http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090808/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama_health_care

I guess I just don't understand how it is the key to economic recovery. What part did it have to play in the downfall of the economy? How were jobs lost because of health care?

"Never let a good crisis go to waste"

Sounds all too familiar. I always find it ironic how one side that once declared W to be "fear mongering" with the Patriot Act and terrorists to now laugh at the other who believe this is the other side of the coin.

It has nothing to do with economic recovery. It is understandable that bankruptcy due to medical bills is a large problem, but there are many factors not included: How did those live? Did they skirt the few hundred a month to cover their family in order to spend unnecessary capital elsewhere? Were they eligible and decided they did not need healthcare? There are many holes in the figures for medical-related bankruptcies just as much as the 47 million figure for uninsured.

This is nothing but a large push for the Obama agenda. It is no surprise. If you don't believe me, look at what has passed: the stimulus with billions in special (often democratic) interests, the appropriations bill which was supposed to not have any pork get loaded with plenty of it, and now, a push for a nationalized health plan.

What in all of that has changed anything on Wall Street? In fact, I believe fully that what they have done has completely exacerbated the situation as those involved were not even allowed to be taught a lesson by the market - it was nothing but a few symbolic sacrifices in the canning of a few CEOs.

No reform, no change. Just another politician pushing their own agenda with charisma. hopefully, that will soon run out. Unfrotunately, it may not be soon enough.

With the increase in costs I have incured how can it not effect the economey!!!!!!!!Over 400% in last ten years!!!! I have less money to spend on consumer goods. I HAVE HAD TO CUT BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Same pay check with less money!!!! Look at the rise in costs and what is spent on healthcare by ALL OF US and say it doesn't effect the economy

That is not because of Health Care. Health care is colateral damage from printing worthless money.

Let unother bubble burst.

What plan are you on? My plans have all been through the exact same company at my last 4 jobs and in the 6 years, the price changed maybe 50%. Inflation alone accounts for a large portion of that.

Either way, while that does have a small impact on the economy, it is not significant to piss $100B a year away on it. Besides, that is largely incurred costs from fraud and abuse and other flaws in our current system - flaws that will only be exacerbated by throwing money at it.

All things involving money impact the economy, however, this is like deer hunting with a missile.

That deer is perfectly safe... Missle is made of worthless paper!


Muck up the forest...

Bet the deer would be safe.

We are the forest...

http://mingle2.com/topic/show/238331

The French health care system has been quantitatively measured to perform significantly better than our own, delivers universal coverage and costs 40% less as a fraction of GDP. If we simply directly adopted their proven model and decided not to waste any more sessions of Congress on it then we would likely have the most effective and efficient health care system in the world in a couple of years AND it would be 40% cheaper. We are talking about a savings of 4% of our GDP which is a savings of approximately 0.4 x $14,000 Billion = $5,600 Billion ANNUALLY.

see:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(nominal)

http://www.photius.com/rankings/healthranks.html


and

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2007/08/11/frances_model_healthcare_system/

http://atlantis2.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4546219n

It would be nice to improve our health care system, provide universal care, and save about $5600 billion dollars each year. If you think this would be beneficial then I urge you to contact your Congressional and Senate representatives and suggest that the try this approach. It might really help a little bit with our economic recovery to say nothing of our general health!



I even volunteer to be the architect of this plan and I will charge only $5.6 billion to do it which is merely 0.1% of the savings in the first year!



or go ahead and flush the money down the toilet again in 2010
see if I care...(lifts the commode lid suggestively jiggles the handle)

and

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2007/08/11/frances_model_healthcare_system/

http://atlantis2.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4546219n

It would be nice to improve our health care system, provide universal care, and save about $5600 billion dollars each year. If you think this would be beneficial then I urge you to contact your Congressional and Senate representatives and suggest that the try this approach. It might really help a little bit with our economic recovery to say nothing of our general health!



