nah sweets.....you didn't do anything...it's goes to 50 pages and then turns over.....look at the Matchmaking Game of mine we have turned over 130 times......which means 130,000 posts.....each one is 1,000 posts.......so this is cool...it just turned over....

Redy

Even today there are people that don't know of Christ.....that is the whole point of he not coming back until all know of him...Because there will be no doubts in ones persons mind when he comes back who he is...and all will see him and bow to the Lord of Lords. That is why we are
ministering in China, India, and far away lands...

Yes Adam and Eve knew God......

Well this is where it turns...when Adam and Eve sinned it put a whole other spin on things....

Genesis 3
The Fall of Man
1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"

2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

8 Then the man and his wife heard the sound of the LORD God as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the LORD God among the trees of the garden. 9 But the LORD God called to the man, "Where are you?"

10 He answered, "I heard you in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid."

11 And he said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"

12 The man said, "The woman you put here with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it."

13 Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this you have done?"
The woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate."

14 So the LORD God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this,
"Cursed are you above all the livestock
and all the wild animals!
You will crawl on your belly
and you will eat dust
all the days of your life.

15 And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring [a] and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel."

16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
"Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat of it
all the days of your life.

18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.

19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return."

20 Adam [c] named his wife Eve, [d] because she would become the mother of all the living.

21 The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. 22 And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever." 23 So the LORD God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. 24 After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side [e] of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.

And yes they had Cain and Abel

Genesis 4
Cain and Abel
1 Adam [a] lay with his wife Eve, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain. She said, "With the help of the LORD I have brought forth [c] a man." 2 Later she gave birth to his brother Abel.
Now Abel kept flocks, and Cain worked the soil. 3 In the course of time Cain brought some of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the LORD. 4 But Abel brought fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The LORD looked with favor on Abel and his offering, 5 but on Cain and his offering he did not look with favor. So Cain was very angry, and his face was downcast.

6 Then the LORD said to Cain, "Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? 7 If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must master it."

8 Now Cain said to his brother Abel, "Let's go out to the field." [d] And while they were in the field, Cain attacked his brother Abel and killed him.

9 Then the LORD said to Cain, "Where is your brother Abel?"
"I don't know," he replied. "Am I my brother's keeper?"

10 The LORD said, "What have you done? Listen! Your brother's blood cries out to me from the ground. 11 Now you are under a curse and driven from the ground, which opened its mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand. 12 When you work the ground, it will no longer yield its crops for you. You will be a restless wanderer on the earth."

13 Cain said to the LORD, "My punishment is more than I can bear. 14 Today you are driving me from the land, and I will be hidden from your presence; I will be a restless wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me."

15 But the LORD said to him, "Not so [e] ; if anyone kills Cain, he will suffer vengeance seven times over." Then the LORD put a mark on Cain so that no one who found him would kill him. 16 So Cain went out from the LORD's presence and lived in the land of Nod, [f] east of Eden.

17 Cain lay with his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch. 18 To Enoch was born Irad, and Irad was the father of Mehujael, and Mehujael was the father of Methushael, and Methushael was the father of Lamech.

19 Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah. 20 Adah gave birth to Jabal; he was the father of those who live in tents and raise livestock. 21 His brother's name was Jubal; he was the father of all who play the harp and flute. 22 Zillah also had a son, Tubal-Cain, who forged all kinds of tools out of [g] bronze and iron. Tubal-Cain's sister was Naamah.

23 Lamech said to his wives,
"Adah and Zillah, listen to me;
wives of Lamech, hear my words.
I have killed [h] a man for wounding me,
a young man for injuring me.

24 If Cain is avenged seven times,
then Lamech seventy-seven times."

25 Adam lay with his wife again, and she gave birth to a son and named him Seth, saying, "God has granted me another child in place of Abel, since Cain killed him." 26 Seth also had a son, and he named him Enosh.
At that time men began to call on [j] the name of the LORD.

