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| Topic: Believe in God or don't..Whats to lose | |
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Now i c alot of name calling this Mean arrogant g-d who demands worship and sentence children to death for rebelling against thier parents.
Yet a unborn child has it ever rebelled? Who is Arrogant and unreasonable. The old laws were so out of touch. Are they? Are these laws about the treatment of each other out of touch? Ex 21:12-28 12 The Law Concerning Violence "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death. 13 However, if he did not lie in wait, but Elohim delivered him into his hand, then I will appoint for you a place where he may flee. 14 "But if a man acts with premeditation against his neighbor, to kill him by treachery, you shall take him from My altar, that he may die. 15 "And he who strikes his father or his mother shall surely be put to death. 16 "He who kidnaps a man and sells him, or if he is found in his hand, shall surely be put to death. 17 "And he who curses his father or his mother shall surely be put to death. 18 "If men contend with each other, and one strikes the other with a stone or with his fist, and he does not die but is confined to his bed, 19 if he rises again and walks about outside with his staff, then he who struck him shall be acquitted. He shall only pay for the loss of his time, and shall provide for him to be thoroughly healed. 20 "And if a man beats his male or female servant with a rod, so that he dies under his hand, he shall surely be punished. 21 Notwithstanding, if he remains alive a day or two, he shall not be punished; for he is his property. 22 "If men fight, and hurt a woman with child , so that she gives birth prematurely, yet no harm follows, he shall surely be punished accordingly as the woman's husband imposes on him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. 23 But if any harm follows, then you shall give life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe. 26 "If a man strikes the eye of his male or female servant, and destroys it, he shall let him go free for the sake of his eye. 27 And if he knocks out the tooth of his male or female servant, he shall let him go free for the sake of his tooth. NKJV Strange huh? Eye for an eye tooth for a tooth. Servants? Aforethought hurting someone, you die if they die. If they live you pay thier wages and thier costs. Seems fair. Hurt a unborn child and it lives the Husband determines what you pay. If this baby is born with anything wrong you will pay dearly. If it dies you will die. This unborn child to this mean unreasonable G-d is just as important as you. Life for a life. No Fetus is spoken of here. Then I wonder why it says if you strike your servant and he lives a couple of days you do not die. Does not make sence at all when if you strike your servant and he loses a tooth or an eye he goes free for the Tooth's sake. A tooth or an eye has more power than your life? jacob for the hand of Rachael was her fathers servant for 14 years. now i do not know about you but I have never meant anyone who had so much love for a woman that he would be her fathers servant for 14 years to beable to marry her. Do you know anyone who has or even would consider such a thing because they were in Love? What about peoples responcibilities with thier animals? Ex 21:28-36 28 Animal Control Laws "If an ox gores a man or a woman to death, then the ox shall surely be stoned, and its flesh shall not be eaten; but the owner of the ox shall be acquitted. 29 But if the ox tended to thrust with its horn in times past, and it has been made known to his owner, and he has not kept it confined, so that it has killed a man or a woman, the ox shall be stoned and its owner also shall be put to death. 30 If there is imposed on him a sum of money, then he shall pay to redeem his life, whatever is imposed on him. 31 Whether it has gored a son or gored a daughter, according to this judgment it shall be done to him. 32 If the ox gores a male or female servant, he shall give to their master thirty shekels of silver, and the ox shall be stoned. 33 "And if a man opens a pit, or if a man digs a pit and does not cover it, and an ox or a donkey falls in it, 34 the owner of the pit shall make it good; he shall give money to their owner, but the dead animal shall be his. 35 "If one man's ox hurts another's, so that it dies, then they shall sell the live ox and divide the money from it; and the dead ox they shall also divide. 36 Or if it was known that the ox tended to thrust in time past, and its owner has not kept it confined, he shall surely pay ox for ox, and the dead animal shall be his own. NKJV The servant does not seem to have the same rights as one who is not. But remember Jacob it was his choice to be a servant for a reason. I wonder how much we consider this aspect of this demanding G-d's laws. I wonder if your son or daughter was killed by a pit bull when this pit Bull was know to the owner to be very dangerous and had attacked humans before. I wonder if justice to the owner really is not death? he knew that this animal was a threat. Does that not make him responcible alot more? How much pity would you have on the owners dog who mauled your childed to death? Unreasonable G-d huh. Then we have the pit deal. The ox in the pit. I hear that Yahshua did not believe in these Ot laws from unbelievers. What was he really saying when he spoke of the ox in the ditch? Matt 12:10-14 10 And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him. 11 And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? 12 How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days. 13 Then saith he to the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole, like as the other. 14 Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against him, how they might destroy him. KJV Sheep or ox an animal falling into a open ditch is against the law. You are to protect others from that open ditch and this includes thier animals.. Thier was more to the story than healing on the Sabbath. They wanted to accuse Yahshua. Did not Yahshua accuse them if they allowed an animal to fall into a ditch? Was not the ditches owner at fault and yet the religious leaders did not seem to have a problem thier. It ticked them off what Yahshua said. You think the Sabbath is the reason they wanted to Destroy him? 14 Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against him, how they might destroy him. KJV A lot of accussations are thrown out about the G-d of Abraham. Are they really justified. Just because you do not understand it does that make it wrong? If everything we did not understand made it wrong we all would be in a deep load of trouble.. Blessings...Miles |
