???? Me stating that it is their decision is a judgement? hmmm and I thought it was just pointing out the obvious :/ i thought a judgement would be more along the lines as telling them they are going to burn in hell for not believing in the father... man how wrong I was and how stupid I feel now.

Sure you can take that meaning out of this parable as well. In fact, as a purely fiction parable that works fine.

However, as a realistic story it makes no sense, there was simply no reason for the pharisees to confess that Jesus is the only way to God. Why would they do that? Just because he claimed it to be true?

Any nut-case can do that.

You can't expect priests to go around confessing that every Tom, Dick and Harry is lord just because a person makes the claim that they are the only way to God.

That would be Pharisees who are extremely easily swayed in their beliefs.

Would you sway in your beliefs so easily?

I seriously doubt it.

So why would you expect the Pharisees to sway in their beliefs at the drop of a hat?

I wonder if you truly do get it?

Because I can assure you that no one ever believed that you have the capability to actually pass eternal judgment on souls.

Weather it was expected or not is a different story, bottom line is they didn't. There are no excuses my friend. We either do as the Lord tells us or we will face the consequence of such actions, bottom line. Neither our father nor Jesus needs a reason or rhyme, it is what it is.

Everyone has the capability of passing judgement on someone, regardless of if it holds power or not we still have the capability. Again weather it holds power or not we are not to pass judgement. We are not to treat say a murderer any different then we would treat a preacher. We are not to judge anyone and love everyone unconditionally.

Sure there is. Non-belief is a perfectly legitimate excuse.

Even if the fables were true, non-belief would still be an perfectly valid excuse. No sane God could blame anyone for not believing that Jesus was his son.

The God you preach of would necessarily need to be an insane God.

That's the bottom line.

Non-belief is a perfectly valid excuse.

Strawman again. Since you admit that it only "appears" as such, state your beliefs as an opinion and not as a fact please.





Strawman and deflection...





Is that a confession? "It may not say it outright"? "seems to be implying"? Maybe you think it's implying what you say, but don't speak for me or any Christian unless you can prove it, otherwise this is just another strawman fallacy.





LOL, it's in the quote. They were to "confess" that they believed on him. Seriously, it's that simple if you can read English.

Question: "What does the Bible mean that we are not to judge others?"

Answer: This is an issue that has confused many people. On one hand, we are commanded by the Lord Jesus, “Do not judge, or you too will be judged” (Matthew 7:1). On the other hand, the Bible also exhorts us to beware of evildoers and false prophets and to avoid those who practice all kinds of evil. How are we to discern who these people are if we do not make some kind of judgment about them?

Christians are often accused of "judging" whenever they speak out against a sinful activity. However, that is not the meaning of the Scripture verses that state, "Do not judge." There is a righteous kind of judgment we are supposed to exercise—with careful discernment (John 7:24). When Jesus told us not to judge (Matthew 7:1), He was telling us not to judge hypocritically. Matthew 7:2-5 declares, "For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye." What Jesus was condemning here was hypocritical, self-righteous judgments of others.

In Matthew 7:2-5, Jesus warns against judging someone else for his sin when you yourself are sinning even worse. That is the kind of judging Jesus commanded us not to do. If a believer sees another believer sinning, it is his Christian duty to lovingly and respectfully confront the person with his sin (Matthew 18:15-17). This is not judging, but rather pointing out the truth in hope—and with the ultimate goal—of bringing repentance in the other person (James 5:20) and restoration to the fellowship. We are to speak the truth in love (Ephesians 4:15). We are to proclaim what God's Word says about sin. 2 Timothy 4:2 instructs us, "Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage — with great patience and careful instruction." We are to "judge" sin, but always with the goal of presenting the solution for sin and its consequences—the Lord Jesus Christ (John 14:6).



© Copyright 2002-2010 Got Questions Ministries.

Well, join the club Peter. That's all anyone can do.

You can either be honest like me and confess that everything you post is your opinion. Or you can kid yourself and pretend that what you post represents something other than that.

Typically I do use, "IMHO", quite frequently.

