I choose not to believe in religion because I choose not to pretend to know something that I don't. I'm not arrogant enough to pretend that I do. Christians, muslims, jews ect. say that yea, there is a higher power; but they then add a why when and how to an untold plot. Religions put too much faith in to a source that is written by man, which is inherently fallible. Sure, what we know about science proves that there is something "higher"; but we cant give it a name or story. History pretty much proves the existance of Jesus, but it takes human mentality to make a legend of him. He was a prophit of good will and equality. People added the "immortal" and "supernatural" characteristics that people souly believe in today. Look into the history of religion, it was used as a tool; a way to govern, control, and make profit.
Everyone is entitled to their own.

that is very well written and said hun

Come on now, 19 views and one reply. Don't be afraid.

I'm not afraid,

<------------I have my bodyguard with me...


What's to say? Other than Bravo!

It isn't rocket science, but at times people need a complicated, twisted, convoluted, great bloody mess, so they have something to waffle on about.

k, I'll reply...

I agree with Debbie - very well written, and you make your case well.

something you said though seems to contradict what you're trying to say overall...

"...there is something "higher"; but we cant give it a name or story. "

but before that, you say, "...there is a higher power; but they then add a why when and how to an untold plot. "

I think you mean to say Religion fills in the blanks - gives the higher power a name and a story - but religion is a human creation, sometimes laced with ulterior motives - "it was used as a tool; a way to govern, control, and make profit"

I think you're argument here is against religion, not faith. You even say so in the first few words - "Wed 12/12/07 04:54 AM
I choose not to believe in religion because..."

I think maybe you're not getting a lot of response 'cuz I think a lot of people would agree with you - on both sides of the faith argument. I have to agree, "religion" has been used as a human motivation thoughout history.

If you take what the Bible says at all (that is, accept is as something we can derive information from), Christ argued against much of the "religion" of the time - or rather, what Man was doing with the faith.

It was 6am on no sleep when I wrote that. I actually took some time to think it out before I made the post. The last one I did was a little sloppy. I didn't realize the "contradicting" redundancy in that. Thanks by the way.

I’m in complete agreement with what you’ve written with respect to the egotistical religions, (namely the ones you’ve mentioned). Their godhead and church rule are both quite egotistical by their own proclamation (i.e. “I am a jealous God”)

However, I disagree that you’re line of thinking is necessarily valid with respect to the natural pantheistic view of “god” that god is everything.

This natural view of god is not an egotistical view at all. There is no arrogance associated with it. No one is closer to god than anyone else. No one has any more right to speak for god than anyone else. And this god did not write any books other than the universe itself.

You may ask, “Why pretend that the universe is god?”.

Well, it goes much deeper than that. It’s not a “pretense”, it a philosophy that has merit. The ‘god’ in pantheism is not a single separate egotistical ruler. It’s an entirely different concept of “god” altogether.

It’s basically the idea that the true nature of the universe is spiritual. We are this universe perceiving itself. We are this spirit.

Again you may ask, “So what? Big deal? It’s just a whimsical fantasy. Why bother?”

No, it’s not just a whimsical fantasy. The whimsical fantasy is believing that you are an individual. That you are somehow separate form everything else. That you somehow exist “in” a universe that you are somehow not a part of. That’s the whimsical fantasy.

The truth is that your physical body provides you with the illusion that you are separate and distinct from everything else. You logical brain provides you with the illusion that you can think for yourself and that your thoughts are yours alone. But none of that is true.

You are this universe perceiving your condition. There is no boundary where you cease to exist and the universe begins. Any boundary you imagine it a mere fantasy in your mind. A plant is rooted to the earth. It is in symbiotic relationship with the earth. Without the earth it is nothing. Even if you transplant it to a pot you must transplant it with some ‘earth’ or it will surely die.

You carry your ‘roots’ around with you in your tummy. But try not eating anything for a while and see how long you survive.

Is the skin/air a boundary between you and the universe? Try holding your breath and see how long you last. That skin/are interface in your lungs may not agree with you that this is any kind of ‘boundary”. Air is required for your existence just as much as your brain is. In fact your brain would quickly die without air.