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miles your posts keep getting longer each time
 laughing here
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Edited by
Milesoftheusa
on
Wed 02/11/09 12:29 PM
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We all seem to go from one extreme to the other. I see the other happening now. I try to understand why and i believe I do on most. But that is my opinion and just that. The scriptures in the beginning speaks of the Nepha or breath/spirit of Yahweh being breathed into man. This is totally different than man before this time. He made advances but did not have the knowlege from the Spirit of Yahweh to be over the Animals and thus was hunted by them. Noah's account shows the Animals were not afraid of Humans. Gens accout does not speak of eating animals but grains and herbs of the field. If animals not all but many will become gentle if not hunted by humans. Case in point Deer. I have seen and been to Deer farms where they are gentle and act as a pet. See what happens during Deer season today. They are scared to death and who wouldn't be and then we try to figure out how to protect our precious cars from being run into by a Deer that is running for thier life. Humanity as a whole is still learning but we know that we always will be. Whatever belief you have is ever learning and trying to understand. Why. Always the big question is Why. Starts as a young child . Why why why. But they are learning. Why you are not allowed to run into the street. Why you stay away from the stove when Mom is cooking. We are all children and curiosity is one of the greatests traits of the Human race. But somethings untill a better understanding happens will remain the same. It is just life. Thier is a good question I would pose to the unbeliever. Here is an example. Now I do not agree with hunting wolves from aircraft but I do not believe in Abortion either. Now I very well may be wrong in these boards about my belief that the most part of people who deny the Bible believe that a fetus is a womans right to choose whether it is terminated or not. Why is that? Why do so many say in the same breathe that partial birth abortion or late stage abortion is a womans right to get rid of a livin g thing? Thats what it has become. A thing birth control if a woman decides this. WhY? Why do we speak and spend so much time worried about animals and at the same time can choose to kill a baby who at the time of it's death could very likely live to be a 100 if it was just taken alive by Drs.? Why? Why do we cry that a wolf in Alaska is being tortured and not recongonise a cat scan of a infant when aborted is going through pain? We seem in this area of the unbelief in the Bible mostly used in this Country we can not understand why anyone would object to this procedure. Why? Were you not a fetus or late stage baby at one time? Were not your children? what gives the unbeliever the right to choose in such fashion? The cry about animal cruelty. Is this not a Oxymoron and a slap in the face to our own species intelligence? So Why? What gives you the right to slam a womans right to choose down the Believers throat? You can not say you don't because you do all the time. Read this thread closely. Look at what you are worried about? Look at the Laws the Unbeliever has been able to get passed? A drunk and I do not condone it at all but for example purposes only. A drunk hits a car with a pregnant woman inside and she loses this fetus at any stage. The procecuter will go after at least mansluaghter charges for the unborn child. Notice then it is a child. The same woman can go get rid of this now so called fetus and it is her right. Is not the same thing happening? Is not death not happening in both cases? Please prove this stance the unbeliever has? Then tell me why you worry about animal cruelty and blame believers? Which is more precious? I would like to know why this type of thought process is reasonable? Thanks.. Blessings...Miles I read your post miles and firsts off your WAY off topic. Second everything you have said is a generalization. You say, "we" and yet make it clear you are not speaking about YOU. You bring up every issue that is important to you as if its believer Vs unbeliever which is silly. Go look up Roe V wade and answer your own questions. The very fact that you try to associate this with a believer vs unbeliever either illustrates your vast ignorance of law, or it illuminates a desire to use this issue as propaganda, to use this issue as a tool in your proselytizing bag of tricks. Sad. The fact is it is not off topic. It is following the train of thought about animals being brought up. I believe we fall in the Mammal category. What the problem is, is you do not want to answer the question. Good ole bait and switch technique huh. my purpose is to try to be reasonable. what i am asking is the difference between human life and animal life. Simple question. I see alot about how unreasonable the Bible is. Sometimes we have to look at ourselves and see if we are reasonable instead of pushing off something as "not on topic" if we do not like it. Don't put out if you can not take it. I always liked the sign at our local Pool Hall. If you can not Pay Then Don't play. the bible is so deep thier has never been a book of philosophy to even come close to the true meaning to be found if the reader will only diligently search for it..Shalom...Miles |
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It really does not matter what anyone believes as long as they live good lives and remain true to themselves! Goodness based on what? Goodness based on an internal moral compass. Goodness based on decent behavior without expectation of rewards or punishment after you are dead. |
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It really does not matter what anyone believes as long as they live good lives and remain true to themselves! Goodness based on what? Goodness based on an internal moral compass. Goodness based on decent behavior without expectation of rewards or punishment after you are dead. I agree Krisma. The Bible speaks of reward. It also speaks that if that is the reason for doing right you have missed the boat...Blessings...Miles |