So because of the fall of man a whole lot of people do not know of God.

Exodus 20:5 (New International Version)

5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me,


Deuteronomy 4:24
For the LORD your God is a consuming fire, a jealous God.

Deuteronomy 5:9
You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me.

Deuteronomy 6:15
for the LORD your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land.

Joshua 24:19
Joshua said to the people, "You are not able to serve the LORD. He is a holy God; he is a jealous God. He will not forgive your rebellion and your sins.

I think you get the idea Redy.

Of course Moses understood.....He felt not worthy.......But in the end he knew God did choose him for God's purpose and Moses knew this.


And it was not a matter of God changing the people.....He gives us free will....they have to seek him and follow him with all their heart, soul and mind.....Chance after chance they were given......did they listen nope.

All those with Noah already knew and Loved God as Noah did.....

Now let's take what you said and change it to more accurately fit what truly happen


Some angels defied God.........they paid


Adam & Eve defied God.......they paid


All of the people defied God......they paid

All that followed Jesus and Noah and all the great men of the bible......Were favored by God.....

All the rest......they paid

And alot believe in God, Jesus and all that do will be rewarded.......


all that don't.........they will pay

So until everyone believes as you do, the one greatest being has packed up his toys and went home.

Gotcha . . .

So in other words, they were wrong all along being naked but just didn't know it was a bad thing until their eyes were opened to the fact that is is wrong to be naked.

The more I hear the story the sillier it sounds.

The whole thing was written by a pervert.

Go to your room Bushidobilly!

You're a bad bad bad boy!

You'll pay for your disbelief!

You HEATHEN SCUMBAG!

"Kill their children?" If he is speaking of abortion, I think that remark was crude. Abortion is a far cry from "killing their children."

JB

So Jesus is not coming back until everyone has heard of him?
That seems rather odd. Truly odd.

(Thank god for lost pygmy tribes in the amazon.)

There is still time to party before we are all thrown into the lake of fire!

So if he wont come back until everyone believes in him, then God is the ultimate dead beat dad.

Here out my reasoning, this is good stuff.

So Im not sure of the actual statistic, so ill do like everyone else and make up my own. So lets say a child is born every couple minutes (forget about infant mortality rate for a sec), well there is no way every new child could be taught about Jesus before the next batch pop out lol.

Also what about all the crazy, or mentally handicap people, or Alzheimer's, or people in a coma . . . .

If I where a dead beat dad of a god, and never wanted to visit my estranged family I would set up just such a rule knowing it could never be met.

I bet god has a family in another universe he loves more WHAAAAAAAAAAAA!

By golly Bushidobilly you just proved that God can't come possibly come back because his requirements to come back can never be met.

So now it doesn't matter whether it's true or not. The biblical God already shot himself in the foot by making requirements for his return that can't be met.

The bible did that with the criteria for sinners too. According to the Bible we are supposed to have free will to choose whether or not to sin. But then it also proclaims that all have sinned and there's no choice in the matter.

Like duh! The authors of the Bible couldn't make up their mind which way they wanted it to be.

We can't claim to not be sinners because we have no CHOICE!

Someone dropped the ball on that one.

That silly idea is probably taught so that people will be inspired to rush out and become missionaries and preach the gospel to everyone and get new members to their church so the church will make more money.

Propaganda programming. It is also a good excuse as to why they are still waiting for Jesus to come back.

According to Tribo, and scripture he quoted, Jesus already came back and all of the prophecies have been fulfilled already.

This is the time when satan (aliens of the red dragon cult) rule the earth.

The return of the white dragon is coming soon to dethrone the red dragon.

Women will rule the earth probably. And they are pissed. It won't be a pretty sight. Pat Robertson look out. Your prophecy is at hand.

JB

It's your choice to be "impressed" with anything you like redy. That's your "opinion" only.

MANY valid responses were given & you don't have the right to discredit what YOU certainly can't dispute. You don't speak for anyone else's experience.

