U.S. President George W. Bush has done as badly by his (Republican) party as he has done by his nation.

Bush (younger) has so badly tarnished the Republican brand, he caused a decorated U.S. military combat veteran (Senator McCain (R-AZ) to in time of War lose to a citizen that has never served in the military.

Four years later, in time of economic malaise a talented $money $man (Governor Romney R-MA) was again beaten by the Democrat.

The GOP is stumbling badly; groping for a refreshed party platform they can actually beat the Democrats with.

But there is none in conspicuous evidence.

So now, the circular firing squad has begun.

Senator Rand Paul (R-KY), a "tea party" favorite, is under attack by his fellow GOP's.

What can be done?
Is there a Republican that has the intellect, the political skill, the charisma to get the GOP ducks in a row?

Or is Bush's smoldering crater so devastated, that it'll take grass-roots realignment to build a winning political platform for 2016 & beyond?

Though it is early, which Republicans do you want to see in the first debate (limited to ten candidates).

Number 1.... The traitor you called a "decorated war hero" is better known as the Hanoi Songbird. A traitor who spilled his guts to the NVA without being tortured. But because "daddy" was a decorated Admiral in the USN he came home to a heroes welcome while the other prisoners of the "Hilton" were sworn to silence.... tho many talked and were silenced in the press. A Manchurian Candidate at best!

Rand Paul will be attacked by both sides because of his dedication to Constitutional rights and peoples individual freedoms.

Most of the Repulsicon candidates are nothing but RINO Demoncraps, corrupt, and won't do anything to upset their self serving apple carts...... like following the Constitution and limiting their power over the people they are supposed to serve.

For anything to change in DC we need a Rand Paul or Mike Lee.

Cruz, Rubio, Bush, and the rest of those self serving idiots are nothing but more of the same and maybe worse!

And Demoncraps don't stand for anything any more, they just hand out entitlements to buy votes because they have no platform other than to stay in power by any means possible. The people are tired of their failed policies!

That was proven in the last election by those who even bothered to vote

"Number 1.... The traitor you called a "decorated war hero" is better known as the Hanoi Songbird. A traitor who spilled his guts to the NVA without being tortured." SS

I don't know where you come by this:
"without being tortured" insight.
But this is the first I've heard of it.

And as I am an honorably discharged United States military Vietnam [1] era veteran, such matters are of more than mere passing curiosity to me.

I eagerly urge you to provide your evidence for this character assassinating certitude you have posted.
But until you do, and until I have vetted it, I'll remain skeptical about it.

a) Please do not take me for a fool.
Your post hoc ergo propter hoc claim here is not supported by that history, as I've studied it.

b) Yes. McCain's pappy was an Admiral.
But according to what I've heard / seen / read of it; because of that high rank, McCain was offered early release from the Hanoi Hilton. And many a man that had been broken might have accepted. It takes a man of great character and stamina to decline such an offer; as I have read McCain did. I believe McCain's reply was: I'll leave when we (all his fellow POW's) can all leave.

One other thing.
Senator McCain can't raise his arms above his own shoulders, reportedly because of the way he was permanently injured when he was tortured.

I don't have much patience for character assassination.
But stating as certitude that a life-long faithful servant of the People is a "traitor" is beyond the pale.
If you can prove it, please do.
If you can't, or pretend you can but don't; please do not assassinate character in these fora.
Thanks.

“Adversity doesn’t test your character, it reveals it.” U.S. President Bush (the elder)

Your proof is welcome.

1) Sad but true.

2) Jindal didn't criticize Paul's dedication to the Constitution.
Instead, Jindal specifically criticized by asserting:


I've noticed, and have said as much, particularly about blokes like Gov. Christy.

Why do you think I opened the topic?

I like Rubio. But he's too young and inexperienced.

I may vote for him someday, but not in 2015 or 2016 (I hope).

*
Excerpted from The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition © 1996 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from INSO Corporation; further reproduction and distribution in accordance with the Copyright Law of the United States. All rights reserved.

[1]
This is a legal distinction. I've never been to Southeast Asia. I've never been in an active U.S. military combat zone.
I'm a Cold Warrior.
Yeah. We won that one.
You're welcome.

PS
Clarification / correction:

No.
The term I used was:

It is you that added the word "hero".

In addition, I've read McCain has a military decoration.
All that's needed is one, to be counted as "decorated".
I'd be surprised if he doesn't have a Purple Heart.
And I consider that a prestigious medal of high honor; but in any case more than enough to be correctly referred to as a:

Not many ACORNs grow into the mighty oak.