I even volunteer to be the architect of this plan and I will charge only $5.6 billion to do it which is merely 0.1% of the savings in the first year!



or go ahead and flush the money down the toilet again in 2010
see if I care...(lifts the commode lid suggestively jiggles the handle)



I didn't ask for fixes to health care. I wanted to know why this health care reform is so "key" to the recovery of our economy.

Thank you for your idea though. If their system is so great then why haven't all nations coverted to it?

I would imagine the insurance companies could answer that question, but I am sure they won't.

Why would it be up to the insurance companies? If their system is so great. then why hasn't this addministration tried to adopt it? If it is that much better, then I'm sure the people wouldn't have a problem with it, and it would have allready been passed.

and

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2007/08/11/frances_model_healthcare_system/

http://atlantis2.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=4546219n

It would be nice to improve our health care system, provide universal care, and save about $5600 billion dollars each year. If you think this would be beneficial then I urge you to contact your Congressional and Senate representatives and suggest that the try this approach. It might really help a little bit with our economic recovery to say nothing of our general health!



I even volunteer to be the architect of this plan and I will charge only $5.6 billion to do it which is merely 0.1% of the savings in the first year!



or go ahead and flush the money down the toilet again in 2010
see if I care...(lifts the commode lid suggestively jiggles the handle)




The thing you don't understand is the serious investment required. You cannot compare ourselves to any other nation (except maybe canada) due to population density and R&D.

We are far larger than France. This requires a larger spread of resources than in any european nation. We have five times the surgeons that France does, five times the number of MRI machines, and almost 3.5 times the number of CT machines per capita. These investments require serious capital that France has not spent and also makes it more likely that in an emergency, a patient will have access to technology that could very well save their life.



It's all about scale. It is a complete fallacy to believe that just because it "works" to some degree in a smaller nation that it will work for us. We are a nation unlike any other on the planet and we have to approach this problem as such.

Do you know how powerful the insurance and drug company lobbies are? They aren't going to give up their gravy for you or me with out a major fight.

I didn't ask for fixes to health care. I wanted to know why this health care reform is so "key" to the recovery of our economy.


You asked why this health care reform bill is so "key" to the recovery of our economy. I replied that it is worth potentially $5.6 trillion dollars annually. You see what I mean?

Fixing our broken and extremely costly health care system could be a HUGE savings for our budget if done right.

The stimulus bill by comparison is only worth about $787 billion.

It's not. Don't be so surprised that politicians are chronic liars.

You asked why this health care reform bill is so "key" to the recovery of our economy. I replied that it is worth potentially $5.6 trillion dollars annually. You see what I mean?

Fixing our broken and extremely costly health care system could be a HUGE savings for our budget if done right.

The stimulus bill by comparison is only worth about $787 billion.

I see what you mean. But useing France as a model is nowhere near what is being put forth from our congress so that is a mute point. Your key phrase in there "IF DONE RIGHT" pushing something through that none well maybe some have read will not amount to any savings but an even BIGGER deficit.

Doing it right is "key" to the improvement and well being of our economy because our current system is bleeding us dry.

What they are discussing now does not go far enough in my opinion.
Although it might be difficult there is no reason why we could not adopt the reasonably successful French model. Maybe even improve it over time. And adopting an existing model would make the overhaul much more straightforward.

I don't believe it is the key to our economic recovery. But that is what Obama said.

The only numbers I ever see on the news is 47 million uninsured. And 1 trillion if not more to fund it. Mind you 1 trillion we do not have nor do they know where to get it from. Can you say increased taxes?

i agree. it should NOT cost more. it should be done in such a way that we see immediate and dramatic savings without a reduction in care.

no excuse for it to cost more from what i can gather.

RE the French system...

Medical care is great or so they say...

What is the french debt ratio?

They are, I believe, for their size and population way in the red.

Can't borrow money to pay a debt...

debt grows larger each time you do.

Until it swallows you.