The lift the leaf off of them and give them a tour in a way they can appreciate.

If people ask for one piece of evidence give them one piece instead of telling them they are too stupid to see it. Most of the time if you ask yourself "if someone said something like this to me would I want to talk to them calmly after?" you can stop yourself from sticking more leaves on us ants.

Actually you did. The evidence of a designer is design. Everything is design.

From this there are two options for what you meant. The first is circular logic but if we assume that we are assuming you are an idiot. So the more polite option is to assume you are pointing to the "designer" we can watch "create" things.

If it's not the butterfly can you show us how you are not using circular logic?

Saying it does not make it so. Sound like something you heard recently? Like a post ago?

WHY should we think it was designed by this god thing and that it permeates everything?
There is another assumption here that we don't want to make: You are saying that we should think like you do because anything you believe is automatically superior to anything different anyone else might believe. Again, that would say very nasty things about you so we choose a more polite option.

So can you help us to understand instead of just demanding that we do?


So are you saying that asking for evidence that logically leads to a conclusion is too much or that what we call leaps of faith should just be called steps?

Look at it from a different angle. If you can show us how one piece of evidence is evidence shouldn't that open our eyes to many pieces of evidence?

And to us you look like you are in a small room somewhere dreaming about the amazing wings of elephants and lamenting our loss for not recognizing that elephants' beauty is n their wings while we work out their trunks and legs and tail.

Conscience has what to do with this?

Too much text to wade through or have I just alienated everyone?

Come on, I'm going to try to be nice this time~

Nope, haunting a place is BAD and eternal life as a ghost is GOOD. Very different and TOTALLY distinguishable in any way besides those two words.

...hahaha. In heaven you'll experience the same emotion forever! If you haunt some place you'll experience the same emotion forever!

Without evidence what did you use to get so certain about that stance?

...a couple of years ago my cat didn't come home one day. I don't have any evidence that you took him but if you say you don't abduct cats I'm going to make real sure everyone knows that you might. Just sayin.


In all of those cases we see "creators" taking materials and arranging them into something else. They never "create" anything that wasn't already there.

Ooooh.

Because it's silly but on an arbitrary basis the designer thing somehow isn't. It's ok though, nobody will find out because we're not allowed to question faith even if it calls itself logic or science.

Or at least if we do we're ******** for it.

Nevermind that this requires you to take the persona out of God and allow all of his actions to be random and causeless.

So when the energy density of the universe was too high for atoms do we get to say there was no space time?

Well no. You only get to label it God if it's basically a person. If you were convinced that "flatness" created the universe you couldn't call it God because it's missing all the qualities that makes something a god besides the creator one. If I go hit a cell phone with a hammer I didn't "design" the mess- I'm the reason it's there but there's more to designing something than being what put it there.

Same with being God.

Of course not. We don't believe in Allah.


Well actually there's no evidence here for the simple fact that this argument is an example of the begging the question fallacy.

Oh yes, of course. Being open minded means agreeing with me as soon as I say I've finished describing my position and of course I also agree with me as soon as I'm done so there's no window available for you. If you want anything more before you convert unconditionally to my faith you're some kind of militia up in arms against me and definitely crazy (after all, I must be right because how could I be wrong? How dare anyone think differently than me!)


Why not play along? Surely you've got the patience to just keep listing things until we tire out from explaining them away (as that requires more work.)

4 billion years is enough time for the mutations that have lead to us to pop up and enough time for selective forces to push the forms around to us.

*I take a slight amount of offense when people tell me there's no explanation/evidence as studying it is, oh, my career.

If we accept that how does it show that they had a hand in our origin?


Is there supposed to be a train of logic in that?

Then why are we allowed to act like it's been proven to start off with that cause and effect thing being one of it's acts? Circular logic is nobody's friend.

-

3 pages of stuff is probably pushing the limit of how long I should let posts get. I'll come back to this in a few hours I guess.

Sweet, my sister can finally get all her friends together and throw abortion parties even in this economy!

Usually that was the first topic I tried ._.;

I care less about weight and more about that old hourglass shape sought after since antiquity.

I do have some bias towards the lighter side of the scale as there's a certain point where I'm just too much reminded of my aunt.

Biologically they are basically where your skin grew faster than the skin around them. Sort of like a tumor that got back under control.