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Edited by
Bushidobillyclub
on
Wed 02/11/09 12:50 PM
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We all seem to go from one extreme to the other. I see the other happening now. I try to understand why and i believe I do on most. But that is my opinion and just that. The scriptures in the beginning speaks of the Nepha or breath/spirit of Yahweh being breathed into man. This is totally different than man before this time. He made advances but did not have the knowlege from the Spirit of Yahweh to be over the Animals and thus was hunted by them. Noah's account shows the Animals were not afraid of Humans. Gens accout does not speak of eating animals but grains and herbs of the field. If animals not all but many will become gentle if not hunted by humans. Case in point Deer. I have seen and been to Deer farms where they are gentle and act as a pet. See what happens during Deer season today. They are scared to death and who wouldn't be and then we try to figure out how to protect our precious cars from being run into by a Deer that is running for thier life. Humanity as a whole is still learning but we know that we always will be. Whatever belief you have is ever learning and trying to understand. Why. Always the big question is Why. Starts as a young child . Why why why. But they are learning. Why you are not allowed to run into the street. Why you stay away from the stove when Mom is cooking. We are all children and curiosity is one of the greatests traits of the Human race. But somethings untill a better understanding happens will remain the same. It is just life. Thier is a good question I would pose to the unbeliever. Here is an example. Now I do not agree with hunting wolves from aircraft but I do not believe in Abortion either. Now I very well may be wrong in these boards about my belief that the most part of people who deny the Bible believe that a fetus is a womans right to choose whether it is terminated or not. Why is that? Why do so many say in the same breathe that partial birth abortion or late stage abortion is a womans right to get rid of a livin g thing? Thats what it has become. A thing birth control if a woman decides this. WhY? Why do we speak and spend so much time worried about animals and at the same time can choose to kill a baby who at the time of it's death could very likely live to be a 100 if it was just taken alive by Drs.? Why? Why do we cry that a wolf in Alaska is being tortured and not recongonise a cat scan of a infant when aborted is going through pain? We seem in this area of the unbelief in the Bible mostly used in this Country we can not understand why anyone would object to this procedure. Why? Were you not a fetus or late stage baby at one time? Were not your children? what gives the unbeliever the right to choose in such fashion? The cry about animal cruelty. Is this not a Oxymoron and a slap in the face to our own species intelligence? So Why? What gives you the right to slam a womans right to choose down the Believers throat? You can not say you don't because you do all the time. Read this thread closely. Look at what you are worried about? Look at the Laws the Unbeliever has been able to get passed? A drunk and I do not condone it at all but for example purposes only. A drunk hits a car with a pregnant woman inside and she loses this fetus at any stage. The procecuter will go after at least mansluaghter charges for the unborn child. Notice then it is a child. The same woman can go get rid of this now so called fetus and it is her right. Is not the same thing happening? Is not death not happening in both cases? Please prove this stance the unbeliever has? Then tell me why you worry about animal cruelty and blame believers? Which is more precious? I would like to know why this type of thought process is reasonable? Thanks.. Blessings...Miles I read your post miles and firsts off your WAY off topic. Second everything you have said is a generalization. You say, "we" and yet make it clear you are not speaking about YOU. You bring up every issue that is important to you as if its believer Vs unbeliever which is silly. Go look up Roe V wade and answer your own questions. The very fact that you try to associate this with a believer vs unbeliever either illustrates your vast ignorance of law, or it illuminates a desire to use this issue as propaganda, to use this issue as a tool in your proselytizing bag of tricks. Sad. The fact is it is not off topic. It is following the train of thought about animals being brought up. I believe we fall in the Mammal category. What the problem is, is you do not want to answer the question. Good ole bait and switch technique huh. my purpose is to try to be reasonable. what i am asking is the difference between human life and animal life. Simple question. I see alot about how unreasonable the Bible is. Sometimes we have to look at ourselves and see if we are reasonable instead of pushing off something as "not on topic" if we do not like it. Don't put out if you can not take it. I always liked the sign at our local Pool Hall. If you can not Pay Then Don't play. the bible is so deep thier has never been a book of philosophy to even come close to the true meaning to be found if the reader will only diligently search for it..Shalom...Miles The title of the thread is "Believe in God or don't..Whats to lose " The original post is about pascals wager. The guy who brought up animals was also off topic . . . . This is how EVERY thread in the general religion forum ends up, IN SHAMBLES. Create your own topic on what you want to talk about or stay on topic. I am not going to answer your generalized agenda ridden rhetoric unless its on topic. |
