I was wondering if Christianity has become so corroded over the years that the original message has been lost. I don't understand why it is that Christ preached love your neighbor more than yourself, that when you give you shouldn't let your right hand know what your left hand is doing, that you shouldn't be the one to throw the first stone, and that you shouldn't pray on the street corners because your reward would be from men and not from God.

So here is my question, why are the Christians of today seen as the most judgemental(against Christ's message) most boastfull(again against Christ's message) most willing to throw the first stone(again against Christ's message) It's gotten to a point where I'm almost afraid to call myself a Christian...but I refuse not to because that is what I am. But why are so many Christians claiming to be Christ-like while they are throwing stones? and praying so long and winded(pride) for everyone to hear how "holy" they are(they have their reward from men)

Maybe I intepret the teaching differently but to me being Christ-like is doing things to show love to other's without expecting anything in return...your return will come later. "If someone forces you to go one mile, go with them two" doing things out of pure kindness/love that don't necessarily make sense...but shows something different about you.

I believe that Christianity simply can not survive in today society with a more proactive stance. This proactive stance comes as judgemental, boastful, and other actions that have a negative look to them. Although how does one not judge when shinning a light on the decay of the human condition?

It's difficult without question. Our history is full of involvement in things we shouldn't have been involved with. A lot of it brutally wrong... I just tell myself that that was them... not me.
So history gives credence to their hatred of christians... they have a right to point out the things that they often do.
I simply have no answers for them.
And if they have to lump into groups of ppl that I don't know and never agreed with. I say, bad men have used the Christian flag to do horrible things, and I can't take that back. I'm sorry that they've hurt you.
I try to focus on doing what's right. I can't erase what has been done in the past or even stop the things being done today... only speak to those who ask, that's what I roll with.

The problem is that light as Christ said should be pointed towards ourselves first...and held their because "We ALL have sinned" and need to remove the "planks out of our own eyes" the light shouldn't be pointed anywhere but towards us...and if we ourselves should be unconciously illuminate that light...problem is we try to do it conciously in my opinion

I dont believe Christianity is lost. I think because of technology we have more access to more types of peoples, more types of lifestyles, and more opinions. There will always be good people, christian and non, and there will always be christianity. I think the lesson about judging didnt require christians to be robots without opinions, but only referred to how we are to view peoples souls on the whole. We do not know any man or woman so completely as to judge their PERSON, but we absolutely must be a judge of right and wrong actions, and right and wrong words, as to make the best choices for ourselves.

I do think Christianity has been corrupted over the years mainly by people who want a new version of Christianity.One that allows them to go to heaven but also allows them to do what ever they want even if it is strongly against the church and the bible.I do believe,especially the younger people out there would just love to re-write the bible to fit their own agenda.Our churches are becoming stomping grounds for the "If it feels good it has to be good who call you every name in the book because you dare to back up what they are doing wrong with bible verses.


I have been over this topic many times about Christian judgement.It is wrong to judge a person with out knowing anything about them.It is perfectly allowable to judge a person by their actions and this is backed up all through the bible.The bible speaks in nearly every page who you should associate with and who you should not associate with.Who is good and who is bad.Who is blessed and who is cursed.If a person is a bad influence the bible says stay away from them.If you are going to be stupid and ignore this person and associate with them anyways because you think you are judging them by their actions you are wrong.If a person is a Christian and you know he is doing bad things you need to tell this person what he or she is doing is against the bible and against God.It is up to the Christians out there to keep other Christians in line and to remind them of the rules and commandments of the bible.It is wrong and stupid to think that you should stick your head in the sand and never give other Christians negative criticism because you are someone how being judgmental.

Don't judge with out facts and don't judge blindly.If you have the facts and if you know this person is doing harm against the Church use the bible to back up your justification.John the baptist was notorious for shouting out judgments to not only the people but to the Governors and his followers as well.I do believe Jesus choose John to baptize him for this reason.I judge and will continue to judge people by their actions and the bible says I am not wrong in doing so.


If people want to be more like Jesus they will always reject sin.Sin was never accepted under Jesus and was to be always overcome with good.Jesus did accept people as they were but he also told them to "Sin no more".Christians who are unrepentant sinners and want to keep sinning only do the church and other harm.God and Jesus both spoke about how it is twice as bad for a person to know the bible and Sin as apposed to someone who doesn't know the bible and sin.