Most acorns are eaten by squirrels, and wind up as squirrel ****.


McCain didn't lose because of Bush.
McCain lost, because he's a douche canoe.

It's surely an obvious point, and one difficult to convincingly refute.

But I can't believe the Republican brand isn't being punished.

Well this type of hype the Democrats can put Hillary Clinton in.. Makes me glad that I am more than likely moving to Canada...

I personally think Paul Rand is a good candidate ... I also like Jindal which saddens me that the pot shots are coming in..

I also will stand up and say I proudly voted for Pres Bush.. I also will say I didn't vote for Obama...

I am also not a blind republican I am an american and I vote Democrat, Republican, Independent,actually I will vote for the man on the moon if he is the best candidate in my opinion...

As far as McCain is concerned. I have had zero respect for that man...
I also have a lot of respect for ALL VETS it is my pleasure to work with or for them. My uncle was one of the last POW'S to come home

soul is right, both sides are going to attack Rand because they all just want to see more of the same. Rand is the only one that would actually bring good changes to this country. 90% of the repubs and demos argue and throw hissy fits in front of the camera, but behind closed doors they're the same f'ing people. i support Rand and dont pay any of the Rand trashing articles any attention, as most of these news companies are controlled by the government. they will say whatever they can to discredit Rand, but anyone with their head not is their @$$ can see whats going on here.

First off, McCain lost all by himself. I personally think he would have won, had he not decided to sell out to the Bush machine, and had stuck to his previously established principles. JMO though.

I don't frankly see that Bush's egregious errors can be used as a cover story for Republicans losing any more.

The number one thing I want from the GOP, is for them to give up the now forty-year dedication to pretending to believe and support concerns that they don't care about at all, in order to win primaries. The number two thing I want, is for them to give up the long standing idea that half of all Americans are their enemies. The number three thing, is to actually HAVE some plans and proposals, instead of simply relying on the "I'm not Hillary or Barack" ploy.

This is because I am a complete pragmatist: I want leaders who address the problems of the ENTIRE country, and not just their immediate supporters and contributors.

I like some of what Rand has said, especially his (all too short) stand against blanket reinstatement of the Patriot Act. We need a lot less knee-jerking from all the parties, but I don't have high hopes from any of them at this point.

Mc Cain lost because the economy tanked and remember.... he picked Palin..

Romney lost because he couldn't shake the 'money man' moniker. The bubble economy looked a lot better in 2012 than it did in 2008 or now.

Rand Paul is not a neo con and since it is neo cons like Mc Cain that run the party he is going to be attacked.

The national republican brand will remained tarnished until it is rid of the neo cons like Mc Cain and his lap dog Lindsey Graham.

The sooner the better because this country will not survive another decade if we get another liberal jack a$$ like the one we have had for the last 7 years.

Jindal is an idiot. He's done more to destroy the economy in LA than the previous 10 governors. Now he's strutting around acting like he has a solution for the country. Believe it if you like but I'm here to let you all know it's bullsh*t.

Jindal has destroyed the public health system, he's in the process of destroying higher education. The plan is to bankrupt certain departments, then when they can no longer function, bid them off, privatize them.

How exactly can a state which produces so much oil and gas, has the largest tonnage port on the planet and has the offshore oil terminal which almost all imported oil comes through be do broke, year after year, since jindal has been governor?

IMO - John McCain lost because the GOP didn't want his #1 choice of Joe Lieberman as his VP running mate and they didn't vet his 2nd grab bag out of that black hat names properly! Sarah Palin was a nightmare and went 'MARVERICK' from the get-go! And a bewildered/befuddled ole John McCain was gutted by his own party and the media talking heads of Rush Limbaugh and ilk!
Frankly I felt sorry for the man for what he once was and the shell of a human that was left standing out there on the campaign trail looking and sounding confused! Should/would/could have been so different but the GOP has no one to blame but themselves for that disaster!

As far as the Jindal - he needs to put a 'SOCK IN IT'; he's not going to be considered anyone's VP and at this rate he won't even be asked to speak at the convention!



First primary debate, set for Aug. 6. in Cleveland: by FOX Media (only the top 10 will be invited)
Jeb Bush *still on the fence - Ben Carson
Scott Walker - Chris Christies
Marco Rubio - Rick Perry
Rand Paul - John Kasich
Mike Huckabee - Carly Fiorina
Ted Cruz - Lindsey Graham
Bobby Jindal - Rick Santorum
************************************************
14 candidates **counting Jeb Bush'???'

