Brother, you say there is but one way to worship and serve the Great Spirit.

If there is but one religion, why do you white people differ so much about it? Why not all agreed, as you can all read the Book?



~Sogoyewapha, "Red Jacket" - Senaca~

thinking is way overrated, sorry:)

hmmm... perhaps worship of self is more rewarding? Yes, I like this concept....

Umm, not trying to argue, just wondering why you refer to "white people"??

As far as I have ever seen, there is not one race, creed or color that has not differed in the area of "religous beliefs" (if you want to term it that, but you get the idea).

I see you are "Native American" (I think thats the current politically correct term). I happen to be "white..caucasion, cracker..honky..etc" but my honorary name is "Brazen Hawk" and given by your people (Native Americans) so we can all get along.

The quote from Red Jacket is over a hundred years old. Here is link to entire text: http://www.ilhawaii.net/~stony/redjack.html

People are people. They fight among themselves..it has been that way from the beginning of time and will not stop til the end of time.

Humans can be the best on the planet and the worst and everything in between.

And actually, in my personal experiences from my travels, most people around the world are wonderful and have great hearts. Its the governments and "authority figures" that keep people divided.

United we stand..divided we fall. The "wolves" want to keep us "divided", makes for easier prey.

When men want to lead, they will not follow.

Men that want to be first in line and think that they know better tan God will cause others to follow their clever misuse of the Word of God.

The rightly divided Word of God will make foolish men sit down.

Until the follish have their knees broken, they will not yield.

Such is Christianity as a religion, when it is misinterpreted from the way of life that it is.


That old saying. " keep your friends close and your enemies closer" does have an eerie ring to it when foolish and self-serving men dispense the selfish and erroneous interpretation of truthes.

interesting quote. but i suspect that the author knew the answer to this question and was just being provocative.

native americans also had a variety of ways of worshipping and serving the Great Spirit as i understand it - so he must have been aware of these differences and that the differences arise out of the different nature and culture of the people rather than the different nature or cultures of the Spirit.

so, i would interpret this as a tongue-in-cheek comment on the
audacity of the white man to attempt to impose their religious dogmas on the native americans.

and if i close my eyes, i can imagine Sogoyewapha's eyes 56 years old at the time he said this...glistening with laughter



and after reading the full article it is also apparent that he realizes the financial motive behind the false altruism or supposed concern for his spiritual wellbeing

This is what I keep trying to tell people.

Everyone is always talking about how terrible the world is and how bad the morals of men are.

I don't see it.

According to crime statistics only about 1% of the world's population commit violent crimes.

If we add in all crimes (thinks like petty theft ect.), accidents, major disease, and people who are directly involved in wars, then only 10% of the population is included in those figure combined.

This means that 90% of the people on planet earth are just regular Joe’s trying to get along.

Things aren't nearly as bad as people are trying to make them out to be.

Humanity overall is doing pretty darn good!

The idea that humanity is becoming hopelessly corrupt is utter nonsense.

Whether or not he was laughing at the white man when he said it, the value of his statement remains.

He did nothing but speak the truth.

he is asking a rhetorical question to illustrate the absurdity of the white man asking him to give up his religious beliefs and his land. he is attempting to provoke thought and also indicating to his audience that he appreciates their motivation.

and he is not buying it...imo

If you stop and think about this for a moment, this is actually quite profound.

100 years ago, they didn’t have television, or telephones, or even cars and airplanes. At least certainly not in any form that Red Jacket would have been able to take advantage of. No computers, no Internet. Basically the only communication was in-person meetings. Or maybe limited pony-express mail which would have probably also be rare for Red Jacket.

Yet, within this limited local exposure Red Jacket was still able to see a distinct division in the beliefs of the people who claim to be of the same religion.

This speaks volumes to me.

although he did not have broadband - i'd wager by his stature and authority that he had a good working knowledge of dozens of tribal and white man's basic philosophies and religious concepts.

one thing for sure about native americans, they understood cooperation and competition and harmony and jealosy and spirituality.

white man huh, what about the red man, yelowman,black man, and the man that sees no color just the man. as 4 my reply i dont know and i dont care i believe what i want if its wrong then fine its wrong if its right then fine its right butwhy on gods green earth would you care

Sometimes the most simplistic of observations, can have the most profound effect.


On some.

We cannot agree becasue we are "Man".. WE find interpretations as to what we get out of such a bible. Interpretations are defined as DENOMINATIONS. I refuse to believe mans interpretations and would much rather stay on the main topic, the bible =)

I'm amazed that in a quote with such depth pointing simply to the affect that Europeans coming to American, who by the way were all white, and Christian, can lead so many people off on a tangent about racial slurs....

100 years ago.

By a man simply pondering what has affected the habits and spiritual beliefs of his people. Slow down people, this is not a racial issue..."jesus!"

Maybe read the article first....or go skip to another topic with a more heated controversy. This one takes some thought. Love the quote! And I think all forms of religious practice that are enfringed upon by a stronger and louder population will always be affected in a way that the older traditional members feel is negative. New ideas flow in. Take a look at modern day Islam compared (especially women in America) to when it originated.

The main Topic of this forum is "Religion" not the Bible. The main topic of this thread is this quote which shows the irrelevance of denominations. All read the same Book.

Which i was posting as being a christian i do not agree with such denominations, and why i prefer to read only out of the bible, am i missing somthing?