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| Topic: one wonders why submission has to be enforced on us , women | |
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Edited by
Dragoness
on
Thu 08/25/11 10:20 AM
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No matter what the interpretation is, the bible is misogynistic and chauvinistic. None of which is healthy for a woman to believe and live by whether a woman realizes it or not. When you read the Bible God will guide you, if you are open to "His" interpretations. Submission and respect do not mean the same thing. That is what my point was. None of the definitions pointed to that being true either. Even with all the different forms of the definition. Like I said, it depends of which context the word is used in. bow down to = submit kneel to = submit fall down before = submit. Submitting is to allow control over. None of which should be happening in a healthy relationship. Submitting is being humbled to. And in any healthy relationship, if you humble yourself to your partner and they, likewise, humble themselves to you, it's a blessed thing. NOT! To all of it, just not. |
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Edited by
Simonedemidova
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Thu 08/25/11 10:27 AM
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A relationship is give and take. Love is to be shared. Holding love because she is not submissive is very bad action. Before asking a women to be submissive she has to feel secure, love and trust that you will never abuse of such autority to tell her to do things that will make her suffer or that she may regret. In my previous relationship I noticed that the women who was really submissive was the one I was giving most sincere love and I wasn,t never trying to dictate her but at the contrary we were discussing and she would almost always do what I wanted since I sincerely wanted the best for us and she could tell. I want to remind most men that a women is intelligent, loving, worth to be loved and to be respected. Even if she decides to be submissive.. If you don't let her discuss with you and give her opinion you are not having a wife than. It is a big mistake because the WOMEN have so much to give INTELLECTUALLY ALSO.... From a man who knows a women to become a wife she has to be your PARTNER, FRIEND AND LOVE ONE. IF you were to move in with someone (Take the marital status out) and you did not have a JOB and they provided all the financial support for your wants and needs,,, would you feel you should have EQUAL say in that household? ITs a matter of common sense, to me, and its a function of what each persons RESPONSIBILITIES earns them in each situation. You cannot ASK someone to be submissive, dominant. These are both parts of who we are just as we are all part of a man and a woman. Some extremes exist where people choose expression of exclusively their submissive side and some where they exclusively dominate. But there is no ABSOLUTE here, nor should there be. Just as children sometimes TEACH parents but it is the parents RESPONSIBILITY to teach the child. Rarely can two or more people find AGREEMENT in everying and someone will have to be the first one to come up with the ANSWER that the other agrees to. This is the nature of a relationship. I am more of a submissive(when the condition is right with a responsible and trustworthy partner) than a dominant because I dont wish the RESPONSIBILITY that comes with being responsible for someone else. I prefer letting a responsible person who ENJOYS doing that do so, becuase, despite popular belief,, there are very few situations where SOMEONE doesnt eventually take the lead and make a decision before everyone else does...whether we call it an agreement or not. Hell yea I am equal, no matter how much support he gives. My job in the relationship may be different from his but I am sure his equal in all ways. Don't let someone pull that financial support means you are less than me crap on you. If you do you are demeaning yourself. This is also why men continue to make more than women for the same jobs...it is a power and control thing. On the one thing, they act like they want to provide for you and "allow" you to stay home and care for "their" kids. When in reality they want to control you and suggest that you will not survive financially without them. Especially those who get you out of work for 10 years during marriage. I worked two jobs throughout my marriage and I still work as a divorcee. Plus I have court ordered child support. Of course he skates around that anyways cuz he is a bloodsucking loser. But then again..thats why we are divorced. And when the strong ones do get up and leave(the women) then men go and say what a terrible mother you are anyways after raising you've been raising the kids the whole time anyways. Funny how that works. |