I'd like to see Rand Paul, Huckabee, Carson, Santorum, Graham, Fiorina, Rubio, Bush, Walker and Jindal for the possible 10. And even though I hear Donald Trump is a 'possible'...I'm not taking him SERIOUSLY!
Are any of you?

Ill agree with you there....the Trumpster is nothing but an attention whore.


A for the OP and repubs attacking repubs.....they ARE politicians lol. What did anyone expect they would do? It aint like Hillary is in the public forefront to target atm.

Lastly, as to Jindal....get yall some of what we've had to put up with here in LA

John McCain - The Hanoi Songbird

He's made every effort while a sitting senator to thwart the release of documents on Vietnam, its POWs, news reel footage, and the 36 videos he made while a POW in collaboration with the enemy stating the US was targeting schools, hospitals and refugee camps.

In all 36 of his propaganda films he claimed the US was guilty of war crimes against humanity.

http://www.pensitoreview.com/2008/02/17/in-1992-pows-accused-mccain-of-collaborating-with-vietnamese/

He is a traitor who should NEVER have been glorified in any way!

Another Bergdahl..... but he didn't seek out the enemy. What he did was worse! He made propaganda videos, spilled his guts to the enemy about troops, their number and locations, and any other info he was privvy to, then did his best, using his office as a sitting senator, to conceal the evidence of his crimes effectively hindering an invetigation by the senate select committee and their investigation into POWs still missing in action.!

He is pond scum! And more low-down than whale shite!

Agreed, as bad as people think pres. obama is, I can assure you that McCain would have been exponentially worse. We'd probably be fighting the Russians and Iranians and chinese

I agree t8. Governor Palin is impressive eye-candy; but a terrible burden on the Republican's '08 ticket.






In computer parlance: "That's not a bug. It's a feature!"

I've wondered whether a decisive (determinative) faction of the electorate thought Obama-nomics had the economy was on the mend, that it would continue to improve in the next 4 years (it has), and didn't want President Romney to claim the credit for it.

You've reminded me:

sn warned:

Thanks sn.
I'd have thought Jindal would have had broader support. I've obviously mis-assessed. Thanks for the insight.

Thanks for the list.
I agree, Trump is a media glutton; not a candidate to be seriously considered.
I wouldn't vote for an evangelical candidate like Huckabee or Santorum. They don't seem to be able to separate the Bible from the Constitution. Though iirc there were doubts about JFK's loyalty; questions about whether, as a Catholic, he'd follow the Constitution instead of the Pope.
It doesn't appear to have been a problem.

Splendid.
Can you prove, or even support with plausible evidence, that it was obtained without coercion?
And why would the commies have gotten all they wanted from him, AND THEN tortured him?

Your claim sir, in all candor, is not plausible.
The Ockham's Razor explanation does not impeach McCain's character.

More vitriolic lies/utter school yard bully rumor with nothing for a base but yet again more A$$-SWIPE journalistic BS that has been debunked each and every time it's drug out for 'PROOF' by more gullible - A$$-SWIPE !

Amazing and yet not so shocking when a lie is much easier to push then standing up for the TRUTH!



I won't post the entire repetitive article {you wouldn't be able to comprehend it}...your reading ability has been proven a huge FAILURE in the other topic regarding the Shiite vs Sunni articles I've previously posted into that thread!

You seem bent on nothing more then just destroying a man who served this/his country and did what all prisoners did while being tortured: they made up BS stories and lies to confuse and befuddle their captors because any information garnered them {POW'S} some time...and you - YOU smear his good name like you have FACTS & DATA ON YOUR SIDE! ROTFLMAO soooooo not true and soooo unfounded.
Oh, please continue to drag these slanderous links and libelous lies everywhere you trash his good name; it makes your every word look suspect and unreliable!

Something reeks here and it's not Sen. McCains WAR RECORD! Grow up and move along...there's gotta be another unfortunate human just waiting to be trashed by the likes of you and your ILK. Somewhere out there!

By my "ilk" I assume you mean Vietnam vets?

Sorry, can't support the likes of the McShames and Bergdahls......not Fonda Hanoi Jane either

Believe what you like, but I and many of the Nam vets I associate with on a weekly if not daily basis, will tend to disagree with you.

2A,
I sincerely appreciate your contribution, but not the coarse expression.

Vulgar vocabulary is an inadequate substitute for forceful persuasion.

Please consider a more elevated style of insult:

* These attributes are often reprised, but probably not historically accurate.