OH...speaking of researching state-by-state.

-started in Texas because it's where I live.

While going through everyone on Death Row here, I saw one name that was familiar to me. Clicked to read her story and was shocked to see this woman is still alive.

She killed a 6 month old baby while she was babysitting. She had been friends with the childs parents for years, so they trusted her. She claimed she accidentally dropped him, then was nervous about what happened so she buried him somewhere and fled the state.

I remember this case so well because during that time they were asking for volunteers to walk through fields to help find the baby. I was one of hundreds of people who spent hours walking through different places, all nervous of what we may find; always had that painful feeling inside too.

The day we found out they had found the babysitter and she told them what happened it was so sad. She drew them a map to where he was buried at.

When the medical examiner performed the autopsy he said there was no way the baby died from being dropped 4 feet. Stated the entire back of his skull was shattered, as if he had fallen from a two story building.

I typed in this womans name in google and found a website dedicated to her, asking people to write to her and where they post letters written from her. Out of curiosity I did read a few, but that's all.

She went on and on about how rough life is for her, asking people to please add money to her account there because the people in Texas do not take care of inmates as everyone thinks. Talked about things she has missed out on, daughters graduation for one.

Talked about God and how strong her faith is; (which, yes, in my opinion - after reading MANY letters from other inmates that can be found online - they ALL "find religion" once they're on Death Row -- too bad they didn't find Him earlier, right?)

Honestly, the website, letters, people posting nice words TO her, about her, just seemed so wrong to me. I did email the person who is running the website and, well; you can guess how that went.

All I could think of was the baby's parents, family and friends the days right after they learned their child had been murdered. It was 1994, but I remember that time as if it just happened. Was heartbreaking for everyone involved...

The person who runs this website actually had the nerve, at one time, to put the parents address on it. She asked people to write to them, to ask for forgiveness to the woman who killed their baby - to help get her off Death Row. (yea, can you believe that??)

There was a small notation that at the parents request their address was removed.

It was just one of MANY websites out there dedicated to those on Death Row.... portraying THEM as the "Victims".

It's shocking.

For it all the way..as long as they can prove 'em gulity..100%--which in most cases you dont see it happenin

I am against it. However, I have thought about how I would feel if someone killed a family member. I think my views might change if that were to happen.

Not necessarily, I have heard quite a few who do not agree with the death penalty who have lost a family member to a violent crime. They say tit for tat doesn't do anything for anyone and it doesn't bring back their loved one.

I didn't say they were 'coerced' into a confession or any wild suggestion like that...

I mean those who flat out confess, no question of their guilt.

If a confession guarentees you the needle then only the suicidal would confess whether they were guilty or not.

I agree! No more carnal knowledge of virgin women.

Frack humanity.

Very true, Furthermore, and in fact, if they are guilty, the confession may help them shake their feeling of guilt.



How can you tell? You're on the other side of the desk in the prison, interviewing the accused.

He may be protecting a wife, a son, a father.

He may be hearing voices.

He may be in a state of extreme agitation.

He may be feeling a religious forgiveness to the real murderer, even if he's not known by him, and undertaking the murderer's responsibility of accountability.

He may be just plain tired and not aware he's signing his own confession.

You don't know which, and you don't know if any.

A confession without proof is not a confession. If proof exists, no confession is necessary.

Ergo, convicting someone on the basis of his confession is wrong.

What does it mean to 'flat out confess'?

What do we really know about the circumstances and motivation for such statements? Coercion isn't the only factor here - a person might 'confess' because they have a death wish, or because they are protecting someone, because they were lied to in a plea bargain, or because they seek a sick kind of fame. I hear that people under stress can manufacturer memories of events which did not occur.

I think it is dangerously naive to think that a confession, any kind at all, guarantees guilt.

I don't mean to pick on your words, I was responding to something phrased like a generalization "those who actually confessed to what they were convicted of...no question of their guilt".


Edit: I think this idea that 'confession' correlates to 'guilt' tends to assume both honesty and psychological health; I'm not sure those are the kind of people who usually end up on death row.

That is a truely horrific story,these people on death row,and even all prisonors that have done ghastly things,sure some might feel bad?,they might think theve found the error of there ways?,but to truly forgive and be forgiven,one must be true to oneself?,and if they think for a milla-second that they deserve forgivness?,all that happens is that they have the time to sit and ponder,they dont change,those that get out re-offend,how many pedafiles do?,they get a slap on the wrist for the crime they commit and im speaking from a victims perspective,,from my past post,people that shock in such away that there a danger must be cull,ed.,humans are no better of diffrent than that dog that bit the child and got put down. What animals dont talk feel or understand?,can you understand a thai person when you dont know there language?,to all the people against,i take my hat of too,for i carnt understand your words and you must be a supirour race above me......

I personally think of it this way:

If you are there in the moment with the criminal, it is considered "right" to kill them in order to save someone else's life, correct?

Someone is about to kill you or your loved one, but you are able to kill them first - you would be thought of as a hero.

(by the majority of people)

BUT...