The air is as much of your body as any other element. I breath your body.

We are all one. And what we are is ‘god’. But if that sounds too egotistical (because of previous notions of egotistical godheads) think of it this way. God is the universe, and we are all children of god, inseparable from her, and inseparable from each other.

We are all one.

You speak of arrogance. But to consider yourself as a separate egotistical being in your own right is the epitome of arrogance. In this sense, to recognize that you are a child of the universe just like all of us, is to humble yourself before the omniscient spirit of the universe.

So don't give up on the concept of 'god'.

But I'm in complete agreement with your assement of the 'holy book'.

Abracadabra, is your response influenced by quantum physics? I see very similar themes.

At the age of 18, life is questioned as i did. You have alot of inaccurate points regarding religion and i dont think youll find what your looking for on these forms. At your age i would seek out information since i have come to realize that you must rely on no one. "Created" by man statement, Science theories are created by men but you seem to disregard this. The bible was not and no man takes credit for writing such. Read the bible itll tell you who actually wrote such. Id figure i wouldnt tell you all the answers cause some you much look up on your own. Interesting points however.

I wouldn't necessarily say that it has been 'influenced' by quantum physics. But I would definitely say that quantum physics is in completely harmony with this view.

I am a scientist, but I’m also a philosopher. I have many reasons for holding a pantheist view of nature. But I must confess that science always seems to be supporting these pantheistic views and has never conflicted with them in any way.

The pantheistic view of life is quite ancient, certainly predating the birth of Christ and therefore Christianity. Pantheism itself is not a religion, but rather a world view that everything is god and god is everything.

Zen Buddhism hold his view as do other Eastern mystical religions. Many American Tribes also held pantheistic views of the world (i.e. that there is spirit in everything).

I’m not a ‘religious’ person. In fact, I denounce organized religions. Especially the ones that claim to hold a authoritarian truths regarding specific actions and moral judgments.

I do believe in having a good moral system of belief however. And I believe that a pantheistic view of life (i.e. truly recognizing that everything is one) can help instill a good moral value system. In other words, if you truly believe that everything is one. And you truly respect the universe as being our father (or mother if you like). And you truly understand that none of us are separate from our universal parent,….

Well, if you truly believe all of that then to hurt anyone would be to hurt god (your creator, your parent, yourself!).

And this would even include animals, not just humans.

So yes, science does support this view, but it’s not my sole reason for concluding it. I think it’s a healthy view to have. And who can argue that it isn’t true? Who can argue that we aren’t part of something much larger than ourselves (i.e. this universe). Anyone who believes they are separate would have a hard time explaining where they came from wouldn’t they?

In summary, it's better to have a philosophy to base your morals on, than not to have any philosophy at all (i.e. pure atheism where you think of yourself as an individual lost in an alien universe).

Not all atheists feel that way, but once they've accepted that they are indeed a child of the universe then they are pantheists and just don't realize it.

But it's important to realize that we are all children of the universe and therefore to hurt another is to hurt yourself, or atthe very least your own family!

Everyone is just as closely related to you as your very own mother! Because we are all children of the universe.

By the way, what kind of a god would create all of human kind and then have a ‘chosen people’?

Yep, I agree that the biblical stories of an egotistical Godhead make no sense at all.

But don’t become an atheist! Become a pantheist! Not as a religion, but as a spiritual philosophy!

explain....

That needs an explanation?

It’s not my God. I have no need to explain such irrational behavior.

Perhaps you can explain a creator who plays favorites?

i want to know where you came up with such opinion

It's not my opinion. It's a biblical tale.

The Jews are God's chosen people. You're a Christian, you should know that.

I would hope you have some proff backing up this assumption? Maybe a bible verse that tells such a tale?

Exodus.

The whole book. The promised land???

i would ask again for a quote from which you gathered such knowledge

Obviously someone is confused.

Obviously abracadabra can put up a better argument then I can. He seems to be more knowledgeable on the subjects of science and religion. Kalamazoo, open your mind brother!