requires the perfection of all His attributes. Therefore, the answer to the first question must, by necessity, be “yes.”



Moving on to the second part of the question, “Why did God create Satan and Adam and Eve knowing ahead of time they were going to sin?” This question is a little trickier because we are asking a “why” question to which the Bible does not usually provide comprehensive answers. Despite that, we should be able to come to a limited understanding if we examine some biblical passages. To begin, we have already seen that God is omniscient and nothing can happen outside of His knowledge. So, if God knew that Satan would rebel and fall from heaven and that Adam and Eve would sin, yet He created them anyway, it must mean that the fall of mankind was part of God’s sovereign plan from the beginning. No other answer makes sense given what we have been saying thus far.



Now we must be careful to note that Adam and Eve falling into sin does not mean that God is the author of sin, nor that he tempted Adam and Eve to sin (James 1:13). The fall serves the purpose of God’s overall plan for creation and mankind. This, again, must be the case, or else the fall of mankind would never have happened.



If we consider what some theologians call the "meta-narrative" (or overarching story line) of Scripture, we see that biblical history can be roughly divided into three main sections: 1) paradise (Genesis 1–2); 2) paradise lost (Genesis 3 – Revelation 20); and 3) paradise regained (Revelation 21–22). By far the largest part of the narrative is devoted to moving from paradise lost to paradise regained. At the center of this meta-narrative is the cross. The cross was planned from the very beginning (Acts 2:23). It was foreknown and foreordained that Christ would go to the cross and give His life as a ransom for many (Matthew 20:28)—those chosen by God’s foreknowledge and predestined to be His people (Ephesians 1:4-5).



Reading Scripture very carefully and taking what has been said so far, we are led to the following conclusions:

1. The rebellion of Satan and the fall of mankind were foreknown and foreordained by God.
2. Those who would become the people of God, the elect, were foreknown and foreordained by God.
3. The crucifixion of Christ, as atonement for God’s people, was foreknown and foreordained by God.



So, we are left with the following questions: Why create mankind with the knowledge of the fall? Why create mankind knowing that only some would be "saved?" Why send Jesus knowingly to die for a people that knowingly fell into sin? From man’s perspective, it does not make sense. If the meta-narrative moves from paradise, to paradise lost, to paradise regained, why not just go straight to paradise regained and avoid the whole paradise lost interlude?



The only conclusion we can come to, in view of the above assertions, is that God’s purpose was to create a world in which His glory could be manifest in all its fullness. The glory of God is the overarching goal of creation. In fact, it is the overarching goal of everything He does. The universe was created to display God’s glory (Psalm 19:1), and the wrath of God is revealed against those who fail to glorify God (Romans 1:23). Our sin causes us to fall short of God’s glory (Romans 3:23), and in the new heaven and new earth, the glory of God is what will provide light (Revelation 21:23). The glory of God is manifest when His attributes are on perfect display, and the story of redemption is part of that.



The best place to see this in Scripture is Romans 9:19-24. Wrath and mercy display the riches of God’s glory, and you cannot get either without the fall of mankind. Therefore, all of these actions—fall, election, redemption, atonement—serve the purpose of glorifying God. When man fell into sin, God’s mercy was immediately displayed in not killing him on the spot. God’s patience and forbearance were also on display as mankind fell deeper into sin prior to the flood. God’s justice and wrath were on display as He executed judgment during the flood, and God’s mercy and grace were demonstrated as He saved Noah and his family. God’s wrath and justice will be revealed in the future when He deals with Satan once and for all (Revelation 20:7-10).



The ultimate exhibition of God’s glory was at the cross where His wrath, justice, and mercy met. The righteous judgment of all sin was executed at the cross, and God’s grace was on display in pouring His wrath for sin on His Son, Jesus, instead of on us. God’s love and grace are on display in those whom He has saved (John 3:16; Ephesians 2:8-9). In the end, God will be glorified as His chosen people worship Him for all eternity with the angels, and the wicked will also glorify God as His justice and righteousness will finally be vindicated by the eternal punishment of all unrepentant sinners (Philippians 2:11). None of this could have come to pass without the rebellion of Satan and the fall of Adam and Eve.



The classic objection to this position is that God’s foreknowledge and foreordination of the fall damages man’s freedom. In other words, if God created mankind with full knowledge of the impending fall into sin, how can man be responsible for his sin? The best answer to this question can be found in the Westminster Confession of Faith chapter III:



“God, from all eternity, did, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely, and unchangeably ordain whatsoever comes to pass; yet so, as thereby neither is God the author of sin, nor is violence offered to the will of the creatures; nor is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established” (WFC, III.1)



What this is saying is that God ordains future events in such a way that our freedom and the working of secondary causes (e.g., laws of nature) are preserved. Theologians call this “concurrence.” God’s sovereign will flows concurrently with our free choices in such a way that our free choices always result in the carrying out of God’s will (by “free choices” we mean that our choices are not coerced by outside influences).



To summarize, God knew that Satan would rebel and that Adam and Eve would sin in the Garden of Eden. With that knowledge, God still created Lucifer and Adam and Eve because creating them and ordaining the fall was part of His sovereign plan to manifest His glory in all its fullness. Even though the fall was foreknown and foreordained, our freedom in making choices is not violated because our free choices are the means by which God’s will is carried out.

gotquestions.org




:heart::heart::heart:


no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:15 AM

During the incarnation, Jesus was TEMPORARILY “made lower than the angels”


an entity that can lose his super powers or have them taken away is not a God ...or reliable

why?

just in case someone try to nailed you to a cross and you at that point in time just happen to lose your super powers ...that would explain why Jesus said... My God My God why hath thou forsaken me ...

Jesus spent most of his time trying to talk his way out of being stone....now if he had super powers he wouldn't have to worry about that


no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:19 AM

..............Question: "How can salvation be not of works when faith is required? Isn't believing a work?"...............


Answer: Our salvation depends SOLELY UPON JESUS CHRIST.


that places Jesus above the Father....which is blasphemy in the realm of Christianity

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:31 AM

Adam and Eve did not have any genetic defects, and that enabled

them and the first few generations of their descendants to have a

far greater quality of health than we do now. Adam and Eve’children

had few, if any, genetic defects.

As a result, it was safe for them to intermarry.


:heart::heart::heart:





gotquestions.org






Adam and Eve spawned the first murderer...sure sounds like a genetic defect

God commanded Adam and Eve to committ incest and then deem it a sin

also God killed everyone in the great flood but those on Noah's Ark and they also had to re-populate the Earth by having sex with their relatives

those that claim that Jesus is God are basically saying that Jesus impregnanted his mother with his seed.....it's all about incest

either way God thrust man into incestous sin with the command "be fruitful and multiply"

no photo
Sat 01/07/12 06:36 AM
There is ONLY ONE God, Funches.

God the Father gave All Glory to His Son...but The Father ,Son and

Holy Spirit are still ONLY ONE GOD.

Our brain can't fanthom this in the natural, I understand.

The Son can't lift a rock heavier than the Father, because the

Father and Son,along with the Holy Spirit, are JUST ONE GOD.


flowerforyou:heart:flowerforyou


.