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We all seem to go from one extreme to the other. I see the other happening now. I try to understand why and i believe I do on most. But that is my opinion and just that. The scriptures in the beginning speaks of the Nepha or breath/spirit of Yahweh being breathed into man. This is totally different than man before this time. He made advances but did not have the knowlege from the Spirit of Yahweh to be over the Animals and thus was hunted by them. Noah's account shows the Animals were not afraid of Humans. Gens accout does not speak of eating animals but grains and herbs of the field. If animals not all but many will become gentle if not hunted by humans. Case in point Deer. I have seen and been to Deer farms where they are gentle and act as a pet. See what happens during Deer season today. They are scared to death and who wouldn't be and then we try to figure out how to protect our precious cars from being run into by a Deer that is running for thier life. Humanity as a whole is still learning but we know that we always will be. Whatever belief you have is ever learning and trying to understand. Why. Always the big question is Why. Starts as a young child . Why why why. But they are learning. Why you are not allowed to run into the street. Why you stay away from the stove when Mom is cooking. We are all children and curiosity is one of the greatests traits of the Human race. But somethings untill a better understanding happens will remain the same. It is just life. Thier is a good question I would pose to the unbeliever. Here is an example. Now I do not agree with hunting wolves from aircraft but I do not believe in Abortion either. Now I very well may be wrong in these boards about my belief that the most part of people who deny the Bible believe that a fetus is a womans right to choose whether it is terminated or not. Why is that? Why do so many say in the same breathe that partial birth abortion or late stage abortion is a womans right to get rid of a livin g thing? Thats what it has become. A thing birth control if a woman decides this. WhY? Why do we speak and spend so much time worried about animals and at the same time can choose to kill a baby who at the time of it's death could very likely live to be a 100 if it was just taken alive by Drs.? Why? Why do we cry that a wolf in Alaska is being tortured and not recongonise a cat scan of a infant when aborted is going through pain? We seem in this area of the unbelief in the Bible mostly used in this Country we can not understand why anyone would object to this procedure. Why? Were you not a fetus or late stage baby at one time? Were not your children? what gives the unbeliever the right to choose in such fashion? The cry about animal cruelty. Is this not a Oxymoron and a slap in the face to our own species intelligence? So Why? What gives you the right to slam a womans right to choose down the Believers throat? You can not say you don't because you do all the time. Read this thread closely. Look at what you are worried about? Look at the Laws the Unbeliever has been able to get passed? A drunk and I do not condone it at all but for example purposes only. A drunk hits a car with a pregnant woman inside and she loses this fetus at any stage. The procecuter will go after at least mansluaghter charges for the unborn child. Notice then it is a child. The same woman can go get rid of this now so called fetus and it is her right. Is not the same thing happening? Is not death not happening in both cases? Please prove this stance the unbeliever has? Then tell me why you worry about animal cruelty and blame believers? Which is more precious? I would like to know why this type of thought process is reasonable? Thanks.. Blessings...Miles I read your post miles and firsts off your WAY off topic. Second everything you have said is a generalization. You say, "we" and yet make it clear you are not speaking about YOU. You bring up every issue that is important to you as if its believer Vs unbeliever which is silly. Go look up Roe V wade and answer your own questions. The very fact that you try to associate this with a believer vs unbeliever either illustrates your vast ignorance of law, or it illuminates a desire to use this issue as propaganda, to use this issue as a tool in your proselytizing bag of tricks. Sad. The fact is it is not off topic. It is following the train of thought about animals being brought up. I believe we fall in the Mammal category. What the problem is, is you do not want to answer the question. Good ole bait and switch technique huh. my purpose is to try to be reasonable. what i am asking is the difference between human life and animal life. Simple question. I see alot about how unreasonable the Bible is. Sometimes we have to look at ourselves and see if we are reasonable instead of pushing off something as "not on topic" if we do not like it. Don't put out if you can not take it. I always liked the sign at our local Pool Hall. If you can not Pay Then Don't play. the bible is so deep thier has never been a book of philosophy to even come close to the true meaning to be found if the reader will only diligently search for it..Shalom...Miles The title of the thread is "Believe in God or don't..Whats to lose " The original post is about pascals wager. The guy who brought up animals was also off topic . . . . You are right. But an awfull lot of people went with it and i did not see. " Off Topic" being posted then. So if the flow is going a certain direction for quite a while, then why does following the flow all of a sudden make me "off Topic' Even though the Topic is what do you have to lose. Is not an unborn child not included in our lives of what do you have to lose? The theme of the Bible is "This day Choose Life" How can that be off Topic? Then the other post i was trying to show that what you may believe something is saying and what it really is saying may be totally oppisite. Science this is very true depending on who you are talking to or your own personal knowlege.. Blessings of Shalom...Miles |
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I notice alot of people come under attack for being "Christian". People like to point fingers at our short comings. Lets ponder this.... If I believe in God and my proof is only in my faith, then i spend my life based on the teachings of Jesus and try to be a better man. When i die if there is no God, then I've spent my life seeking peace and happiness through helping other people and then if I'm wrong there's nothing. What have i lost? But if you as someone who doesn't believe in God spends their whole life doubting a divine creator, living for pleasing themselves and what they can get out of life. What if when you die there is a God ? Then what have you lost? I think I'd rather live by faith and be wrong, than live by doubt and be wrong. So my question is what do you think? And what's the point of your life? 
