wow....emasculating? I think maybe you listen to too much talk radio,my friend. Of course now, re-reading some of what I wrote, while trying to leave room for discussion.. I can see I could have worded a few things differently here and there but, I tried hard to word my post in such a way that it was clear I, in no way, was intending to put men down...or down play their importance in our lives. I even followed-up with a post stating that my inention was the exact opposite. Did you even bother to read thru the whole thread, or at least skim it to see what the comments were like. Up until your comment it had not in any way degraded to this level. It appears you thought that was the direction it was inevitably heading so therefore let's just take it there...I think you were wrong. I could very well be wrong Idianadave but I think you might be a prime example of the generation/sector of men who have felt a bit at a loss...can't quite figure out a way to navigate these waters, but instead of admitting that, trying new things..asking what's my role here?...you respond with bitterness. That's my take on on it anyway...I could be wrong of course.

wow....emasculating? I think maybe you listen to too much talk radio,my friend. Of course now, re-reading some of what I wrote, while trying to leave room for discussion.. I can see I could have worded a few things differently here and there but, I tried hard to word my post in such a way that it was clear I, in no way, was intending to put men down...or down play their importance in our lives. I even followed-up with a post stating that my inention was the exact opposite. Did you even bother to read thru the whole thread, or at least skim it to see what the comments were like. Up until your comment it had not in any way degraded to this level. It appears you thought that was the direction it was inevitably heading so therefore let's just take it there...I think you were wrong. I could very well be wrong Idianadave but I think you might be a prime example of the generation/sector of men who have felt a bit at a loss...can't quite figure out a way to navigate these waters, but instead of admitting that, trying new things..asking what's my role here?...you respond with bitterness. That's my take on on it anyway...I could be wrong of course.

It has always been a theory of mine, based on observation, that while women have grown in leaps and bounds over the last 50 years or so; grown, evolved out of the constraints of traditional women's roles, men have had a more difficult time adjusting.

Makes sense to me to conclude that the more 'bread winner' type roles woman have been taking on were an easier, more natural feeling advancement, then say the more 'domestic' roles men have then had to take on in order for the family unit to thrive fully...in order for there to be the all important balance.

I have also observed that with the younger generation that balance may be returning. Not because women have gone back to those roles...as really we never left them but because men are finding these roles to be as natural and empowering as a heavy duty power tool.

Do you agree? As a whole, are/were the traditional masculine roles easier for women to advance into then it has been for men to evolve into the traditionally feminine roles? Do you notice the difference in the younger generation?

the traditional roles of females do not pay as well - therein lies the resistance

also the reason for women to stay single often - it would be a tough negotiation to get me to go BACK to a time of picking up Etc after a grown man....or assuming the domestic duties when he is equally living in the same dwelling place...make ur own sammiches dang it all!

I would seriously prefer to live alone than have to ever ask a man to clean up after himslef EVER again, and I mean that

[DISCLAIMER] Again, not wanting to get into man bashing..cause that is not what I am about, it's important to me to let go of the bitterness...however...I hear ya sister!

I wouldn't worry about what Idianadave wrote as this seems to be the same rant I have seen him do on a few threads. Nothing anyone said here was putting men down; it was just a nice dicsussion until he came here ranting. So, I wouldn't pay much attention to what he says and personally; I thought this was a a great thread and haven't seen anything nasty written here except for what Dave wrote. Its all good.

Damn, I just finished saying there was no man bashing in this thread. Well, thanks girls for making me look like a fool.

Men had to adapt and women had to adjust I think. I think adapting and adjusting can seem alike.

I dont think it was easier for women to evolve, no.

I think that society was all too eager to embrace women doing it 'all', both at home and outside the home, but being a superwoman has not been easy.

Likewise, I think society even embraces men who do it 'all', both at home and outside the home, but being a superman is not easy either, I imagine.

When we speak strictly of 'trading' positions....I think that taking care of the home is often a harder and more thankless job than working outside the home, so its probably easier for a woman to trade the domestic job with the 'paid' job.

On the contrary, its probably hard for a man to transition from a job where his work is aknowledged and 'appreciated' with monetary reward, to the much less lucrative, thankful and often more tiring job as a 'domestic'

No problem Kelp. I retain my manly pride in the knowledge that I can pee my name in the snow.