I disagree. I think they go to church to find friends and promote their business.

They do fear death though, even if they believe they are saved.

Im with you on this, you are clearly educated and thoughtful.

The origional question is twisted to make something seem a certain way. The author claims religion is based on fear so many readers after that statement take it to be true. I would say religion is based on belief. Terrorism is based on rebellion.

Good thought provoking post though.

Those things can't be taught, only learned by life experience.

Not only that, you do NOT need religion to tell you these things. You can practice them just as much outside of them as you can in them. These things are part of us innately in our consciousness if we follow it.

I also think they go to church because they believe and are taught that is where God is, so thus to be with God they have to go there.

Agreed on fear too, it is a large part of organized religion, whether it's acknowledged or not, whether you even feel it or not, it is there. Because the bottom line is you are generally told that if you DON'T do this, you will be killed by God. If that's not spreading fear I don't know what is.

Bingo Jeannie. What religion does is really very smart. They tell you that if you do exactly as you are told you will have favor by God and be saved, thereby giving those who believe them a comfort in knowing where they'll be after death. Then they tell you if you don't believe them and obey them as they teach, you will die. Thus this keeps you in bondage to them, because according to the religion there is no other option if you want to live.

It's the perfect control scheme, promise them eternal life if you obey, and take it away from them if you don't.

Our current major religions are terroristic in nature. Since terrorism is a warring tactic of bringing fear, yea.

You may disagree but what do you know about what motivates other
people to go to church? Diddley Squat.

Greed and fear certainly motivate people but they do not motivate
anyone who is thoughtful and intelligent to go to church. So why
do they go? To learn about ethics, philosophy, the origin of life,
to study, to inspire themselves through prayer to a higher calling.
Not to get more wealthy or influential. That's ridiculous.

Nonsense. If it is something which you can learn then it is
something you can be taught. Look at the example of charitable
and kind and loving people. Discuss with them worthy causes.
Discuss the question on what are the best ways to live your
life. At church. Go to church!

I know as much or more than you do about it. You claimed this:

"People do go to church to become better people. To be inspired and to be encouraged. These people fear nothing and do not need to be afraid. "

So, why do you think you know and I don't?



No its not ridiculous. If you move to a small town and you intend to open a business, you are not going to do well at all if you do not pick a community church and get to know people and be accepted. Especially in a small town like the one I live in. If they don't know you and like you, they will boycott your business.

People need people. They go to church to meet other people, to make friends, and for business purposes. Some even go to find a mate.

They don't go to learn the "origin of life." Thats funny.

But everyone has their opinions.

So, why do you think you know and I don't?



I know because I worship on a regular basis. I discuss these types
of things with others. I have found great beauty and a deeper
knowledge and appreciation through my attendance and participation.
You obviously have not had any of these experiences if you think
people go to church for venal and avaricious motivations.



That's how I know!






Well some opinions are informed and others are just hypothetical
twaddle. My opinion is informed.

I don't dispute that people need people and find comfort in each
others company. Certainly one of the benefits of attending a place
of worship is the sense of fellowship and community. But people do
not go to church just so someone won't "boycott their business".
There are many other ways to meet people outside of church and if
they are nice people and offer a fair product at a reasonable price
and treat their customers with respect and courtesy they will do
very well regardless of whether they share the same religion as
their customers in general.

If they go to church solely to meet people for business then they
are likely to come off as insincere and as a poser - a fake. It
does not make a good impression as a person or as a business owner.



When people go to church they do discuss how the world was formed
and what was the origin of the divine spark within us all. What is
the nature of good and evil and how to become better people.

If someone did go to church just to do business then they would
likely find that they turned many of their intended customers off!



Can you imagine while the priest, preacher, leader or other officiant
is discussing a parable or community effort to assist the elderly
and some nincompoop is going around handing out business cards and
talking over the sermon, not contributing to the charity plate, and
whispering to everyone - "hey if you need your car painted, we can
match any price you get from earl scheib because we employ illegal
immigrants and don't use those masks and other safety crap."

you may have something there. my daughter is a member of a non denominational church where the pastor and a good many of the people there are convicted felons, former gang members, drug addicts, etc. i suppose whatever gets people away from crime can't be a bad thing but it doesn't say much for inherant strenght of caracter in my view. a recent church function was a fundraisinf for a member family whose husband/father had ust been sentenced to prison for statutory rape of his daughter's best friend. this man too had a criminal past. whether or not he's a better man than he was before joining the congregation several years ago i couldn't say but that matters less than the fact that for the time being anyway a sex offender is off the streets.

I know because I worship on a regular basis. I discuss these types
of things with others. I have found great beauty and a deeper
knowledge and appreciation through my attendance and participation.
You obviously have not had any of these experiences if you think
people go to church for venal and avaricious motivations.



That's how I know!