Many,many churches have been corrupted through the acceptance of homosexuals in the church.Accepting homosexuality and giving it a blessing(as in gay marriage)is the same as accepting Sin and embracing Sin.It is one thing for a Christian to Sin and backslide through out his or her life.But Christians pray for forgiveness and repentance.The homosexuals not only tell God they are going to Sin and not repent.They make a lifelong commitment to rebel against his word.Jesus did not keep company with unrepentant sinners who wanted to rebel against him.He kept company with people who did his word and followed his commands.


Ezekiel 33:16-20

None of the sins that he has committed shall be remembered against him. He has done what is just and right; he shall surely live. “Yet your people say, ‘The way of the Lord is not just,’ when it is their own way that is not just. When the righteous turns from his righteousness and does injustice, he shall die for it. And when the wicked turns from his wickedness and does what is just and right, he shall live by this. Yet you say, ‘The way of the Lord is not just.’ O house of Israel, I will judge each of you according to his ways.”


Proverbs 21:12

The Righteous One observes the house of the wicked; he throws the wicked down to ruin.


1 Corinthians 6:18

Flee sexual immorality! “Every sin a person commits is outside of the body”but the immoral person sins against his own body.

Galatians 6:1

Dear brothers and sisters, if another Christian is overcome by some sin, you who are godly should gently and humbly help that person back onto the right path. And be careful not to fall into the same temptation yourself.

1 Corinthians 6:9

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! The sexually immoral, idolaters, adulterers, passive homosexual partners,practicing homosexuals.


1 Samuel 3:13

You should tell him that I am about to judge his house forever because of the sin that he knew about. For his sons were cursing God,and he did not rebuke them.

1 Timothy 4:2

Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.


2 Peter 2:4

For if God did not have pity for the angels who did evil, but sent them down into hell, to be kept in chains of eternal night till they were judged


Matthew 13:24-30

He presented them with another parable: “The kingdom of heaven is like a person who sowed good seed in his field.But while everyone was sleeping, an enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat and went away.When the plants sprouted and bore grain, then the weeds also appeared.So the slaves of the owner came and said to him, ‘Sir, didn’t you sow good seed in your field? Then where did the weeds come from?’He said, ‘An enemy has done this.’ So the slaves replied, ‘Do you want us to go and gather them?’But he said,‘No, since in gathering the weeds you may uproot the wheat with them.Let both grow together until the harvest. At harvest time I will tell the reapers, “First collect the weeds and tie them in bundles to be burned, but then gather the wheat into my barn.”


Revelation 21:8

"But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death."

In almost everyone of the verses it said to tell them that God came to judge...yes he does judge...that is HIS job. It is not our's and when talking about other Christians he says to let them know 'gently, and humbly' but again that is ANOTHER Christian not an unbeleiver.

And if we are who we associate with, then Christ was a Tax Collector, Prostitute, a thief, and a murderer. That is not the image of Christ that I have. I don't beleive he was any of those things, but take at look at Christ's discliples the 12 closest to him...what was HIS image?

"Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven."Luke 6:37

"He who is without sin throw the first stone"-Luke 7:8-9.

"You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye."Mathew 7:5

I disagree.




Romans "We know that the law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a slave to sin. 15I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature.[a] For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

21So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death? 25Thanks be to God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!
So then, I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in the sinful nature a slave to the law of sin."

So Paul wasn't a Christian is what you are telling me.....hmmmm

Again I disagree

christianity is a joke to begin with hijacked and corrupted by the romans. there was never supposed to be a seperate religion from judism which was also corrupted, hijacked, and changed.

Okay, that's not even cool, man. This is what I'm talking about: Holy Wars. Why do we insist on attacking each other or castigating each other, simply because we believe in different faiths? What is the point, really? Is your faith so weak that you gain strength and power of conviction by attacking others that believe differently than you? If not, then perhaps it is time to lay down your sword and love your neighbors, not chastise them. May peace be upon you, and hopefully you will gain wisdom from learning from others' faiths, if not, you can at least love them and bring peace to your soul.

nicely put...thank you. Faith is never 'stupid', whatever religious label it is given.

isaac_dede,

I am impressed and humbled by your authenticity and transparency.