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A relationship is give and take. Love is to be shared. Holding love because she is not submissive is very bad action. Before asking a women to be submissive she has to feel secure, love and trust that you will never abuse of such autority to tell her to do things that will make her suffer or that she may regret. In my previous relationship I noticed that the women who was really submissive was the one I was giving most sincere love and I wasn,t never trying to dictate her but at the contrary we were discussing and she would almost always do what I wanted since I sincerely wanted the best for us and she could tell. I want to remind most men that a women is intelligent, loving, worth to be loved and to be respected. Even if she decides to be submissive.. If you don't let her discuss with you and give her opinion you are not having a wife than. It is a big mistake because the WOMEN have so much to give INTELLECTUALLY ALSO.... From a man who knows a women to become a wife she has to be your PARTNER, FRIEND AND LOVE ONE. IF you were to move in with someone (Take the marital status out) and you did not have a JOB and they provided all the financial support for your wants and needs,,, would you feel you should have EQUAL say in that household? ITs a matter of common sense, to me, and its a function of what each persons RESPONSIBILITIES earns them in each situation. You cannot ASK someone to be submissive, dominant. These are both parts of who we are just as we are all part of a man and a woman. Some extremes exist where people choose expression of exclusively their submissive side and some where they exclusively dominate. But there is no ABSOLUTE here, nor should there be. Just as children sometimes TEACH parents but it is the parents RESPONSIBILITY to teach the child. Rarely can two or more people find AGREEMENT in everying and someone will have to be the first one to come up with the ANSWER that the other agrees to. This is the nature of a relationship. I am more of a submissive(when the condition is right with a responsible and trustworthy partner) than a dominant because I dont wish the RESPONSIBILITY that comes with being responsible for someone else. I prefer letting a responsible person who ENJOYS doing that do so, becuase, despite popular belief,, there are very few situations where SOMEONE doesnt eventually take the lead and make a decision before everyone else does...whether we call it an agreement or not. Hell yea I am equal, no matter how much support he gives. My job in the relationship may be different from his but I am sure his equal in all ways. Don't let someone pull that financial support means you are less than me crap on you. If you do you are demeaning yourself. This is also why men continue to make more than women for the same jobs...it is a power and control thing. On the one thing, they act like they want to provide for you and "allow" you to stay home and care for "their" kids. When in reality they want to control you and suggest that you will not survive financially without them. Especially those who get you out of work for 10 years during marriage. I worked two jobs throughout my marriage and I still work as a divorcee. Plus I have court ordered child support. Of course he skates around that anyways cuz he is a bloodsucking loser. But then again..thats why we are divorced. And when the strong ones do get up and leave(the women) then men go and say what a terrible mother you are anyways after raising you've been raising the kids the whole time anyways. Funny how that works. Agreed. As long as women buy into this "submit" crap, we allow ourselves to be treated as a "submitter" which is less then a "non submitter"... no matter what nice name you give it. 
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to begin with,what have you done to your photo jumper?if it is a universally accepted value for human beings moreso women to submit to there husbands irregardless of race then who are we to refute that.women do not head homes they are supportive,they advise husbands on crucial matters of the family but like it or not 90 percent of their contribution is approved. In other words they decide for us so in a nutshell we all submit to each other So, you believe that women should submit because they aren't heads of households and should just be supportive to their husbands? Times are changing.
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The happiest relationships I have been in did not require submission, but because of the love and respect we shared for each other it was very simple to try and please one ANOTHER..(key words ONE ANOTHER). Agreeing at times to let each make decisions and have their ways, both male and female, loving and respecting each others concerns, wants, likes and dislikes. Submitting is the same as telling your child to vacuum and correcting them if they talk back. Why would an adult male talk to an adult female that way...
Marriage is a legal binding document in which is usually stated "respect" somewhere in the vows. |
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 Regardless of ones belief system, most woman expect the man to lead the family household, not so much from a monetary standpoint, but to lead by example, as to be a loving partner. a protector, the fixer of things, and to kill all the icky creepy crawly things. 
