Community > General Religion Chat

Topic: Sex before marriage...
Ruth34611 Joined Sat 08/02/08 Posts: 32402	Wed 06/19/13 06:04 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? It doesn't. That was his point. I was the one who brought up masturbation and what the Catholic Church teaches. Non-Catholic Christians do not agree with this.

singmesweet Joined Mon 07/28/08 Posts: 26661	Wed 06/19/13 06:09 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? It doesn't. That was his point. I was the one who brought up masturbation and what the Catholic Church teaches. Non-Catholic Christians do not agree with this. Ah, ok.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 09:47 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins.

Dodo_David Joined Fri 08/13/10 Posts: 48948	Wed 06/19/13 10:34 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 10:41 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Yes it would be a sin. What would make the difference if they were married?

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 10:44 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Dodo_David Joined Fri 08/13/10 Posts: 48948	Wed 06/19/13 10:51 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 10:53 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations

Dodo_David Joined Fri 08/13/10 Posts: 48948	Wed 06/19/13 10:54 AM
So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? Yes it would be a sin. What would make the difference if they were married? What difference would it make? Dude, there is nothing sinful about a husband and wife having sexual desire for each other.

Ruth34611 Joined Sat 08/02/08 Posts: 32402	Wed 06/19/13 10:55 AM
Yes it would be a sin. What would make the difference if they were married? Because its only a sin to lust after a woman who is not your wife. Lusting after your wife is not a sin.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 10:56 AM
So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? Yes it would be a sin. What would make the difference if they were married? What difference would it make? Dude, there is nothing sinful about a husband and wife having sexual desire for each other. Why focus on that area of the relationship? Is it that important? Why not spend your time focusing on other parts of the relationship, why the sexual area? Why can't that form of action wait till they are united together again?

Conrad_73 Joined Sat 09/29/07 Posts: 22488	Wed 06/19/13 10:57 AM Edited by Conrad_73 on Wed 06/19/13 11:00 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations just cauterize your Brain,and you will be without "Sin"! BTW,the Heart is a Pump! But if they had said "A Mind Deviseth Wicked Things",they would have had to admit that Man actually possesses a rational,thinking Mind! It's interesting to see how some are longing to return to that Robotic state of Mind of those first two in Eden,until they ate from that fruit!

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 11:00 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations just cauterize your Brain,and you will be without "Sin"! BTW,the Heart is a Pump! But if they had said "A Mind Deviseth Wicked Things",they would have had to admit that Man actually possesses a rational,thinking Mind! So guessing you've never loved someone with all your heart? Cause I mean, it's just a pump, how in the world could you love someone with a pump?

Conrad_73 Joined Sat 09/29/07 Posts: 22488	Wed 06/19/13 11:03 AM
Masturbation is a very serious sin as well. hold that thought. The Bible says nothing about masturbation. I agree. Catholics like to cite the Onan story as the basis for this. I find it to be a real stretch. I have read Christian authors though who say that while the act of masturbation itself is not a sin, the thoughts that inevitably go along with it are. Apparently spilling your seed on the ground is the sin Uh, try reading the actual story in the book of Genesis. According to the ancient Levirate marriage laws, Onan was legally required to produce an offspring with his dead brother's widow, who hadn't given birth before becoming a widow. Thus, Onan was legally required to impregnate his widowed sister-in-law. According to the story in Genesis, Onan pretended to fulfill the law by having sexual intercourse with his widowed sister-in-law, but just as he was about to ejaculate, Onan pulled out of his sister-in-law in order to prevent his semen from entering her. In short, Onan practiced birth control at a time when he wasn't permitted to do so. The sin of Onan was his refusal to impregnate his widowed sister-in-law as required by Levirate marriage laws. That's how I always understood it. Onan's sin was disobedience. Disobedience to whom? Could only have been to the Tribe,judging by the nature of that Rule!

singmesweet Joined Mon 07/28/08 Posts: 26661	Wed 06/19/13 11:04 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, because someone might be thinking about something, it's just as bad as doing it? Interesting.

Dodo_David Joined Fri 08/13/10 Posts: 48948	Wed 06/19/13 11:05 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations Uh, Proverbs 6:18 says . . . "a heart that devises wicked schemes" (NIV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (ESV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NKJV) "those who make evil plans" (CEV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NASB) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NRSV) It isn't good to rely on a sentence written in archaic English if one doesn't understand the meanings of words used in archaic English.

