with all due respect, I refer to homosexuality as a behavior and activities, unlike race, or nationality or anything like that


I have explained that if thinking certain behaviors are wrong makes one prejudice, I am prejudice along with the rest of the human race who has opinions about right and wrong when it comes to behaviors.

Is anyone on this thread even close friends\have family that are gay? How can one judge whom they do not know. My gay brother was deeply religious, married a woman and was miserable. He came out at 40.
I knew he was gay when he was in his 20's.

They think like us in all aspects, except they are same sex attracted.

Yes. I am very close. My brother and child and work colleague/friend, all same sex attracted. I love them all without having to agree with or approve of all their lifestyle or other choices.

I do not define them by or relate to them as "homosexuals". I define them and relate to them as human beings with their own choice of sexual activity and activity partners because they are adults, same as I am. They likewise do not relate to me as a 'Christian' but as a human being with my own ideas for right and wrong, because I too am an adult. I wish there were some easier way to explain it and spread the word so that the idea of hatefulness or bigotry can stop being associated with it.


There are indeed hateful and bigoted people who do not like homosexuals. There are also non hateful and non bigoted people who do not agree with homosexual lifestyle. The two are not mutually inclusive.

Again, that smacks of a cop out
Describing it, as a behaviour
1 does not choose 1s sexuality, choose as 1 does not choose 1s ethnicity

copping out of what?

How we feel and what we do ARE different things, or what would be the point of having a brain and making choices?

I cannot argue or be against what people FEEL, feelings are our own, and a much deeper and more sub-concious 'choice' that is not something we direct for ourselves very often.

All I can support or deter is what people DO, actions are our choice and something we can direct much more easily.

Copping out of admitting , or rather, facing up to the fact, that you are clearly prejudice towards homosexuals

Do they have to lead a sexless life?
Can they never kiss somebody in a passionate manner?

Its like your saying, well, it's okay to be born having an attraction to somebody of the same sex, just so long as you don't kiss them, I don't dissaprove of you being born that way, but I do disagree should you choose to kiss somebody

It's kind of like saying, I don't dissaprove of black people, but I do dissaprove of them not 'doing a Michael Jackson' and turning their skin white

Almighty God only created 2 sexes.
From no fault of their own, I recognize a third sex. Hermaphrodites.
3 and only 3 naturally occurring sexes.
The others, fictional, are mental issues and need to be prayed for.
As far as religions and cults.
Some accept them and condone the behavior. Others throw them off high rooftops.

I am still not understanding. I did admit that IF disagreeing with what people do is a 'prejudice' than I am prejudice along with the rest of the human race.

Any action is a choice we ALL have, from kissing or having sex. The option to not do any of them is also an option.

In this culture, No one 'has' to have sex or to not have sex, and no one has to kiss or to not kiss.

And you are correct, offensive or not, just like we hope pedophiles do not act on their attraction, or family members suffering GSA do not act on their attractions, there ARE some attractions I do not feel should be acted upon. I also feel like 'attractions' can develop on many levels beside beginning with physical, and it is a choice to be open to that possibility or not.

And no, your comparison to race continues to miss the mark. I am not disapproving of anything but what people DO. I do not disapprove of people being attacted to whomever. And there is nothing that is associated with the ancestral fact of being black that has to do with what ACTION one chooses, unlike how what one FEELS may have to do with the actions they choose.

This does smack of how a politician may speak

Put another way then

It's like saying, I am not sexist, or maybe I am, I do not think less of women, but I do think, they should choose to have a sex change, and become a man, I do think less of them for not making this choice, but that does not make me sexist, or maybe it does

IT is all semantics R2. I put it as plainly as I could. I think men and women are meant to be different, not less than or more than, but different from each other.

Does that make me sexist? Depends upon whose perception we use. Does sexist have to man a feeling of superiority or hatred? Then no. Does sexist include anything that discerns difference between male and female? Then yes.

I feel people have differences, I don't feel different from has to mean the same as less than or more than, regardless of the boxes modern culture seems to insist upon.

I can give a few more examples of this.

I do not feel people should smoke. I do not think less of people for choosing to smoke. I do not feel people should stuff themselves with junk food. I do not think less of people for making the choice to stuff themselves with junk food. I do not feel smokers or junk food eaters are any better or worse than I am BECAUSE I MAKE POOR CHOICES in my own life, because I am human, as are they.


I relate to the poor choices others make as making them the SAME as me, not less than or different than, saving those choices to take human life unnecessarily or intentionally cause unnecessary pain to others. I feel those people are more 'lost' than most.

But your definition of engaging in a homosexual practice as 'a poor choice' , ranking it ( or at least relating it, with your sentence structure, and choice of vocabulary ) , alongside, smoking, swearing, adultery, bestiatly and incest, tells a different story
And I really don't feel, that you are unaware of that
It's just like a 'cop out clause' so you can stand up in church, or look at yourself in the mirror, and say ' I am not prejudice, it's all semantics really'

I am prejudice regarding choices. Engaging or not engaging in ANY type of sex, is a choice, and choices matter. I do believe without apology in unhealthy choices and
healthy choices, right choices and wrong choices, good choices and poor choices.

I listed only a few of a long line of things we have a 'choice' in. I make unhealthy choices, poor choices and wrong choices sometimes as you and everyone else does, because we are all human, and no better or worse than others who make poor or bad choices.