Ha Ha. That is too funny and very old fashioned. Men; I meet can't protect me, can't fix things for me, and certainly can't kill icky creepy things. Thank goodness I can do it all for myself. |
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Woman are different from men both on a physical and emotional level, men's brains are also hardwired different then woman's, which is why men generally excel in math and science, there are woman that also excel in theses areas, but being a man mind is more pragmatic then a woman's, men have very low levels of estrogen, higher levels of estrogen attribute to have a higher degree of emotions, therefore having become less logical. I am glad men that I served with in the military didn't think that way or a lot of people would have died. |
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to begin with,what have you done to your photo jumper?if it is a universally accepted value for human beings moreso women to submit to there husbands irregardless of race then who are we to refute that.women do not head homes they are supportive,they advise husbands on crucial matters of the family but like it or not 90 percent of their contribution is approved. In other words they decide for us so in a nutshell we all submit to each other So, you believe that women should submit because they aren't heads of households and should just be supportive to their husbands? Times are changing.
You'll have to realize that many people do not follow the bible. So, what seems correct to you because of the bible will not be the same as those who don't live by the bible. |
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How in the hell, did I get in the religious section???
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How in the hell, did I get in the religious section???
You must have been a bad girl. 
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Now you will have to drink three Bloody Marys for penance.
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How in the hell, did I get in the religious section???
You must have been a bad girl.
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please note this bible is not dismeaning women 2.bible is not a story book but a book that contain programme of God for His creature.
......the fact is, God created us because of His own programme and it is when God progress that everything is coming in including men and women. Does anyone wants to disagree this fact? Before I progress. |
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How in the hell, did I get in the religious section???
You must have been a bad girl.
"Is that a banana in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?" Mae West
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Following the bible is not healthy for a woman. I would not suggest it if they want to have self respect and self worth. The bible doesn't allow for it for a woman alone, she only gets her value from a man. not entirely true 1 Corinthians 7:8 ESV / 96 helpful votes To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single as I am. 1 Corinthians 7:1-40 ESV / 50 helpful votes Now concerning the matters about which you wrote: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But because of the temptation to sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband. The husband should give to his wife her conjugal rights, and likewise the wife to her husband. For the wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. Likewise the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. The bible places no inferior status to a woman or a man for remaining single. It places our value in how we live our life, not in whether we do it with a partner. Oh but it is true that the bible is misogynistic and demeaning to women. It starts in Genesis. If a woman accepts this story she is demeaning herself. One verse does not negate the full teachings of the book. Which is not healthy for women. Again you have to outgrow the teachings of the bible like I have in order to really see the bible as it is. If you are not willing to do so then you may be trapped by it's derogatory teachings about women. It is not the word of god, it is the word of very power hungry men. Who disregarded women as important in their daily lives. I accept Genesis and dont demean myself. Im not even sure I see the connection. And if one verse doesnt negate the full teachings, than its hard to say what the 'full teachings' are as opposed to which are juse 'one verse' The TOTALITY of the book is about living life in a certain manner, regardless of gender. I would think that there are PLENTY of examples of women being cherished in the bible but that it takes the reader be willing to 'outgrow' their need to defy any differences in people to see it. |
