Based on what? It hasn't been anywhere near long enough to know anything. Hell it took bush years to figure out that we were entering a recession and by the time he did we were starting a depression.

8 months ago...the unemployment rate was 5.8 %...gulp !!...since Obamas been in office...2 million jobs have been lost...hows that stimulus been workin' for ya'...lol..all this bailout money wasted on GM and Crysler...they should have been left to go under without...a govenment takeover...

Not that I approve of this administrations actions, but doesn't it take 6 to 9 months to have any impact on the economy? Whether we are still falling hard, or its slowing down, what is happening now is still a result of the previous administration's actions i would think.

We still have a few more months before we can judge Obama's plans. Until then we can make guesses i suppose.

Actually the economy has been going down since Clinton's 2nd term and accelerated by 9/11 and the oil pinch. Bush slowed it dramatically, but Obama put it into a nose dive, the ensuing crash should be interesting.

ok..I can't wrap my head around this....i'm not up on my economics. but some of the earmarks in the stimulus plan seems a waste to me and should be a state issue not federal.

example...if I am struggling financially....I would spend on what I needed to and not blow it on movies, or CDs or whatever.

how does some of the earmarks help stimulate the economy?

While I agree with you that Chrysler and GM and those should have been left to die, but you should also see the obvious which is that if we had the jobless rate would be even higher still. It'll get even worse, you can't stop something as massive as the US economy on a dime and make it turn around.

I'm not saying I think Obama is doing everything right, in fact I'm pretty sure he's not. But no matter what it will take many years for things to completely turn around and jobless numbers to start dropping to pre-bush days.

The whole stimulus plan is a waste. Its to shut people up, and line a few pockets, that's all.

so i'm not crazy???? (or at least about this lol)

I FULLY believe things like blueberries in GA, sidewalks in TX, pig odor in Iowa, etc...should be either a state or city issue...not federal.

spending money on these things when we have so many jobless, without insurance, lack of money....is insane

Well the concept and supposed plan is no waste but the execution of it certain has been. Far too much of the money has been handed out to "line pockets" as you said. It could have had a much greater impact if it had been used strictly to increase the number of jobs available. The bail out BS was just too short sighted. The money could have been much better spent helping new automakers move in to take those old dinosaurs place.

If you think about it, from an economics standpoint, at best, the grand plan of the stimulus, is a short term benefit.

People lose the conept of capitalism and falsely believe that it is based around money and spending. In fact, it's actually based around production and capital (hence the term "capitalism"). Spending is merely the result of producing such things.

What stimulus plans do, is take money from the people, and spend it anywhere they see fit.

When instead, the money should be left to the rightful owners, so he or she can spend it on whatever is needed. This boosts funding for production of the most needed products, in turn making them more available.

So the focus, should not be spending money. Money is only worth the capital in circulation. It's production of capital that should be focused on.

As you pointed out, helping new industries move in, this focuses on exactly what i am talking about. You do in fact understand that production is key. You already have more common sense than nearly anyone in washington...

Another thing they could practice is to lessen the tax burden a bit on businesses...

IMO (yes I'm giving my opinion again lol) federal taxes should be for the wntire country...when it's like the examples I gave....that is a state or city issue.

BHO said he was proud to have created a stimulus package without earmarks. First....he was wrong because there will always be earmarks. BUT (and a big BUT)....there was pork and our money is flying away with the pork



ok...I'll sit in my corner now...until round 2

Thanks for the compliment though frankly saying I know more than those in Washington isn't saying that much ... I know I had some people telling me I didn't know what I was talking about when I proposed the idea of letting GM et al die and helping little automakers instead. With the recent happening they are beginning to change their tune.

The "supposed" concept of the stimulus program was to increase the amount of money in the hands of individuals. My opinion it should have been done strictly through jobs creation, more people employed = more money to be spent = greater need for product = greater production.

Exactly my friend!! But as long as those jobs produce useful capital, the solution will be permanent.

I agree with you about letting GM go under. I think if the gov just minded their own business, the most efficient producer would prosper. Theoretically this is how our system is supposed to work. Unfortunately we haven't let it work like this for over 100 years.

how about helping the small businesses instead of the big coperations that misused their money to begin with?????

Only in the form of tax breaks. But even then, competition will only bring out the best in production, if it is allowed to compete.

I'm all for that. I think in the case of the auto-industry bail out, the money would be best spent by putting the money back into the industry. We really can't afford to have the entire american auto "industry" gone, just the existing companies. So let's put the money into some of the newer auto-companies instead of those who have already proven the don't know how to make and market a car the American public is going to want to buy.

Big sore point for me, and why I felt that helping upstart automakers would be a good deal. The big 3 US automakers, rather that competing when a new upstart opens it's doors, they just buy them out and down grade the product to match their own.

Hell if we had given that money to some of the larger upstart companies, they could have bought off some of GM's better plants and equipment (for a song probably), hired on some of their better workers and done a hell of a lot more for the economy than throwing a bunch of money at a beast that's going to die anyway.

Tax breaks are good, but at this point in time I wouldn't mind pure cash going in as long as it comes with attachments that it's not going straight into the pocket of the business owner(s).

Oh something I missed in your earlier post...
"Another thing they could practice is to lessen the tax burden a bit on businesses...

The huge tax burden on businesses, particularly on larger ones, is a myth. If you can manage to find the P&L's for some of them along with how much they paid in taxes (admittedly a lot of money) the percentage is minor. They pay high rates but all too often they don't pay it on all their income only a very tiny portion. As small business owner myself I can say the burden held by my company is minor and any incentives they might give me wouldn't really matter to me. They do benefit larger corporations in greater dollars but I doubt it's any greater percentage than it is to me... probably even less.

HBO husien don it again

actually nobodies done much of anything, that is at least part of the problem. I think it's only up to about about 8% of the money from the stimulus package that's been spent so far. It really needs to get out there quicker if it's going to have any effect at all, and that's not Obama his proposal put it out there much quicker than what is happening. It's congress that's slowing that down.