I was tempted to reply to 'thomas's post, but after reading the manner in which you addressed it, I was wordless. That's an event in itself!

And if msharmony is reading this, we can tie this very interesting thread of 'isaac_dede' to the exchange we were having earlier about 'sane' christians needing to take on the restoring of christianity's integrity by standing up with compassion, love and intelligence, as 'isaac_dede' is showing here, to the conscious and unconscious hypocrisy of some, which has dislodged the essence and focus of a 'Christ-like' inspired life!


Hat's off to you 'Isaac-dede'!

I enjoy Isaacs posts as well. I disagree often with the hate or intolerance of some and I am always uplifted by level headed, empathetic, conversation.

I agree that an unrepentent 'Christian' is wearing a false suit of armor, but I also understand that there is no Christian without sin(save one).

Christians seem to lose Jesus all of the time. I'm quite frankly tired of them coming up to me and asking if I've found him.

If ya'll can't keep aneye on where ya put him, how does that work for Christianity in general?!

There is one thing Christians know with out a doubt.Jesus did not lie and Jesus did not preach one thing and do another.People say all the time "What would Jesus do"?With that said,are you seriously going to tell me that Jesus did not judge?Did you ever read when Jesus went into the Temple and threw a fit,turned over tables,and told everyone to get out?It was people he never saw before and if he was not to judge wouldn't he have just strolled in and totally ignored everyone and everything?Wrong!He saw their actions,judged them,and kicked them out by their actions.Would it be wrong for a Christian to do the same thing?Do you think Jesus would be upset if another Christian did this?You know how many times Jesus called the Jewish priest hypocrites because of their actions?Many many times.Is that not judging?

Take Mary and the stoning issue.Jesus said "Let he who has no sin cast the first stone".Everyone has sin and everyone should die equally for it.Did he tell those people who brought her there they were wrong for bringing her?Did he say they were not to judge her?He did not.They were simply accusing a woman of her actions which were fact and against the bible.Jesus told this woman "To sin no more".He knew what she did and told her not to do it again.Do you think he would be happy knowing she left only to go back to prostitution?Do you think he would be upset with other Christians if they found this woman in the act again and told her she was sinning against God?

Both God and Jesus wants us to be accountable for our actions.That is the whole point of confessing our sins to him.Both God and Jesus gave us the bible to use as a form of authority to keep Christians in line and moral.Jesus may have picked immoral people to have as company.But after they met him they certainly did not continue to be immoral and sinful people as they walked with him.

Like I said before if you want to ignore bad Christian behavior and say nothing to them because you think you are judging them.You might as well just join the rest of the corrupt Christians in our society today.A bible not enforced by other Christians is a empty book.I know I certianly speak my mind to other Christians and if chastising other Christians using the bible for judgment is wrong then I don't know what is right.The Christian and Catholic churches are in the mess they are today because people thought it was more important to be politicaly correct with the public instead of doing what is right with God.If I was the head of the church and I had people in my church who was constantly doing bad things and making the church look bad I would kick them out.If you are going to call yourself a Christian you should at least make a minimal effort to live a Christian lifestyle.If your not then you probably shouldn't call yourself a Christian but a Atheist as there is no point in saying your a Christian and then doing everything against what it stands for.


Why you posted the Romans 7-15 through 7-25 I have no idea.I will address it anyways.

Paul was speaking in past tense before he became a Christian.He was basically saying that before he met Jesus he felt like his life was hopeless.He felt like a slave to the world and not worthy or Gods forgiveness.He was enslaved in chains in a dark room.Paul further describes how he wants to be good but feels like something is preventing him from doing so.He feels as if someone else is controlling him.He tells us that Jesus would rescue him and he did!

Paul made a excellent point by saying "I myself in my mind am a slave to God's law, but in the sinful nature a slave to the law of sin." What a great statement!In our minds we want to do the right thing and follow Gods laws.But since our body and flesh are weak we will always be tempted and commit immoral sins until the day die.