But 2 straight people get married, and have sex, presumably that is a ' good choice ' in your eyes, so, your, cool with that

But if 2 gay people, get married, and have sex, presumably that is a ' bad choice ' in your eyes, so, your not cool with that

And all of this, does not make you prejudice towards gay people in any shape or fashion.
You are only prejudice of the choices they make!?

Pull the other 1 ms harmony, 'I toked but I did not inhale, and I definitely did not have sexual relations with that woman '

I have too many of my own sins to deal with to worry about things that may or may not be sin for another person. Homosexuality is not a problem for me.

I hear you.
Not my problem.
I do pray they will accept Gods plan and psychiatric help.

I pray for that too.

Here are a few quotes
And a poem

'It's funny how we know gay people exsist and we don't have proof of God, but we deny gay people basic human rights, because it might piss God off '

" I hate the word homophobia. It's not a phobia. You're not scared. You're an πrsehole."--Morgan Freeman

"Why is it that, as a culture, we are more comfortable seeing two men holding guns than holding hands?"--Author Ernest J. Gaines


"When all Americans are treated as equal, no matter who they are or whom they love, we are all more free."--Barack Obama

"It takes some intelligence and insight to figure out you're gay and then a tremendous amount of balls to live it and live it proudly."--Jason Bateman

"All of us who are openly gay are living and writing the history of our movement. We are no more - and no less - heroic than the suffragists and abolitionists of the 19th century; and the labor organizers, Freedom Riders, Stonewall demonstrators, and environmentalists of the 20th century. We are ordinary people, living our lives, and trying as civil-rights activist Dorothy Cotton said, to 'fix what ain't right' in our society."--Senator Tammy Baldwin

I dreamed I stood upon a little hill,
And at my feet there lay a ground, that seemed
Like a waste garden, flowering at its will
With buds and blossoms. There were pools that dreamed
Black and unruffled; there were white lilies
A few, and crocuses, and violets
Purple or pale, snake-like fritillaries
Scarce seen for the rank grass, and through green nets
Blue eyes of shy pervenche winked in the sun.
And there were curious flowers, before unknown,
Flowers that were stained with moonlight, or with shades
Of Nature's wilful moods; and here a one
That had drunk in the transitory tone
Of one brief moment in a sunset; blades
Of grass that in an hundred springs had been
Slowly but exquisitely nurtured by the stars,
And watered with the scented dew long cupped
In lilies, that for rays of sun had seen
Only God's glory, for never a sunrise mars
The luminous air of Heaven. Beyond, abrupt,
A grey stone wall, o'ergrown with velvet moss
Uprose; and gazing I stood long, all mazed
To see a place so strange, so sweet, so fair.
And as I stood and marvelled, lo! across
The garden came a youth; one hand he raised
To shield him from the sun, his wind-tossed hair
Was twined with flowers, and in his hand he bore
A purple bunch of bursting grapes, his eyes
Were clear as crystal, naked all was he,
White as the snow on pathless mountains frore,
Red were his lips as red wine-spilith that dyes
A marble floor, his brow chalcedony.
And he came near me, with his lips uncurled
And kind, and caught my hand and kissed my mouth,
And gave me grapes to eat, and said, 'Sweet friend,
Come I will show thee shadows of the world
And images of life. See from the South
Comes the pale pageant that hath never an end.'
And lo! within the garden of my dream
I saw two walking on a shining plain
Of golden light. The one did joyous seem
And fair and blooming, and a sweet refrain
Came from his lips; he sang of pretty maids
And joyous love of comely girl and boy,
His eyes were bright, and 'mid the dancing blades
Of golden grass his feet did trip for joy;
And in his hand he held an ivory lute
With strings of gold that were as maidens' hair,
And sang with voice as tuneful as a flute,
And round his neck three chains of roses were.
But he that was his comrade walked aside;
He was full sad and sweet, and his large eyes
Were strange with wondrous brightness, staring wide
With gazing; and he sighed with many sighs
That moved me, and his cheeks were wan and white
Like pallid lilies, and his lips were red
Like poppies, and his hands he clenched tight,
And yet again unclenched, and his head
Was wreathed with moon-flowers pale as lips of death.
A purple robe he wore, o'erwrought in gold
With the device of a great snake, whose breath
Was fiery flame: which when I did behold
I fell a-weeping, and I cried, 'Sweet youth,
Tell me why, sad and sighing, thou dost rove
These pleasant realms? I pray thee speak me sooth
What is thy name?' He said, 'My name is Love.'
Then straight the first did turn himself to me
And cried, 'He lieth, for his name is Shame,
But I am Love, and I was wont to be
Alone in this fair garden, till he came
Unasked by night; I am true Love, I fill
The hearts of boy and girl with mutual flame.'
Then sighing, said the other, 'Have thy will,
I am the Love that dare not speak its name.'

Two loves, by Lord Alfred Douglas

Beautiful poem. It's sensitivity and truth bought a tear to my eye. Have you read Walt Whitman? He was gay and a historic American poet. I am going to search for one of his poems now....

I have heard of him, but I don't know a lot of poetry
I sent you a message by the way, I hope that's okay

I am sorry that you feel that disagreeing with a persons choice of action should define how we feel about that person in total.