I don't attack Christians for their belief. I state my belief and if I am told I am wrong or they try to "convert" me then I have problems. Each person has a right to believe how they wish, they just cannot believe it is right for everyone and get away with it. As for the dying if there is a god. I cannot believe that if there is a god of the magnitude told by men in the bible, that he/she/it would discriminate on a person's religion as the judgement of what they have done in their lives. So I have no fear of the god, if he/she/it exists because I know my heart and actions. I don't need a book written by men of old to tell me what is required to be a "good" human. I know instictively what is right and wrong for me. I know that hurting others is wrong, I know being untrue to myself is wrong, I know that the laws of the land are there for a reason, etc... I don't need a book to tell me all of these things. I hold true to myself. I am honest, trustworthy, love worthy, respectful to myself and others, empathetic, understanding, kind and just in my life. I hope that answers the question for you. Just a note: most unbelievers really don't care about the religious until the religious step on their toes by imposing their beliefs on them. |
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Miles wrote "Eye for an eye tooth for a tooth."
The problem with this analogy is that no human is able to be where another human is and see, feel, understand and react with them to see if their motive was evil to begin with. Our justice system has sent innocent people to death. Since this concept comes from a god who can see all, it would be understanding that he would be able to be the executor of this justice but humans cannot see all so they cannot execute this kind of justice, not and be accurate anyway. |
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Edited by
Dragoness
on
Wed 02/11/09 01:25 PM
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We all seem to go from one extreme to the other. I see the other happening now. I try to understand why and i believe I do on most. But that is my opinion and just that. The scriptures in the beginning speaks of the Nepha or breath/spirit of Yahweh being breathed into man. This is totally different than man before this time. He made advances but did not have the knowlege from the Spirit of Yahweh to be over the Animals and thus was hunted by them. Noah's account shows the Animals were not afraid of Humans. Gens accout does not speak of eating animals but grains and herbs of the field. If animals not all but many will become gentle if not hunted by humans. Case in point Deer. I have seen and been to Deer farms where they are gentle and act as a pet. See what happens during Deer season today. They are scared to death and who wouldn't be and then we try to figure out how to protect our precious cars from being run into by a Deer that is running for thier life. Humanity as a whole is still learning but we know that we always will be. Whatever belief you have is ever learning and trying to understand. Why. Always the big question is Why. Starts as a young child . Why why why. But they are learning. Why you are not allowed to run into the street. Why you stay away from the stove when Mom is cooking. We are all children and curiosity is one of the greatests traits of the Human race. But somethings untill a better understanding happens will remain the same. It is just life. Thier is a good question I would pose to the unbeliever. Here is an example. Now I do not agree with hunting wolves from aircraft but I do not believe in Abortion either. Now I very well may be wrong in these boards about my belief that the most part of people who deny the Bible believe that a fetus is a womans right to choose whether it is terminated or not. Why is that? Why do so many say in the same breathe that partial birth abortion or late stage abortion is a womans right to get rid of a livin g thing? Thats what it has become. A thing birth control if a woman decides this. WhY? Why do we speak and spend so much time worried about animals and at the same time can choose to kill a baby who at the time of it's death could very likely live to be a 100 if it was just taken alive by Drs.? Why? Why do we cry that a wolf in Alaska is being tortured and not recongonise a cat scan of a infant when aborted is going through pain? We seem in this area of the unbelief in the Bible mostly used in this Country we can not understand why anyone would object to this procedure. Why? Were you not a fetus or late stage baby at one time? Were not your children? what gives the unbeliever the right to choose in such fashion? The cry about animal cruelty. Is this not a Oxymoron and a slap in the face to our own species intelligence? So Why? What gives you the right to slam a womans right to choose down the Believers throat? You can not say you don't because you do all the time. Read this thread closely. Look at what you are worried about? Look at the Laws the Unbeliever has been able to get passed? A drunk and I do not condone it at all but for example purposes only. A drunk hits a car with a pregnant woman inside and she loses this fetus at any stage. The procecuter will go after at least mansluaghter charges for the unborn child. Notice then it is a child. The same woman can go get rid of this now so called fetus and it is her right. Is not the same thing happening? Is not death not happening in both cases? Please prove this stance the unbeliever has? Then tell me why you worry about animal cruelty and blame believers? Which is more precious? I would like to know why this type of thought process is reasonable? Thanks.. Blessings...Miles I read