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A relationship is give and take. Love is to be shared. Holding love because she is not submissive is very bad action. Before asking a women to be submissive she has to feel secure, love and trust that you will never abuse of such autority to tell her to do things that will make her suffer or that she may regret. In my previous relationship I noticed that the women who was really submissive was the one I was giving most sincere love and I wasn,t never trying to dictate her but at the contrary we were discussing and she would almost always do what I wanted since I sincerely wanted the best for us and she could tell. I want to remind most men that a women is intelligent, loving, worth to be loved and to be respected. Even if she decides to be submissive.. If you don't let her discuss with you and give her opinion you are not having a wife than. It is a big mistake because the WOMEN have so much to give INTELLECTUALLY ALSO.... From a man who knows a women to become a wife she has to be your PARTNER, FRIEND AND LOVE ONE. IF you were to move in with someone (Take the marital status out) and you did not have a JOB and they provided all the financial support for your wants and needs,,, would you feel you should have EQUAL say in that household? ITs a matter of common sense, to me, and its a function of what each persons RESPONSIBILITIES earns them in each situation. You cannot ASK someone to be submissive, dominant. These are both parts of who we are just as we are all part of a man and a woman. Some extremes exist where people choose expression of exclusively their submissive side and some where they exclusively dominate. But there is no ABSOLUTE here, nor should there be. Just as children sometimes TEACH parents but it is the parents RESPONSIBILITY to teach the child. Rarely can two or more people find AGREEMENT in everying and someone will have to be the first one to come up with the ANSWER that the other agrees to. This is the nature of a relationship. I am more of a submissive(when the condition is right with a responsible and trustworthy partner) than a dominant because I dont wish the RESPONSIBILITY that comes with being responsible for someone else. I prefer letting a responsible person who ENJOYS doing that do so, becuase, despite popular belief,, there are very few situations where SOMEONE doesnt eventually take the lead and make a decision before everyone else does...whether we call it an agreement or not. Hell yea I am equal, no matter how much support he gives. My job in the relationship may be different from his but I am sure his equal in all ways. Don't let someone pull that financial support means you are less than me crap on you. If you do you are demeaning yourself. The law would disagree,,, if you are in someone elses home, name not on the lease, no financial responsibility for it, you would NOT have EQUAL LEGAL rights to that home, or anything in it(Except maybe those things you purchased). Financial support doesnt mean you are less than, but it gives authority over those things that the finances take care of. |
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The happiest relationships I have been in did not require submission, but because of the love and respect we shared for each other it was very simple to try and please one ANOTHER..(key words ONE ANOTHER). Agreeing at times to let each make decisions and have their ways, both male and female, loving and respecting each others concerns, wants, likes and dislikes. Submitting is the same as telling your child to vacuum and correcting them if they talk back. Why would an adult male talk to an adult female that way... Marriage is a legal binding document in which is usually stated "respect" somewhere in the vows. the adult child relationship is about love, discipline, and guidance, correcting them when they misbehave is a reflection of that discipline and guidance submit merely means:To commit (something) to the consideration or judgment of another. The bible teaches husbands to be to their wives as Christ was to man and Christ did indeed SERVE man and at least on one occasion submit very SERIOUSLY to the judgment of man(for the benefit of man) As I said before, the husband and wife belong to each other , they cherish each other, and if that is the case submitting becomes something that benefits the FAMILY unit , as opposed to constant power struggles but that works only WHEN both cherish each other and treat each other appropriately in the first place,, it wouldnt apply at all to any situation with a man who wished to use or belittle or harm a woman behind the excuse of 'submission' |
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Edited by
winterblue56
on
Thu 08/25/11 04:34 PM
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No matter what the interpretation is, the bible is misogynistic and chauvinistic. None of which is healthy for a woman to believe and live by whether a woman realizes it or not. When you read the Bible God will guide you, if you are open to "His" interpretations. Submission and respect do not mean the same thing. That is what my point was. None of the definitions pointed to that being true either. Even with all the different forms of the definition. Like I said, it depends of which context the word is used in. bow down to = submit kneel to = submit fall down before = submit. Submitting is to allow control over. None of which should be happening in a healthy relationship. Submitting is being humbled to. And in any healthy relationship, if you humble yourself to your partner and they, likewise, humble themselves to you, it's a blessed thing. NOT! To all of it, just not. I think you need some English classes 
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I think you need some English classes
Why? Because she doesn't agree with you? |
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please note this bible is not dismeaning women 2.bible is not a story book but a book that contain programme of God for His creature. ......the fact is, God created us because of His own programme and it is when God progress that everything is coming in including men and women. Does anyone wants to disagree this fact? Before I progress. Completely untrue and unverifiable at any level. But carry on.... |
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