^^like me. im a knowledge scavenger. ill take the tidbits here and there of your dedicated work. ive got my own priorities dude.

for instance im about to go grocery shopping and to the anoka bookstore if im lucky but probably not in that order. and im feeling pretty lucky today, especially with your plastic in my wallet

back to the subject...granted im a woman and there are only a few times im even allowed to enter the lodge, so i cant really tell you a lot about how the two interconnect , but i do know alchemy is more than just turning non precious metals into gold, though that is popular thinking. and i can also say that as i stated before the two are interlinked since a popular belief of alchemy is the transformation of the consciousness to a christ-like, or golden state. whats really interesting to research along those lines are the egyptian practices with colliodal gold in order to enhance the functioning of the mind. i believe in some yogic practices it is the state of turiya - the fourth level of human consciousness ( not the waking, the dreaming, or the deep dreamless sleep you exp in r.e.m.; but rather the consciousness which witnesses and transcends all of those).

From research I did many years ago as I tried to trace some family backgroud.

The link between Freemasons, the Knights Templar, and illuminati, and thus to alchemy is generally thought to stem from the occultism which was thriving in Germany in the late 1800's.


Freemasons have always been a private group or 'lodge' - the membership is actually called the lodge as opposed to the building they meet in. It was the nature of their privacy that opened the door for cults in Germany to adopt their name and then 'let out' their 'secrets'.

Of course the cults were not letting out secrets, they were letting out rumors of mysticism and alchemy and ancient heroics and so on.
It also helped their cause to make public the names of some well-known characters, who really were Freemasons. It's unfortunate that those names are now connected with the stories of Knights Templar and illuminatia and such.

The following is from research I did for history class.

The society of Freemasons is not, in reality linked to any of those things. Although a guild of Free Masons existed in Egypt, they were not related to the Freemasons that stretch back to the 1600's. The Egyptian masons really were Stone Masons and they were elites, very well paid and sought out.

They formed their guild to assure their continued success and their status and that of their Sons. It was a society of secrets becasue in keeping their secrets and sharing them only with each other, they and their sons had a secure future.

Since there is little known about how the Freemasons(from about 1600's)came into being, and also because they use several similar symbols as the Eqyptian masons, it has been conjectured that some link exists between them.

Not having kept up on the latest historical research (several new books in the last few years)I cannot say if any links have been discovered or how conclusive they might be.

The following is what I've learned from family.

My Great-grandparends came to America from Germany in the early 1900's with thier children (and more were born here). Both men were German Freemasons, and joined other lodges when they came here. My Grandfathers were also Freemasons and my Grandmothers belonged to the one of the female versions - The Eastern Star.

All of them, Great-grands & grands were Lutheran as well. There was no conflict at that time between their faith and Freemasons because the only (religious) mandate of Freemasons was a 'Declaration of belief in a Deity' no further explanation or discussion just the belief.

According to what my Grandfather told me (I was quite young), the lodge was a social group which supported individual growth through philosophy, arts and charity. Of course they had their secret order of progression, supposedly it was secret because it was only through personal growth that an individual could really come to understand the next order (level). That knowledge could not be given it had to be experienced.

The women were all about social and charitable work. Neither group ever discussed religion or politics - other than how events might effct the lodge or its work (which was growth and charitable work).

That's it, about all I know - well other than what I've read, which all seems to connect pretty well with what family members have told me.

Enjoy your research.

thanks for sharing your information i greatly appreciate it.

what part of the country did your grandparents move to? my family also came over slightly before yours (though more came later- around the same time as yours) and established themselves in the Texas hill country. i too ran across interesting material when researching my family histories.