First off: My first foray into this didn't go so well and I think the "don't make new threads when you change your profile" rule played a part because people didn't seem to be aware when I basically said "ok, that question is over, here's a new one." Since that thread has been locked I'm in the clear making but if I was supposed to understand that locking that thread meant I was kicked out of the rate my profile area, my apologies. I know this thread can be locked just as easily and I won't make a third.


If I could permanently edit posts I'd handle this easily because I could just stick things right at the front.
But hey, the rules are the rules and I'm sure there's good reason for them.


So here I'm welcoming people to say mean things about how I've written my profile. Just to be clear this is not an invitation to say awful things about me, only my writing.

-I already to plan to change the headline and will announce when I have.

So things I really want to hear about:
A lot of people think I look much younger than 23 and it's been suggested that I provide some more mature looking pictures. The problem is that I haven't been able to figure out what makes me look young. Can anyone describe what looks young about my face/photos?



Some people that the messages I send might suck but in accordance with the rules I can't post anything from the private message system. I may find someone hundreds of miles away from me and write a sample pm that I don't actually send to get around that(?)

I think I'm supposed to say something about what kind of girl I'm looking for in my profile.

I think this lacks direction and isn't the right tone for a profile. Do people agree and if so can anyone show me how to frame it in a way that works?

And one question that only needs to be answered by one or two people: do I need to post to tell people about when I take someone's advice and/or change my profile?

And a short list of things (haha) I do not want people to tell me:
Get off of dating sites and find girls in the real world (I'm already trying and I do most of my posting here during my daily train rides when I couldn't effectively be meeting people anyway.)
Think positive (I already do. I just don't see any reason to share most of it here.)
Be patient (I've been patient and I'm 23 and nowhere. I'm changing something now whether people will help me or not.)
We're not going to write your profile for you (I don't want people to. What I want is for people to not just tell me what's wrong but why, and maybe how I can keep myself from repeating the mistake, in a way other than thinking positive because that doesn't seem to translate into my writing. With the type of girl I'm looking for I may not have left enough room for anything else so that one could be tricky- I'll try to be flexible.)
You're relentless (Of course I am.)
Don't be so rude (the caveat here being if you are willing to teach me what makes lists like this rude ((I'm only assuming this is based on what I've seen here but I don't understand what people meant most of the time,)) or otherwise go into detail.)

The purpose of this list is to allow me to be much more upbeat here (if still a bit stiff.) Hopefully I can avoid most of what people thought was rude.

Now, if anyone would like to be nice and avoid stepping on my toes there's really just one thing you need to do before you post. If you quote me and I typed anything ending with a question mark make sure you say something about that or take it out of the quote. It seems incredibly rude to me that people here never answer my questions but I seem to have a mixed up view of what "rude" means- nonetheless I ask that people show a little respect and I will try to do the same. I'll even avoid the "act angry to illustrate when people are being difficult" thing as much as I can.

Well if he went from some alien fish to the alien that would be a lot like what I was after (but without the end being predetermined,) but if it was just from chimp-thing to alien not so much.

I'm mostly only looking for some sketches of the outside shapes of things and maybe once in awhile a cutaway to show some internal stuffs.

During I'll probably be a near endless fountain about how things work from genetics to physiology but I recognize artists are not usually exactly interested in that so people can take it as advice if they want but it won't be mandatory to follow or even listen to all of it :\

I'm actually in my last semester for a Biology degree so I hate how spore did things. There are never trade offs- you just build up to the fastest, strongest, best singingest creature instead of flight forcing you to be light weight, wrestling (with your legs & mouth style) forcing you to get tired quickly while running, etc.
Up in the civ stage at least the vehicles sort made you choose something to be good at -_-;

And none of the creatures in spore could be insects or other invertebrates- they started out with a spine and there was no other option. Likewise eyes were really trivialized and it was just a matter of if you had them or not- they could have made the world somewhat desaturated until you got better eyes or something.

If they had put a few more choice-steps into the middle of phases my educated side could bear it but any sort of evolution had to be self enforced.


Rant aside, there's a reason where I want this to be a collaborative effort. I know too much about how life on Earth did things. It takes a lot of effort to suppress that and so far when I do my creativity plummets as well. If I want life to use the same things it did on Earth I need other people to throw in some curve balls to keep me away from the stuff I know.