Only an idiot would hand out business cards at church. You have a huge misunderstanding of what I am talking about an you have a wild imagination. That is not what I am talking about. People go to church for community and to meet other people. (They know God is not in church. There are only other people in church.)

I am 62 years old and my opinion is from my personal experience and it is just as valid as yours. Why do you think that your opinion is any better than anyone else? Because you go to church? BAH! If you look at any successful business person in any small town, 9 time out of 10 they are members of a large church in that town, and they also get involved in other community groups.

No, they don't do business at church, but they make friends. Friends that do eventually become customers. There are many people who will refuse to do business with someone they don't trust or don't like. That's just the way it is. Whether they are religious believers or not, you will find them there in church. If you live in a very small town, like I do, these things are a lot easier to spot. In larger cities, it is not so noticeable.



"Well some opinions are informed and others are just hypothetical twaddle. My opinion is informed."



Your opinion is just your opinion.

Chalking it up to fear is too simplistic and deceiving, really


For instance, I could say, people ONLy go to college to get better jobs,, they are afraid of not being successful so college is a FEAR BASED institution,,but that would be dishonest to say

College also can give people VALUABLE resources for later in life, it can give them valuable experience socially and intellectually,

IT can provide them with knowledge and skills they can use to ENRICH their lives,,,

,,,so it would be unfair and dishonest to say that at the core of attending college is FEAR (FEAR OF FAILURE)



likewise, equating religious interest with fear, is like equating fatness with calories

people do need calories to survive, but they can misuse and misunderstand their caloric intake in such a way that they become FAT

similarly, people LEARN valuable lessons and gain valuable insights, and have the potential to build incredible relationships with EACH experience (good or bad) they partake,,

Religious people have access to all the benefits of people who choose any other study , or hobby, or lifestyle and they have others of like mind to congregate with and discuss these things,, just like people who choose any other study, or hobby, or lifestyle


so, no , it fear is not at the root of religion

although, fear CAN be a tool that people use (religious or non)

I always try to simplify things in order to get down to the cause.

I am not saying that all people go to church because of fear. I'm saying that the bottom line to any sermon always seems to push the fear of death out there for the reason to be "saved" according to whatever ritual they believe in.

They want you to be saved. From what? Death? How? Everyone is going to die.

From Hell? Well, if you believe in life after death there must be a heaven and a hell right?

They will ask you, "Do you want to go to hell?" Or, "Are you afraid of dying or afraid of the end of the world?"

What are we to be saved from? The horrible world? Ourselves? Death? Hell?

If there were no fear involved in Religion it would simply not survive and they would have nothing to preach about being saved from.

If we did not ever die, and if there was no threat of death or hell, what would be the motivating factor for most sermons at churches?

Fear is a tool for governments and churches and even parents who threaten their children to make them obey.

If a person is simply not afraid, these people and these organizations would have absolutely no power over them.

There is simply NO WAY you can get around this fact.

So if you want to be free, you must first be free from fear.

If you are free from fear, no one else can have any power over you.

Don't worry, be happy.

one persons fear is another persons logical caution

without fear of pain, we might walk through fire and destroy our cells

without fear of pain, we might walk in front of cars and die


fear, in and of itself , is a necessary tool for survival, when described so vaguely (as a desire not to suffer some consequence)


I do submit, this description of FEAR, is not something ANYONE lives without

indeed, even those who seem FEARFUL of submitting to FEAR.....lol

You seriously think Christ was a war-monger? The war-mongering Christians have distorted the meaning of what he said, yes. As Gandhi said, "I like your Christ, but I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are nothing like your Christ."

I don't "fear fire." I simply have some knowledge of its destructive powers. That is not the kind of fear I am talking about.

It is the imagined fear that preys on the mind in the form of worry, threats and terrorism that I am referring to, not common sense. It is worrying about things you can't do anything about.

Taking logical caution is not fear, it is knowledge.

I am not saying that you can live a fearless life. That would be foolish and you may die prematurely doing something dangerous or stupid.

I am saying that if someone is using your imagined fear to control you on a regular basis, or terrorizing you with fearful ideas, you need to realize that.

When someone asks me if I have been "saved," I might ask them, saved from what?

Then they will proceed to inject their fearful ideas about death and hell.

The government gets people to vote away their rights to freedom and privacy for fear of some "terrorist" that might come into the country and commit some act of violence on innocents.

I don't "fear fire." I simply have some knowledge of its destructive powers


touche

I dont 'fear hell' or 'fear death' , I simply have knowledge of its destructive powers

its a thin line between having no interest in experiencing something and FEARING It

I have no interest in experiencing ETERNAL Death, whether it be by hell or in a grave


I think MANY people deemed 'religious' would say the same thing


as to being controlled and not being able to change things

those are also qualities I could easily apply to many things in our life, but still would not conclude that it is merely a reaction to 'fear' as if there is no logic or reason to it,,,