your post miles and firsts off your WAY off topic. Second everything you have said is a generalization. You say, "we" and yet make it clear you are not speaking about YOU. You bring up every issue that is important to you as if its believer Vs unbeliever which is silly. Go look up Roe V wade and answer your own questions. The very fact that you try to associate this with a believer vs unbeliever either illustrates your vast ignorance of law, or it illuminates a desire to use this issue as propaganda, to use this issue as a tool in your proselytizing bag of tricks. Sad. The fact is it is not off topic. It is following the train of thought about animals being brought up. I believe we fall in the Mammal category. What the problem is, is you do not want to answer the question. Good ole bait and switch technique huh. my purpose is to try to be reasonable. what i am asking is the difference between human life and animal life. Simple question. I see alot about how unreasonable the Bible is. Sometimes we have to look at ourselves and see if we are reasonable instead of pushing off something as "not on topic" if we do not like it. Don't put out if you can not take it. I always liked the sign at our local Pool Hall. If you can not Pay Then Don't play. the bible is so deep thier has never been a book of philosophy to even come close to the true meaning to be found if the reader will only diligently search for it..Shalom...Miles And yet the transparency of the philosophical minds that penned the bible are there for all to see. Deep? The bible? NOT! The bible shows the very imperfect minds of the men who wrote it. All you have to look for is the motive of the write. It is easy. Miles, no offense intended here, it is just how I see it 
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I notice alot of people come under attack for being "Christian". People like to point fingers at our short comings. Lets ponder this.... If I believe in God and my proof is only in my faith, then i spend my life based on the teachings of Jesus and try to be a better man. When i die if there is no God, then I've spent my life seeking peace and happiness through helping other people and then if I'm wrong there's nothing. What have i lost? But if you as someone who doesn't believe in God spends their whole life doubting a divine creator, living for pleasing themselves and what they can get out of life. What if when you die there is a God ? Then what have you lost? I think I'd rather live by faith and be wrong, than live by doubt and be wrong. So my question is what do you think? And what's the point of your life?
I don't attack Christians for their belief. I state my belief and if I am told I am wrong or they try to "convert" me then I have problems. Each person has a right to believe how they wish, they just cannot believe it is right for everyone and get away with it. As for the dying if there is a god. I cannot believe that if there is a god of the magnitude told by men in the bible, that he/she/it would discriminate on a person's religion as the judgement of what they have done in their lives. So I have no fear of the god, if he/she/it exists because I know my heart and actions. I don't need a book written by men of old to tell me what is required to be a "good" human. I know instictively what is right and wrong for me. I know that hurting others is wrong, I know being untrue to myself is wrong, I know that the laws of the land are there for a reason, etc... I don't need a book to tell me all of these things. I hold true to myself. I am honest, trustworthy, love worthy, respectful to myself and others, empathetic, understanding, kind and just in my life. I hope that answers the question for you. Just a note: most unbelievers really don't care about the religious until the religious step on their toes by imposing their beliefs on them. You are not wrong in your convictions. You have seen and acted accordingly. The bible when speaking of the unbeliever is the one who knows better and chooses not to do it. I posted earlier in defence of what the unbeliever believes. I do this because no one can save you. The acts of Yahshua by the unbeliever and the believers believed because they saw his Good Works. He said don't believe me believe the works, the miracles ect. Yahshua's problem was not with the general people. He throughout Blasted those who were trying to control the people the same way Religion try's to control the people today. It is the same thing. Someone may call you a sinner. realise The one who is Called the Son of Yahweh was most comfortable with the ones the Religious Elite called sinners. Thier is no unjustus by Yahweh. He speaks only of Purely Evil people being done away. And a decieving heart from those who are suppose to know better are the most evil of all..Blessings...Miles |
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I notice alot of people come under attack for being "Christian". People like to point fingers at our short comings. Lets ponder this.... If I believe in God and my proof is only in my faith, then i spend my life based on the teachings of Jesus and try to be a better man. When i die if there is no God, then I've spent my life seeking peace and happiness through helping other people and then if I'm wrong there's nothing. What have i lost? But if you as someone who doesn't believe in God spends their whole life doubting a divine creator, living for pleasing themselves and what they can get out of life. What if when you die there is a God ? Then what have you lost? I think I'd rather live by faith and be wrong, than live by doubt and be wrong. So my question is what do you think? And what's the point of your life?
