It's pages contain stories of 'God's People' mercilessly slaughtering innocent Midianite children, yet its Believers have the audacity to complain about violence in the Quran?

Not to mention that it's a cobbled-together work, its 'books' being chosen by mortal men from among a whole plethora of ghostwritten works after that crucified guy's death. Most of the 'winning' works were allegedly written by Paul, a murderer.

And it's riddled with contradiction and inaccuracy.


-Kerry O.

You have to be able to read with better eyes and understanding than that.
I'm not denying that it's a jigsaw puzzle. I've seen the various regional dialects oftentimes written in the same sentence.
If you read only the english translations, of course it seems full of contradictions and inaccuracies.
However, when you read it in the language that is closer in date to its origins, you begin to see things that leaves you wondering "why did they change it so much?" (Historically, the Council of Nicene was attempting to unify the empire under one banner ... and it partially explains the cause of the misinterpretations).
The two factions in competition for total power and control of the "holy lands" during the years of the crusades were the muslims and [christians under roman rule]. But that does not mean either side was right in the way they pursued control. In a word, it was the beast.

I would say it's possible, but then when it comes down to it what is a god? There could be millions or more easily. It's something as a philosopher I have come to accept.

However "god" by the religious texts I cannot have much faith in.
Please do not take this as a bash on religion, it has its purpose that I will not refute.

You can define god however you like. The point is, does god have an effect on the universe? If so, how can we measure it?

Does god answer prayers, for example? All we'd need is a group of subjects, half of them pray for a result and half do not. We note the findings and compare the two groups. Does the praying group get better results than the non-praying group?

Just "how" would you expect an answer from God?
(Or any god for that matter) (or even an alien intelligence).

Yes, via the laws of vibration, if the prayer is executed correctly, it is always answered.

In vibration, like attracts like.

But this is universal law. It's not some deity doing it.

As usual, all the same, age-old excuses for the barbarism by God's Chosen, and the blatant contradictions in the holy books. "It was translations." "It was Satan!"

As far as history goes, Moses had a Midianite wife. One wonders if she was killed, too-- the Bible doesn't say and I'd bet Christian historians/apologists find it VERY inconvenient, so they just ignore it.


Just as you did in your rebuttal, that conveniently ignores genocide that the Bible reports. What does the Bible say about pointing out the beams in the eyes of others?

Not mention their forgiving Paul for being the ancient equivalent of a German SS officer...


-Kerry O.

from EasternSquirrel who said:

"If you read only the english translations, of course it seems full of contradictions and inaccuracies.
However, when you read it in the language that is closer in date to its origins, you begin to see things that leaves you wondering "why did they change it so much?" (Historically, the Council of Nicene was attempting to unify the empire under one banner ... and it partially explains the cause of the misinterpretations)."

All the more reason to totally reject the rewritten version of the Bible we have been told was the "word of God" that is available today. Your average person on the street doesn't have time to seek out and attempt to read the Bible in the language closer in date to its origins. People don't speak or write those languages.

So your solution is unrealistic. No body is going to do that. Period.

Therefore we are left with a book we can't believe or trust.

There are many spiritual books today that reveal the hidden knowledge and wisdom of the ages without having to decode the Bible and try to interpret it. It has been misunderstood for 2000 years. Its time to move on to better things that make more sense.

The real truth to the matter is this....
It isn't the books (or any books for that matter) that should be relied upon for the source of any absolute truths or doctorines. That in of itself is falicious and misleading being biased towards those who wrote it.
The truth comes from within.
The true "word" is written within us. The "word" isn't necessariliy "the spoken or written word", but is the nature of the spirit within us.
We cannot rely upon a "written word" by anyone to tell us what's right or wrong or give us absolute guidance in all matters.
For example:
You're driving along the beach and you see some people trying to dig their car out of the sand before the tide comes in and sweeps it away (or submerges it). You happen to be driving a 4x4 and have a tow rope handy. You see other capable 4x4's passing them by.
Since you're there and have the ability to help, don't you feel an urge to stop and give them an assist?
Here is another example:
Your neighbors' lawn looks really ratty since they don't have a lawnmower (or it's broken for whatever reason) .... You happen to have at your disposal the means to make it better for them. Something inside you urges you to take matters in your own hands and help.
Current events are full of examples on a more grand scale.
See, it's not all about accepting or rejecting what was actually written. It's more about accepting or rejecting what you often don't see that's written in a different way. Those are examples that you can read about and you live in such situations.