Well a couple of years ago I was introduced to how "earthy" all the aliens people imagine up are. The "everyone is shaped like a human with some different sized face parts" Star Trek style is obviously unrealistic (and people argue "maybe it's a just good shape!" but I can go into that...) but even when we've got a budget we still just lift some animal from Earth and exaggerate it's features (or sometimes straight up mix animals from Earth.)

So I'd like to do a light project with some people doing simple sketches of organisms and then modifying them step by step so there is a semblance of evolution and an actual alien world instead of just "Earth where things went different."

I think that this process alone would make things so different that starting with Earth's earliest multicellular life would be fine because it didn't have any of the shapes established. What I mean is that they would have the same types of cells- muscles, nerves, skin.

If this was a big success maybe I could do another with a world not like Earth and start into unicellular life but for now I want to keep it simple without need to go into chemistry or anything.

I've been having some trouble finding some artists to help me out with a project- is this place mostly about other people's art or is there any art done here?

Huh? Since when does making preparations for when you do die or what to do if you've suffered an accident that would leave you in a vegitative state mean having someone else make all those decisions for you?

That's one robot who can't understand directions. Next?

You don't think it's humanly possible to deal with eight pages? How ever could anyone here ever get through a children's book?

Alright, I think I've got it. People think I'm just trying to start arguments because I've been too direct when what I really need to do is be extremely feminine.
I'v e forgotten how to do that and learning isn't something people here are tolerant of so I don't think I'm compatible with these forums.

Take a look at yourselves and ask if this is something to be proud of. Endlessly ignoring requests and instructions and then belittling someone else for it. If I had a better opinion of automated talker programs I'd say the lot of this had made it's mistake in reminding me of the Turing test despite it's already demonstratedly shallow ability to parse text.


So screw you all for your childlike reading levels and screw you for for being impatient. I haven't gained enough from this for it to have been worth being so relentlessly insulted on the same descriptionless bounds for long.

Here's a test: what about my face makes me look young? Describe that in a way that couldn't be applied to anyone; in a way that shows you are able to actually tell what I look like from the pictures I've given. If you can't do that don't say anything, I don't want to hear it.

*if I'm right about what people mean by rude this post will have been ruder as I was so direct as to give an ultimatum. I don't think anyone is going to pass the simple test I just laid out so finally understanding that won't be very useful for me but it would be a personal victory.

What personality have I demonstrated? Tell me what I've done from someone else's perspective and not just "you've been rude."

I'm not all that concerned with screwing someone. Drunken one night stands don't have any appeal to me, crazy huh?


Some of what I'm doing is being intentionally difficulty because people have told me to act like this.
They want me to just do things and not doubt myself. Check.
They want me to stop being so rude. Check
They still want me to stop being rude- no I already did, f_ck them, that doesn't make any sense.

Well no, that would be rude, better figure out what mean. Sucks that that's rude too but oh well, I don't mind frustrating people if I can learn how to stop frustrating them. Unfortunately I haven't made much progress since, I think about when Ruth started posting.

You're going to have to break down what I've said and explain it with analysis for me to understand where the rudeness is.

We're eight pages in and I haven't figured it out myself but maybe it will just happen if you're patient.

I try to lurk forums so I don't do... THIS all over the place. I still feel like I've got no idea how people here think though so I'm holding off branching out.
And I've got some other niche interest forums to occupy myself with so I'm much more social in forums than you would think from looking at this.

I don't see how I could be more social on here to the people in my area though. My state's forum is a dead zone and hundreds of messages sent out have left me without any conversations going on.

Someone actually initiated contact with me a week ago though. She sent several one line questions to me and then let me know I wasn't her type and has indicated through action that she would prefer not to explain why. I might have been too chatty or it might have been the lack of any mention of drunk partying in my description of what I've been doing.

I don't have to question myself. I KNOW that I don't take advice the way people mean it.

I spent half of a year not thinking why they don't respond, half of a year trying to figure out if I could improve things myself in some way, and now however long this thread has gone on seeing if anyone can confirm that I've been doing something wrong or if my judgment has been good.

Whether this thread shows it or not I am mature enough to brush off rejection. Back when I was 16 I couldn't stand to risk a "no" but I've got a much more positive outlook these days.

If people were saying no to me here I wouldn't have started this. They're saying nothing and I don't know if that's "no," "I don't log on anymore," or "It's hard to write to people and I can't think of anything." Or other things, you know.