Conrad_73 Joined Sat 09/29/07 Posts: 22488	Wed 06/19/13 11:06 AM Edited by Conrad_73 on Wed 06/19/13 11:07 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations just cauterize your Brain,and you will be without "Sin"! BTW,the Heart is a Pump! But if they had said "A Mind Deviseth Wicked Things",they would have had to admit that Man actually possesses a rational,thinking Mind! So guessing you've never loved someone with all your heart? Cause I mean, it's just a pump, how in the world could you love someone with a pump? I suggest you open a Book on Anatomy,and read the Chapters on the Heart! BTW,if it weren't for Lust,Humanity would have ceased to exist a long time ago! Paul sure did a Number on some Christians!

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 11:10 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations Uh, Proverbs 6:18 says . . . "a heart that devises wicked schemes" (NIV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (ESV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NKJV) "those who make evil plans" (CEV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NASB) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NRSV) It isn't good to rely on a sentence written in archaic English if one doesn't understand the meanings of words used in archaic English. Have no idea what you're talking about with "archaic English" Proverbs 6:18 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, What do you think "wicked imaginations" are? Anything that goes against God is "wicked". And God has told us if we even look upon a woman with lust in our hearts, we have already committed adultery. So obviously that form of action is "wicked" to God. And since they would be "fantasies" they would be imaginations. So therefore lusting after someone would fit in the "deviseth wicked imaginations".

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Wed 06/19/13 11:12 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations just cauterize your Brain,and you will be without "Sin"! BTW,the Heart is a Pump! But if they had said "A Mind Deviseth Wicked Things",they would have had to admit that Man actually possesses a rational,thinking Mind! So guessing you've never loved someone with all your heart? Cause I mean, it's just a pump, how in the world could you love someone with a pump? I suggest you open a Book on Anatomy,and read the Chapters on the Heart! BTW,if it weren't for Lust,Humanity would have ceased to exist a long time ago! Paul sure did a Number on some Christians! Lust has absolutely nothing to do with us still existing. The world may not be so populated if people didn't lust, but nevertheless wouldn't cease to exist.

Dodo_David Joined Fri 08/13/10 Posts: 48948	Wed 06/19/13 11:32 AM
Can you explain why this makes masturbation a sin? Yeah, it's lust. The scriptures may not go into great "detail" on it's description eg., "do not masturbate", but when masturbating what is one thinking about? Are they not thinking about some form of sexual activity? And thinking of it to the extent of needing to have the pleasure there of? That would fall into "lust". And that is one of the 7 deadly sins. So, if a man and his wife are physically separated for some reason, and if either thinks about the other while masturbating, then sin is being committed? By the way, the alleged list of "seven deadly sins" comes from the Catholic Catechism, not from the Bible. Catholic thing you say? Proverbs 6:16-19 16 These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, 19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren. Where is "lust" in that passage in Proverbs? Answer: It isn't there. 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations Uh, Proverbs 6:18 says . . . "a heart that devises wicked schemes" (NIV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (ESV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NKJV) "those who make evil plans" (CEV) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NASB) "a heart that devises wicked plans" (NRSV) It isn't good to rely on a sentence written in archaic English if one doesn't understand the meanings of words used in archaic English. Have no idea what you're talking about with "archaic English" Proverbs 6:18 18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, What do you think "wicked imaginations" are? Anything that goes against God is "wicked". And God has told us if we even look upon a woman with lust in our hearts, we have already committed adultery. So obviously that form of action is "wicked" to God. And since they would be "fantasies" they would be imaginations. So therefore lusting after someone would fit in the "deviseth wicked imaginations". Dude, you are begging the question. The English language has changed a lot since the year 1611 CE. That is why modern-day English-speaking people are sometimes tripped up by the wording of the KJV. They read into the KJV meanings that were not intended by the KJV's translators. For that reason, I cited Proverbs 6:18 as it appears in modern English versions of the Bible. The modern versions more accurately translate what is said in the Hebrew Old Testament manuscripts. Indeed, the JPS Tanak translates Proverbs 6:18 as saying "a mind that hatches evil plots". The English word "imaginations" simply isn't an accurate translation of the original Hebrew.