I don't attack Christians for their belief. I state my belief and if I am told I am wrong or they try to "convert" me then I have problems. Each person has a right to believe how they wish, they just cannot believe it is right for everyone and get away with it. As for the dying if there is a god. I cannot believe that if there is a god of the magnitude told by men in the bible, that he/she/it would discriminate on a person's religion as the judgement of what they have done in their lives. So I have no fear of the god, if he/she/it exists because I know my heart and actions. I don't need a book written by men of old to tell me what is required to be a "good" human. I know instictively what is right and wrong for me. I know that hurting others is wrong, I know being untrue to myself is wrong, I know that the laws of the land are there for a reason, etc... I don't need a book to tell me all of these things. I hold true to myself. I am honest, trustworthy, love worthy, respectful to myself and others, empathetic, understanding, kind and just in my life. I hope that answers the question for you. Just a note: most unbelievers really don't care about the religious until the religious step on their toes by imposing their beliefs on them. You are not wrong in your convictions. You have seen and acted accordingly. The bible when speaking of the unbeliever is the one who knows better and chooses not to do it. I posted earlier in defence of what the unbeliever believes. I do this because no one can save you. The acts of Yahshua by the unbeliever and the believers believed because they saw his Good Works. He said don't believe me believe the works, the miracles ect. Yahshua's problem was not with the general people. He throughout Blasted those who were trying to control the people the same way Religion try's to control the people today. It is the same thing. Someone may call you a sinner. realise The one who is Called the Son of Yahweh was most comfortable with the ones the Religious Elite called sinners. Thier is no unjustus by Yahweh. He speaks only of Purely Evil people being done away. And a decieving heart from those who are suppose to know better are the most evil of all..Blessings...Miles Well, I don't feel as a unbeliever that I need saving. I don't need to be saved from the one entity I trust beyond anything or anyones else, myself. I am the reason I am all that I am, I do it for myself. Also, if I was raised religious does that mean that I am "one who should know better"? I actually spiritually outgrew man made religions. My spirit was stifled by man made religions, they shackled me to doctrines I believe to be detrimental to spiritual growth. |
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I notice alot of people come under attack for being "Christian". People like to point fingers at our short comings. Lets ponder this.... If I believe in God and my proof is only in my faith, then i spend my life based on the teachings of Jesus and try to be a better man. When i die if there is no God, then I've spent my life seeking peace and happiness through helping other people and then if I'm wrong there's nothing. What have i lost? But if you as someone who doesn't believe in God spends their whole life doubting a divine creator, living for pleasing themselves and what they can get out of life. What if when you die there is a God ? Then what have you lost? I think I'd rather live by faith and be wrong, than live by doubt and be wrong. So my question is what do you think? And what's the point of your life?
I don't attack Christians for their belief. I state my belief and if I am told I am wrong or they try to "convert" me then I have problems. Each person has a right to believe how they wish, they just cannot believe it is right for everyone and get away with it. As for the dying if there is a god. I cannot believe that if there is a god of the magnitude told by men in the bible, that he/she/it would discriminate on a person's religion as the judgement of what they have done in their lives. So I have no fear of the god, if he/she/it exists because I know my heart and actions. I don't need a book written by men of old to tell me what is required to be a "good" human. I know instictively what is right and wrong for me. I know that hurting others is wrong, I know being untrue to myself is wrong, I know that the laws of the land are there for a reason, etc... I don't need a book to tell me all of these things. I hold true to myself. I am honest, trustworthy, love worthy, respectful to myself and others, empathetic, understanding, kind and just in my life. I hope that answers the question for you. Just a note: most unbelievers really don't care about the religious until the religious step on their toes by imposing their beliefs on them. You are not wrong in your convictions. You have seen and acted accordingly. The bible when speaking of the unbeliever is the one who knows better and chooses not to do it. I posted earlier in defence of what the unbeliever believes. I do this because no one can save you. The acts of Yahshua by the unbeliever and the believers believed because they saw his Good Works. He said don't believe me believe the works, the miracles ect. Yahshua's problem was not with the general people. He throughout Blasted those who were trying to control the people the same way Religion try's to control the people today. It is the same thing. Someone may call you a sinner. realise The one who is Called the Son of Yahweh was most comfortable with the ones the Religious Elite called sinners. Thier is no unjustus by Yahweh. He speaks only of Purely Evil people being done away. And a decieving heart from those who are suppose to know better are the most evil of all..Blessings...Miles Well, I don't feel as a unbeliever that I need saving. I don't need to be saved from the one entity I trust beyond anything or anyones else, myself. I am the reason I am all that I am, I do it for myself. Also, if I was raised religious does that mean that I am "one who should know better"? I actually