I believe that if people just 'care' about each other that is something called Friendship and if there is no next level, that is what it remains

I believe if two people are 'in love', the general 'next level' is moving from platonic to intimate ... and some may consider that a relationship or just dating ,, and if that's the end game (no kids, no cohabitating, no marriage)there is no next level

I don't know I'm still figuring that one out..
How to be with somebody but without actually being with them full-time..
Hmm.. I enjoy their company I'm committed to them.. we're monogamous with each other.. but I don't want to get married already have kids and I like my own place..

That's why I prefer casual dating.. if I come across someone I really enjoy spending time with I have no problems committing to them... but at the same time I don't want to give up being my own person.. so to speak... I suppose if I met somebody.. that wasn't tied down to a house I would consider the possibility of living together..
Down the road..but.. that's usually more for the financial benefits.. living together allows you both to save money for taking trips together... and such things..

Or maybe it's all just all an excuse.. to stay footloose and fancy-free..lol

Don’t want anymore screaming crying whinging kids.
Not sure about marriage.
Living together I’d consider.

A house with his and hers en-suite bathrooms, all marble.
6 bedrooms in case any family want to visit and stay for a few days, although I’d rather they didn’t.
A gravel drive way at least a mile long.
Chandeliers
Indoor and outdoor Olympic sized swimming pools with statues of whales and dolphins etc.
I once saw this bedroom where the bed was built into an aquarium with fish and things swimming about, it was awesome, I want one.
Got to have a spiral staircase.
TV that takes up a whole wall.
Butlers and maids

There’s loads more but that’s just off the top of my head.
An Englishmans home is his Castle.

To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals.
To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger.
Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honour the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence.
You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share.

To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still have so many ego needs.

Many people , including myself have been conditioned to believe that the ultimate goal of a relationship is either marriage, and/or children or at least moving in together.For those who dont want marriage , kids, or even to share a home, is there a next level to the relationship?Do you think people can be perceived as having a committed relationship, if none of the above conditions exist ,but they love and support each other emotionally , physically etc?

Leveling Up a relationship...

Kinda makes me think of school.

First you pull a bunch of different girls hair and pick on them.

Then you have lots of classes with them and try to sit by them

Then you start eating lunch with them

Then you walk them to the bus.

Then you go to a dance together

Then you do a few Friday night dates

Then you hang with them over a weekend

Then you start hanging with them every day

Then you start going to each other's houses

Then you start spending more time with them

Then you move in together

Then you get married & have kids

Then you get sick of each other and separate

Then you get a divorce and do a battle over the kids

Then you start looking to do it again with someone else.

Yup, lots of levels.

That is a YES! and NO! Question...

I knew a man who met his partner in high school, for 36yrs she would not marry him. They had 5 kids together, neither of them wanted to play into the piece of paper, ring, I owe you and you owe men, in sickness or better for worse,(death do us apart) game as they called it.

My son was dating their daughter in the 6th grade he was so in love with her. Anyway! Long story short When the kids got into High School. The couple GOT MARRIED~ it took them that long to commit to each other, they lived in the same house since he bought it for her for a graduation present and asked her to marry him, She said NO! But She gave in and Married him.

2nd real-life story: Back in the old days years before the 1960's that messed everything all up! Free love! it still hurts us today!

A woman was taught to never date a man unless he had good intentions and was willing to date for 3 yrs. But remember the boy was only a Senior and the girl was in the 10th grade. So for the next 3 years, the boy is working hard making a future for his girlfriend and him, he buys her a home, a car and when she graduates he is allowed to marry her the next day!... The 4 years later had children, and in that; they grew old together for 42yrs until he died on the job as a fireman!

3rd life story: I knew a person who got married 7 times. Looking for love. The first husband lasted 1 yr. Second husband 3 yrs. Third husband 10 yrs, Fourth husband 3 months, Fifth husband 1yr. Sixth husband, 6months, and the last husband 31yrs today they are still married he was a Jehovah Witness. This young man is 13yrs younger than his wife, and she told him directly, I will never marry you for I have been married way too many times, I have been abused and hurt and destroyed.

If you want to live with me you must support me, have a house for me, and take care of me, If you ever cheat I will leave you.
This man fell so deeply for this women that he climbed every mountain, swam every ocean, just to be with her. He left his wife and 2 children, to be with this women, he left his church and he was becoming a Minister but found it was not the life for him. He wanted something different.

One day he saw this woman sitting in a coffee shop and with tears in her eyes. He asked if he could sit with her and she said fine but I don't want to talk. Day after day he showed up to the same place and year after year. Then one day he asked her, Can I date you and she said NO! but you can fix my roof and replace my floor. So he did that, then 3 yrs later he asked (I have proven myself to you as a man) Will you date me! She said, My car is broken it needs to be fixed; fix it and I will allow you to visit me but I will not date you. 5 years went by and again he asked will you allow me to date you, she said NO! Then can I move in with you, I am spending so much on rent that I could be giving to you, so he became a part of the family but he had his own room and paid her the rent.