I think it burns people up what the Christian experience is all about because you all feel left out. That's your own unbelief by your choice only.

Try accepting personal responsiblity like the rest of us did before you go around giving "opinions" like they are facts.

Thank you very much!!!

I have to laugh at your "impressed???" "opinion" of a little girl who did nothing but make feeble attempts to put others down. That is laughable.

BTW...up until now I was giving you more credit than you deserve. I guess I was wrong. Too funny.

I'm in complete agreement with Sam on that one. Jesus made it perfectly clear that he was going to return before the current generation has passed. All the gospels agree on that one.

Why people are still waiting for him to come back 2000 years later is beyond me. He didn't direct his message to us according to the Bible he was telling his own disciples that he would return before their generation had passed.

Yep. That's how the story goes.

wow, ok I thought direct insults where against TOS of this site . . . sorry to say but im going to have to report your post.

Please refrain from name calling in the future.

Please keep this on a debate level only. No attacking/insulting others.

Thanks,
Mark

Redy responding to Feral



Question: I’m not a biblical scholar, so I can’t pinpoint the place or places but somewhere in the bible there is scripture that has led many Christians over the centuries to believe that their body is sacred. In fact that they will be raised to live “in body” on this ‘heavenly’ earth. That was one reason for moseleums, and the desire to preserve the body after death.

So NOW the question, was god cursing Adam by saying his body would return to dust? Would Adam not ever be raised to live in heaven?



Ok – at this point god is making clothes for two human beings (remember this)

Second point: “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil.”

Are good and evil qualities (maybe like jealousy) that pre-existed god?

Or did god create good and evil and in the creation process became jealous of It’s own creation?



Two things strike me here, first god had to make clothes for Adam and Eve but, secondly, their first generation child “Cain” was building a city. We went from cave man like knowledge of the life on this planet to a child building a city for his brothers and sisters and children.

Ok, so – if Adam and Eve gave birth to children capable of building cities and farming the land, who lived in all the caves and painted all the pictures on the walls and left behind trails of primitive nomadic lifestyles?



It seems we go from Adam and Eve wearing animal skins, to Cain and Able building cities to Lamech and his kin living in tents raising livestock and the bronze and iron age simultaneously. Mmm – I have to say, it may not be the most intelligent child who knows this is all out of place, but any child learning about what science has to teach about their REAL world archeological and anthropological findings, will have some gut instinct that the bible is in no way in sync with reality. No wonder, me, Abra and so many others have grown up questioning what they were being taught.



Feral wrote:


Feral, you quote is in no way explained by ANYTHING you have written. First of all, god is portrayed as interacting on several occasions with humans. Why would these people NOT tell their own children that they were in touch with the creator. Where in the world do you see that man became ignorant of god?

The last verse above shows Eve saying “God has granted me…” Who was she saying that to?

MOVING ON


Again, what does god have to be jealous of. And here we see another quality that we, as humans, recognize as “bad” and that quality is “hate”. So who taught who, to hate?

If I tell you Feral that you must teach your children how to fly with faith alone then tell you that if you defy me I will punish all your lineage to the third and fouth generations as those who hate me – what incentive have I given you to follow my words?

It makes no sense for any god who is powerful enough to be god to have feelings of hate or jealousy. In fact I see no need or reason at all for a god to have the human attributes of any emotion. Truth, knowledge, logic is all it should take for a god. To say otherwise is merely a WISH to have the most powerful being in the universe see YOU, notice YOU, hear YOU, love YOU, save YOU. In other words, it is ‘human’ fear that has given god emotions.



OK – “He will not forgive your rebellion and your sins”

Is that true or false? How can such a statement be made unless it is over the dying body(s) of someone? According to Christianity, the Christ redeems those who rebel and later repent?