When I leave it off, you jump on my views and start screaming for proof, or making accusations that there will be no proof forth-coming.

Get over it.

Yes, I post my opinions, just like everyone else.

I guess you are correct, that would be the "Christian" point of view, because they view God to be a judgmental God. Especially within the context of a supposed "New Covenant" where it used to be that men judged each other and now that has changed.

I can't help but view Jesus as a Buddhist now. And so when he speaks of not judging others I take that to mean in the same way as laid out in the 12 laws of Karma.

Christianity is fundamentally a judgmental religion.

Let's face, it. The whole thing is based on a judgment that all men are sinners and in dire need of repentance.

That's it's foundational principle right from the "Fall from Grace" of Adam and Eve. It's a religion that has already judge all men to be guilty of sin.

That's a shame that it based on such negativity.

That's all I can say.

Next time you get a speeding ticket use that exact mindset. Tell the judge that you do not deserve the fine for you do not believe the speed limit was lower then what you were going. And when they tell you that there was a speed limit sign just 10 feet from where you received the ticket you can then use your "that's hearsay, you can not prove for fact that it was just 10 feet away.

Get serious Cowboy.

There is absolutely no sane reason in the world for anyone to believe that the Bible represents the word of God.

No comparison at all with your analogy.

Christianity necessarily has to be the work of devious men. It can't be the work of any God. Period. It demands that we must believe in something that cannot be shown to be true.

It's religious bigotry in its highest form. And we know precisely WHY men would do this.

But for a God to do such a thing would be extremely unrighteous. Especially for a God to send his New Covenant to mankind via nothing more than hearsay rumors and then DEMAND that it must be believed.

That's a dead give-away right there that this religion is the work of men, and cannot be the work of any supreme being.

Yet Wiccans worship trees and bugs and say we are crazy!

Don't worship a living person worship a piece of wood!

1. Wiccans don't worship trees and bugs.

2. Wiccans don't say that you're crazy.

But they probably do notice it.

No it's not a give away. You've not given me one inkling of a way God could have done it other then by word of mouth. How in the world else would God have given us the laws and made sure they were passed down if not by having someone inform us of them? And not having God tell us of the laws each time a generation comes into the world, for with your way of thinking if God was to have specifically came down and told us directly our kids could then use your way of thinking and claim it's just hearsay rumours.

What you say is true. No matter how a God who constantly plays hide-and-seek gets his 'laws' to his creation it would necessarily end up being hearsay rumors.

This is why it makes no sense to think that a God who plays hide-and-seek would even bother to try such a foolish thing. Especially if he was planning on condemning those who don't believe the laws came from him.

This is why the whole Abrahamic Zeus-like picture of a jealous egotistical Godhead must necessarily be false.

Once you've compared it with Eastern Mysticism you can see that Eastern Mysticism is the only truly wise picture of God.

So you're right. The Abrahamic picture of God makes no sense. No matter what that God does it can only end up being hearsay rumors.

So Eastern Mysticism has far more credibility from the very simple observation that it clearly represents true wisdom.

If you believe that God is wise, become an Eastern Mystic.

If you believe that God is unwise, become a Christian.

The choice is yours.

Why do you claim God plays hide and seek when you know that's an outright lie? God plays no hide and seek, I know exactly where to find him if I wish to speak to the father. If I need something I know exactly where to go to ask, if I wish to praise him I know exactly where to go.

Yes God can not be seen directly by the naked eye. But that is not because he is hiding and or playing hide-and-seek. Did you forget it was humans that turned away from God? It was humans that decided to leave him? God isn't hiding. He really isn't hard to find either.

Well said, CowboyGH

You mean that's what the Hebrew mythology claims.

I know that I have never turned away from God, thus I know that the very premise of the Hebrew mythology is a lie.

It's as simple as that.

If you have turned away from God then I can see where this religion may appear to make some sense to you.

Since I have never turned away from God it makes no sense to me.

No, YOU may never have turned away from God. But WE as the human race turned away from God. Must we forget there was generations of people that were before you which have made it the way it is today through their actions?