If, sadly, nobody is there - and an innocent person is killed by some evil twisted soul, "WE" as a society should pity them, forgive them, and pay to keep them alive year after year?

I would rather give my money to a cause that some good could come of it...

Instead of writing about how "wrong" it is to murder any person, etc...please go research some -- read about those on Death Row, look at their faces, read what they did.

Most are just plain evil, their eyes look empty - literally many gave me chills to get a tiny glimpse of who they are.

Say what you want...but I think, if given the chance, most would feel no sadness if someone was about to or did take away someone you love, about ending their life too.

Feel for the victims and their loved ones, not the criminals.

The more I research it, the stronger my beliefs are about this.

But not necessarily by the police, the District Attrney, the Jury and the Judge.

All of a sudden the Hero is a murderer.

And he will be put to death?

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Things cannot be safely decided in this world. Only in Hollywood, and Hollywood has poisoned most minds in the US by instilling their propaganda of depicting the world as a place of the "good" and the "bad", period. And the "ugly" of course. ("The beautiful people" -- beautiful is just a degree of ugly.)

Hollywood did an even worse justice to the People than all judges who did not give the death penalty to convicted murderers.

Wux, You make many good points regarding 'confessions'; we posted simultaneously.

This is a fascinating statement to take literally.

Ekkolost, what is forgiveness?

You know as horrible it is for someone to kill a child I still have to wonder how that stacks up against corporations that know they are selling products that will cause birth defects, cancer, asthma, brain death, and other miseries. Or corporations that run our public hospitals out of business. A government that makes one neighborhood school a model for the state and not five miles away send kids to school in condemed buildings that are a national disgrace. Or a population of stock holders that allow our jobs to be shipped over seas to sweat shops that enslave children. Or travel companies and internet servers that know they allow prostitution and porno and pedophiles to shop like they are at WalMart getting guaranteed low prices for babies. People want to get vengence when it doesn't endager their job, profit, or comfortable life.

Considering it cost more to execute them than it does to house them all their lives the cost defense is not a valid one.

Also self defense is quite a bit different than society planning and executing a human who may or may not be guilty. Our system is far from perfect and you can bet innocent blood has been shed by the state in execution style killing.

I think the difference between taking a life of a person IN THE COMMISSION of taking a life and taking their life after the fact is in current knowledge and intent.

If I take a life of someone who I am WITNESSING attempt to take a life. I have personal knowledge of what they have done and a duty to PROTECT the life they are trying to take.

After the crime is committed, we have no PERSONAL knowledge of what really happened and we have no way to know that we are saving any future life.

To the post above,your view sounds wise to yourself because you feel that you understand.Its more than saving future lifes its the dog that bit and maimed. And As for personal knowledge,do you not know how they work a case?,they hardley get a mystic meg to look in her crystal-ball!

there is no courage, no valor, no honor, which is SIMPLY CARING FOR MEMBER'S OF THE LIVING, which be order, which be happiness, which be residing in peace as adult's, within any society, if such society is not willing to PROTECT the weak, the vulnerable, the unprotected, that could or would be harmed by that which has shown itself has no regard whatsoever for any other person's value, freedom, happiness, which be the only essence of each individual's free will, which be the only essence of anything called not just humanity, but of sanity and reason of the reasonable of sound mind of humankind...

has anybody seen some "god" running around town as of late???

the same place such things as the word "god" are written and lifted from, proclaim's as well all human's are "god's", so only the what is motivated by a "form of self righteoussness", to appease something called "god", for personal favor in this lifetime or the next, will forgive a child molester, or rapist, or torturer, or abuser, or bully, allowing such to travel down the road and strike down another one who is weaker???

ONLY A STRONG SOCIETY, PROTECT'S IT'S OWN WEAK AT ANY COST, coming to at least equal the wisdom of the beast of the field's???

many quote, "vengance is mine sayeth the lord", as to why to cross their arm's, and allow injustice to be propogated throughout the land's, when all the while, the same place such is written, declare that "lord" only mean's "most truth known" at any given space in time by any civilization, as of course, mankind is CONSTANTLY evolving, if it does not hold to word's of the past, for guidence for it's own advanced time, but such is doubtful, and all sanity but lost to no reason at all, when member's of society are worshipping doctrine's and belief's, as more sacred, as more valuable, than their own fellow man, the only essence of any such thing being, to lift up the weak, and bring down the abuser's of many???

what that has shown itself has perpetrated grave injustice upon other's of the same spiecies, has not MADE ITSELF ANSWERABLE TO THOSE IT LIVE'S WITH IN THE SAME PLACE CALLED EARTH???

only the weak minded, whom serve self perpetuating dogma's and doctrine's, following but SELF INTEREST ALONE AND MOST, TO APPEASE BELIEF'S FOR SELF FAVOR, protect the strong abuser's, and leave the innocent women and children to be trampled...

mmmm,,,huh? Thats my whole point. WE dont know the guilt or innocence of anyone for sure, after the fact. We can only rely on what evidence is presented and how it is interpreted by others. That person is already dead and our action will not bring them back unlike someone being a hero that keeps the person from dying in the first place.