@unloved:
as far as my understanding of masons secrets go...its not really smoke and mirror secrets, but as stated above , a charitable fraternity whose rites have heavy symbolism and are very private. as far as i know the only true secrets are their handshakes and passwords so that a legitimate mason can always identify another legitimate mason and what masonic path hes travelling on for instance if he belongs to the york rite or scottish rite and what degree of mason he is.. im sure there are a few more than that but really thats the crux of it secretwise. however, members are discouraged from sharing masonic secrets with anyone outside of the lodge. masonic symbols are everywhere in our everyday life so really if you do the research yourself(which i find fairly overwhelming sometimes), or become a knowledge scavenger like myself (lol), you can find many of your answers there. of course, too, you can always apply to join a lodge and find out first hand.
of course since i myself am not a mason i may be wrong.

here are some orders i have researched that i have found to have masonic ties or are masons themselves:
the stone masons of above. in fact many places of worship and courthosues worldwide have these same masonic symbols on them as many of the guild of stone masons were hired to build them. these same symbols occur frequently in freemasonry as well.

the golden order of the dawn (or the golden dawn - same people who have a great interest in the tarot)

knights templar (who also have a tarot set that is both rare and very expensive but with some powerful symbolism within it)

the rosicrucians (i tend to misspell that a lot - this is a separate branch and not a branch of the free masons but rather a group who supposedly believes in a form of mystical christianity and though this is highly arguable i tend see a lot of catholicism background in them - i think they do insist on a belief in god by their definition of god)

then theres:
scottish rite
york rite
shriners
(which are all part of the mason family)
eastern stars are the womens fraternity so to speak
daughters of job/jobs daughters and rainbow girls is the branch for young girls and ladies
the order of the arrow in boyscouts is masonic
DeMolay are young boys (up to 18 i think) - which is masonic and also does a lot of support work with the boy scouts.


i think the free masons have some roots that date back to the essenes and know a few masons who support that theory.

in a select few lodges in europe women may be elected into the lodges (though it is not very common) however stateside the lodges are solely male, separating the females into the above organizations.

i probably repeated a lot fo stuff here but what can you do

i think the egyptian background of masonry (and also the egyptian background of alchemy) is really cool and i love to dally around with that kind of information if you ever want to chat

My father was a Master Mason. My involvement is less.

The history is basically split into two eras; prior to Jacques DeMolay was the Knights Templar era and afterwards was the Masons. Philip, the king of France thought the group had too much money and too much power and tried to exterminate them with the assistance of the Pope Clement on Friday the thirteenth, 1307 AD. Many were killed. The few who survived went into exile and formed a secret society. I am a member of the Order of DeMolay.

[http://www.jacquesdemolay.org/url]

Good contribution and great information for furthing research.
To answer your question - Chicago is were were my Great Grandparents settled but several of their children spent much of their adult life in Indiana. Because of the wars and ensuing depressions, work could be difficult to find and Indiana offered more possibilities.

For the most part, they returned to Chicago and remained until the middle to end of the 1950's, at which point they spread out to the South suburbs and my generation and those after me are all over the U.S.

^ very cool.

enjoyable read

You are an enjoyable person.

as i recall are you how ya been? i didnt recognize you without the old prof pic!

My little lab dude with metal wings? He is still hanging around in my profile. I don't remember why I switched, probably just for fun.

A guy needs to have a little fun on Mingle!

Lions' Club.

cheers to that my friend!

also an inspiring forward thinker

okay i remembered a new bit of information should anyone now or in the future be interested.
once a free mason you have the choice to persue dgrees through the york or scottish rites. the york rite is the shorter of the two and the levels of degrees break down into three categories (correct me if im wrong):the royal arch, the cryptic degrees, and the knights templar sequentially.
the scottish right has 32 -starting with the "ineffable" degrees of the lodge of perfection in masonry- taking longer to complete. i believe the rose of croix and the council of kadosh falls under the 32 degrees as well and i think i recall the last few degrees being called degrees of honour.
there is also a new worshipful master of the lodge every year in some lodges...this may be different in other lodges. the position in the lodges im "familiar with" is an elected position. also it takes a few years to become a worshipful master...having to be elected by brethren to become a steward, senior steward, tiler, junior warden, senior warden and junior/senior deacons etc etc etc first and having progressed through the different "offices". most lodges are always expanding as well and coming up with new plans for the lodge and outreach to the community which require official chairs. the basic principal is working together in brotherhood to find your own truths in life.
i know this doesnt really relate to alchemy but i think anyone who might chance upon this thread in interest of masonry might find the information here to further pique their interest.