spiritually outgrew man made religions. My spirit was stifled by man made religions, they shackled me to doctrines I believe to be detrimental to spiritual growth. To know better is the DRs. and so called Scholars who teach what they know not to be true. The shepards so to speak the Bible talks about. Not the majority of people who grew up in the church. You are taught to respect authority. Like hopefully the older people in society passes on knowlege from experience to the next generation. The father who preys on the trust and innocents of his children or anyone elses. All know better but take trust and ruins it. This is evil. In the ch-rch so to speak the pastor who will teach a lie. I know this to be true because in my own search about the Bible i have been to countless pastors and scholars and they will agree with me and will not tell me I am wrong in my understanding. I will ask them why do you not teach it then. All of them have said it is better to save souls than tell them the truth. If i told them what you are saying people would be in disbelief and leave the ch-rch and how would the ch-rch survive. Most believers do not believe this to be so. I have challenged many to go and question alone with them because i have found them to be honest with me if they do not believe this would be believed anyway. So those who are suppose to show what faith is really do not have faith themselves. It is a sad state of affairs. They know what they are doing. They just choose to decieve the people. This is why i do not have any problems with those who can not believe it because most have seen the hypocrasy themselves and do not want anything to do with it. Blessings...Miles |
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To know better is the DRs. and so called Scholars who teach what they know not to be true. The shepards so to speak the Bible talks about.
And by this you are referring to the scientists who research and espouse evolutionary theory? Are you saying they actually believe in god and know what they are teaching is false in some respect? Thats delusional. Sorry. 
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To believe is to not believe as to not believe is to believe
just thought I throw that in to see what happens
okay got my laugh for today pass the mash potatoes please
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Miles...understood.
The hypocrisy is a big problem in the religious community, I will agree. And I too have the problem with the use of guilt and fear to keep a congregation so the church can continue to be solvent or financially well. I will however respect another's right to believe it if they want to. Because it really does come down to each person's want. If it works for them that is okay with me as long as they do not try to convert the world to the same, then I have a problem. What works for me will not always work for others and I know this. If I can share and someone gets something positive from it, great, but I never judge or push. I wish you luck in your pursuit for what works for you. I spent quite a few years in personal spiritual chaos because of my conflicting views. It took for something serious to happen to me in life to get where I am today. I have to say spiritually, I am in a very healthy positive place where I am now. I would hope that for everyone.
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Edited by
Milesoftheusa
on
Wed 02/11/09 02:14 PM
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To know better is the DRs. and so called Scholars who teach what they know not to be true. The shepards so to speak the Bible talks about.
And by this you are referring to the scientists who research and espouse evolutionary theory? Are you saying they actually believe in god and know what they are teaching is false in some respect? Thats delusional. Sorry.
They do not really come into the picture for me at least. I can not know what they know or believe. So i must not be explaining myself well enough and thats my fault. Who I am addressing is the people who people go to to learn about the bible from. I can not know for sure what any scientists thinks or believes. The teachers of the Bible are saying that what they are teaching they are doing to the best of thier ability and if they find out they are wrong they have a great responcibility to say so. To continue to tell the people what you yourself do not believe to be true is the greatest deception of all and all of us i believe will have to answer for that eithir in this life or the one to come. Blessings...Miles What I mean thier by all of us has to answer for is our own responcibility to not be decietful to other and honest. |
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Now i c alot of name calling this Mean arrogant g-d who demands worship and sentence children to death for rebelling against thier parents. Yet a unborn child has it ever rebelled? Who is Arrogant and unreasonable. The old laws were so out of touch. Are they? Are these laws about the treatment of each other out of touch? STOP PREACHING ALREADY, YOU ARE IN THE WRONG FORUM FOR THAT... |
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It really does not matter what anyone believes as long as they live good lives and remain true to themselves! Goodness based on what? Goodness based on an internal moral compass. Goodness based on decent behavior without expectation of rewards or punishment after you are dead. |
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Edited by
Krimsa
on
Wed 02/11/09 03:03 PM
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Now i c alot of name calling this Mean arrogant g-d who demands worship and sentence children to death for rebelling against thier parents. Yet a unborn child has it ever rebelled? Who is Arrogant and unreasonable. The old laws were so out of touch. Are they? Are these laws about the treatment of each other out of touch? What are you saying here? Are you saying the OT laws were okay with you? |
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