Oh, pardon me, I thought you were trying to tell people to read the Bible.

The stuff you write above is common sense and common decency and kindness. (In my opinion, it has little to do with reading the Bible or even organized religion.)

People know what is right if they are well adjusted and balanced people. So what you are saying above is the same thing any healthy decent person does and knows.

Most 'evil' is done by sick, disturbed, unbalanced and insane people.

Did Moses 'look within himself' before he ordered the slaughter of his wife's own people on the flimsiest justifications?

I think not...


-Kerry O.

I didn't know Moses did that, but I guess I'm not at all surprised.

How about a study that compared heart patients? One group is told they have people raying for them in a nearby church. Another group also has people praying for them, but aren't told about it (to eliminate the placebo effect) and a final group that isn't being prayed for at all.

If groups A and B do better than group C, we'd have an answer about prayer and it's effect.

In fact, this study has already been done.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article1072638.ece

The result was people in groups B and C did better than group A. It seems that knowing others are praying for you has a negative effect.

I suppose you could argue that god doesn't want to be tested and therefore did nothing to help any of the heart patients in the study. But, that would mean he allowed a few of the faithful to suffer in order to avoid the test. This doesn't sound like the all loving god I was taught to believe in as a child.

Moses didn't really do that. It is only a story.

Ah, but if that's true, that opens an even BIGGER can of worms for the Biblical Infallibility folks-- the fact that the author(s) of the Bible lied about history.


-Kerry O.

If you want to know about the Old Testament, ask a Jew. That is their part of the Bible.

A story doesn't have to be real to have value and contain truth.

The Bible is filled with contradictions, no matter what translation you read. We are better at that kind of thing now, so modern translations are the best if you want to do the research.

I think its quite amazing that any such study was even done.

Many stories come from truth, the "Mountain out of a mole hill" idea. Paul Bunyan might have been an actual lumberjack also but as the tale grew so did his height and everything. Then they add in the Blue ox to make it even more amazing of a story. They only difference is that no one wrote it down and tried to pass it off as history for the religious parrots to keep repeating...lol

And what are your thoughts about the results?

I'm not at all surprise by the results.

The people focused on the illness and the surgery. They did not focus on health or visualize the person healthy. The prayers only made the situation worse because of HOW they visualized.

Your thoughts and visualizations ARE YOUR PRAYERS.!!

"The worshippers starting praying for the patients the night before surgery and for the next two weeks, asking God to grant "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications".


The person (patient) who was told about the prayer was also focused (even more) on the illness."

The prayer mentioned the words:

SURGERY
SUCCESSFUL
HEALTHY RECOVERY
COMPLICATIONS

WHY THESE WORDS AND PRAYER WERE NEGATIVE AND PRAYING FOR THE OPPOSITE:

"Surgery" paints a serious picture of going under the knife. That is what the people pictured.

"Successful" hints at the possibility that "unsuccessful" was an option. That is what the people thought about.

"Healthy recovery" The word "recovery" indicates and states that the patient is ill. That is what the people thought about and pictured.

"Complications" Suggests that there will be complications. (The word "no" does not negate the visual picture of the complications, as the subconscious thinking stuff does not see negatives....ever.

Conclusion:
People don't know HOW to create what they want and they don't know how to pray correctly.

According to the law of attraction, you get what you think about. You create what you focus on.

They all focused on and thought about complications, illness, surgery etc. They probably also pictured the prayer not working, knowing it was a scientific study.

So did the patient.