You know what is really funny?Reading how many of your Muslim brothers are converting to Christianity in record numbers on a daily basis despite the punishment of death.Now thats funny!And wow it's going to be hard to call this Christian propaganda since even your beloved Al Qataani and al Jazeera Network did a report on it.


http://www.faithfreedom.org/oped/sina31103.htm

Hitler said if a lie is repeated often enough and long enough, it would come to be perceived as truth. One such lie often repeated is “Islam is the fastest growing religion”.

Despite the fact that Muslims by virtue of being poor and uneducated are much more reproductive than others, Islam as a religion is not growing but dying fast.

More and more Muslims are discovering that the violence evinced by some of their coreligionists is not an aberration but is inspired by the teachings of the Quran and the examples set by its author. Muslims are becoming disillusioned with Islam. They find out that the mechanistic ritual of praying five times per day, reciting verses that they do not understand and indeed mean nothing, getting up at taxing hours of the morning and abstaining from food and water until the sunset are not means to becoming more spiritual but are instruments to control their mind. These enlightened Muslims no more heed to the fear mongering verses of the Quran that threaten to burn them and roast them in the fires of hell if they dare to think and question the validity of that book.

Every day thousands of Muslim intellectuals are leaving Islam. They find Islam inconsistent with science, logics, human rights and ethics. Millions of Iranians already have left Islam. The enlightened Muslims of other nationalities are not far behind. This is the beginning of a mass exodus from Islam. It is a movement that is already in motion and nothing can stop it.

However the exodus from Islam is not reserved to the intellectuals but also the average Muslims are finding that Islam is not the way to God but to ignorance, poverty and wars. They are leaving Islam to embrace other religions especially the Christianity.

Perhaps it is best to listen to the truth coming from the mouth of the horse. The Internet site aljazeera.net published an interview with Ahmad Al Qataani أحمد القطعاني An important Islamic cleric who said: “In every hour, 667 Muslims convert to Christianity. Everyday, 16,000 Muslims convert to Christianity. Ever year, 6 million Muslims convert to Christianity."

What Muslims say among each other, is not the same thing that they say for the consumption of the Westerners.

These are huge numbers. If this trend continues we can expect to see Islam become insignificant in Africa in just a few decades. This is good news for those who are concerned about the on going slavery in Africa and the prospects of war and genocide.

In fact with the weakening of Islam, we can hope to see peace in many war-ridden parts of the world including Palestine. By now it should be clear that any road map to peace between Israel and Palestine will be blocked by the Islamists and the terrorists. Peace in Middle East is not possible as long as Islam is the ideology of the masses.

It is important that we realize that this terrorism that is threatening the peace of the world and these wars that bleed the Muslim nations are not economically motivated but are they are hate motivated. They are religious wars. The weakening of Islam means peace for mankind.

Al Qataani and al Jazeera Network were alarmed by these huge numbers of Muslims leaving Islam, but humanity must rejoice over these numbers. The weakening of Islam means the triumph of mankind.

really thomas? show me these record numbers. your comment is pure lies. if in fact what you said was true, which it isn't...why would the pope and the catholic church be shaking in their garters that Islam is quickly catching up to them in numbers?
here's what's funny about people like you. you'll say that there is this death sentence if you leave islam then you turn around and claim there are record numbers in ex muslims among us. there's not a month that goes by that one of these so called ex muslims speak at a christian church here in my city and i've exposed them all thus far to be fakes. none i've encountered can answer simple questions about the islamic faith and some have admitted to saying their ex muslims for the money. those i've encountered that really left islam for christianity did it because of the silly notion that once they were baptized they're "saved" and can cheat on their wives with no consequence. some religion you have there buddy

That's like saying "hey I'm just a member of that brutal and corrupt organization. But I'm not brutal or corrupt."
After acknowledging it's evil, why would you continue to be a member of a club like that? Do they have really good cookies or what?

unlike say...every other major religion in the world?

the institution of religion is in as much trouble as the institution of marriage,,but there will always be those who stand tall and true and become even stronger in the face of adversity,,,,


time will tell where it all ends up,,,,but I will continue to believe in God and marriage and many of those other 'inconvenient' institutions which have the nerve to set RULES and GUIDELINES for me to follow,,,,