And I must say to you likewise Chance after Chance YOU are given. You sin still, you have admitted it. You are no different than those whom you believe god condemns. Your imperfections are yours as a birthright and every generation born since the fall of Adam and Eve are cursed with those imperfections. You can sin and sin again and you think your tears asking for forgiveness are sugar coating pleas to an accepting god.

I say to you, you do not even understand the depth of the lies from whence your dogma arises. You do not understand the simplicity of that which has been tainted with the manipulations of the human ego. WE are all the same. Our conduct is not and can not be guided by any single set of rules or morals, and not a single god has been created by man who has been able to change that. Humans effect the course of their evolution and with that change comes varying viewpoints as to morality.

To get caught up in the dogma of an unchanging religion, is to deny yourself all the experiences that the gift of having this life has offered. It’s a matter of degrees, the deeper you go into the dark the more you MUST believe because you have wasted so much time already believing. The only way to get back any of the ‘wasted’ time, is to hope you are given eternity.

So waste it all on a hope or claim what is left.


.


Then why did not teach their children? How is it that a whole world was populated, for a second time, and within a very short time, god was forgotten and replaced by many other beliefs?

Feral wrote:


What have they paid? They didn’t like where they were, the left. They are still here, supposedly tempting humans! If they cease to exist in the sight of god, do you think they care? They left, remember.



What did they pay that we are not still paying for? Sheesh, tick god off and all of humanity for all of it’s existence might be held responsible. I sure don’t blame the angels.
All of the people defied God......they paid

More than just those who defied god paid, according to biblical stories. Sometimes the lines distinction are seem of little concern to your god. Not even children may be spared.



All that followed : please explain what that means. As in all that follow the teachings of Noah and Jesus or simply all humanity after Noah and Jesus? For certainly Noah and his family were unsuccessful at handing down their ‘knowledge’. The same holds true for Jesus, you have YOURSELF stated that even today, there are people without knowledge of god and Jesus. Doesn’t sound like the fairy tale ending you are trying to describe.



Your believe is nothing but a way to forgive yourself for committing what you have neurotically convinced yourself of being sinful acts. Your neuroticism won’t allow you to be great enough to forgive yourself so you created a god who will reward you for saying “I’m sorry”. But you are not, because it’s too easy just to say “I’m sorry” again and again.



Of course we will pay, we pay by having to deal with people whose dogmatic belief systems inhibit, in any way, the beauty that this life experience has to offer. Whether the inhibiting factor is physical torture, death, judgments, or twisting of innocent little minds, we all pay.

I think you struck Gold Redy.

The story cumbles so easily doesn't it.

Either the Bible's wrong or reality's wrong.

Take your choice.

Well, not only that, but why would anyone hate God?

I thought God was supposed to be nice?

If anyone hates God it can only be because they misuderstand him. But if they misunderstand who's fault is that?

It's up to God to convey to people what he's truly like. He can't blame them for misunderstanding.

Communication is a two-way street. Any good parent knows that.

This just suggests that God isn't a very good parent and lacks good parenting and communication skills.

Why would anyone hate a all-loving benevolent God?

There were other people on the earth when Adam and Eve were introduced to the breeding population.

Have you ever heard of the wild mustang populations? They were ragged ugly horses until people introduced some fine breeding stallions to improve the current population. Now the wild mustangs are quite nice looking horses.

That was the purpose of Adam and Eve. It was to upgrade the current primitive populations. (They were considered more like animals to the alien gods placing Adam and Eve with them.) But they were the humans that had been on the earth for a long time. They had no culture, and they lived in caves etc.

The alien gods taught them how to farm, taught them about religion etc. Read all about this stuff in the Urantia book. It goes into a lot of detail about the genetic improvements they were introducing. Its interesting.

JB

Truly.

The whole vengence thing is totally without merit.

And if you read the Bible you'll see that Job paid for being totally devoted to God. His sons paid with their lives!

This whole fire & brimstone line of preaching doesn't cut it.

A God who threatens people is not God at all but a demon.