10 yrs go by and Little by little this man proved his loyalty, his workmanship, his honor and dedication to this woman who was broken. He gave her everything she needed in life and let her cry on his shoulder.

20 yrs went by and she started to fall in love with him for real, little by little she opened up her heart to him. He asked one day will you date me and she said NO! Not ever will I ever date a man for all the Lie's are not needed! This man stopped asking that day knowing he can only live in her home and do things for her and be by his side.

30 yrs go by and Her daughter on Christmas who was in her 40's asked her mother to Marry this man for a Christmas present! Her mother said NO! I will not marry this man. Her daughter begged her mother please he has done so much for you for 30yrs don't you love him, she said Yes! I love him but I am scared of Marriage, 6failed marriages I do not want another one. The daughter said Ok

On 2008, The old women and man in their 60's on Christmas Day went to Las Vegas and Made her Daughters Wish Come True!

I am the Daughter of this Mother! I wanted a Father to love my mother, and I wanted this wonderful man to finally get his dream. It took all these years for the FEAR in my Mothers heart To Disappear!

My real dad died in 2010, but my stepfather still is alive while my mother is dying as we speak. She has maybe a year if that! The greatest man I ever Knew other then my father was my stepfather.

My stepfather told me, My dear never settle for less if a man can not work hard for you, give you everything you ever ask for and treat you like you are an Angel then he is not worth a pebbles on the bottom of your shoes, A man must move mountains, then boulders, then rocks, then shovel pebbles to get into a women's heart but once he is in it she will never let him go! That is a GREAT MAN!

I have been married, I have dated many years ago and it made me cry and it made me feel old. it striped my dignaty as a women and human person, it took everything I had in side of me and left me empty so I would never want to date again. If a man can not trust God and Courage to have faith that I am the women for him, then I will stay single until and married to God! Not a MAN! Amen

To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals.
To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger.
Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honour the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence.
You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share.

To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still have so many ego needs.

of course peggy i just didn't draw it all the way out. i just kind of skipped to the and of the weighing it out process and said gets tired of it.

Regardless of the details, married or not married, living together or not, there are ALWAYS at least two "levels" possible.

This is because ACTUAL COMMITMENT is makes everything different, regardless of all other labels, stories, or details.

The thing I focus on the most, is that it is or isn't truly a commitment.

People who get married are no more or less committed by that act than people who don't. That is the lesson of all the "marriages" which fail, because one or both people are only "committed" to the extent that they have a list of mate-services in mind, and ditch the mate if those services aren't performed. That's not real commitment, as far as I'm concerned.

Bottom line from my perspective, there are always two potential levels, and real commitment is the dividing point between them.

Let's look at this from a couple perspectives. You grow up seeing a certain type of broken relationship (Maybe Mom went from guy to guy, daddy wasn't around....or perhaps one parent was abusive to the other) and you therefore feel that this is normal. Then you see a "happy" relationship and you begin to crave that. It's normal to want that because what makes us happy makes for a better life right?

Or you grow up with loving parents and you crave that, only to find that mom and dad put up a facade. Then you believe that this is normal so you find someone and you begin to treat him/her in the same manor. It's love right? Or your perception of it.

My point is that a relationship is what you make of it....and it really shouldn't matter how you are the one you love make it work. In today's world, anything taboo is actually becoming "normal".

nope. the whole point is to get married and have children. anything else is just friends

I agree To me the ultimate goal isn't kids or marriage, but happiness. Wanting to share experiences together. Nourish, nurture, love, share, and support so you grow and develop as individuals.
To appreciate the other, and be grateful every day that they are in your life, because it is a choice, you do not own your partner. Not even when you've put a wedding band on their finger.
Making that choice every day to love, cherish, honor the other and to be grateful and happy with the presence.
You don't need kids for that, nor marriage, not even living together. You may wish to have those things, yes. But they should be the icing on the cake, not the goal. Those things should come from sheer desire and love that you already share.

To be honest I feel many cannot understand this until they've reached a certain age, cos when younger you still think of all the traditional things in life you want ...

and you can have a FWB may not be what you want to call it...
but if you both trust one another... an to be faithful to each other ... then I see nothing wrong with that ...

Im agreeing with you Crystal but rather than happiness, I will use the term mutual fulfilment , which I suspect many people ultimately seek in their relationship.

The challenge with that premise  is that everyone has their own perception of what fulfillment looks  and feels like based on their life experiences and needs.

And thats perhaps where the vision of kids, marriage ,  sharing a living space , etc  come into play . For some people that is what fulfilment or happiness looks like to THEM, not necessarily for ego driven motives.

Also , if we are talking about commitment , some people think of one's level of investment.

For those who are contented with  a mate"s investment of time , companionship and passion, the trappings of shared assets are non consequential but for those who seek a more holistic investment, more might be required.

In other words, cherishing and loving each other fulfil some important needs, but neglect other fundamental needs depending on the person.

It always comes down to the couple in question doesnt it? .... No right or wrong... just whatever feels right and fulfilling for the couple