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| Topic: The so-called pantheists... | |
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She did not say creator James...
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James, Your view is far too narrow, my friend... All I'm saying is that we are either spiritual beings or we're not. Either atheism is true or it isn't. 
In my mind, I can reduce all spiritual ideas to pantheism. Not because I'm far too narrow,... but just the opposite,... because I give such a wide berth to the pantheisic view. 
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She did not say creator James...
No need to say it. No creator = atheism.
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No creator = atheism.
Really? 
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She did not say creator James...
No need to say it. No creator = atheism.
ok does Creator have to be a thing...an entity ? or just a potential for all things to manifest from? |
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How about this...
No creator = no personification of that which is not human... That includes what is commonly called spirit...
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ok does Creator have to be a thing...an entity ? or just a potential for all things to manifest from? I think that's the fundamental difference between atheism and spirituality. Atheism believes we are just an unguided, unplanned, accident that sprung up from some sort of non-sentient potential well. That's atheism. Nothing wrong with antheism. In fact, I don't even say that it can't be true! I'm ultimately agnostic I try to say that as much as I can. However, I would argue that if atheism is truth, then robots can potentially become just as sentient and ALIVE as humans. I might also argue that the atheistic view assumes an actual physical world. (i.e. life is physical and arrises from the physical universe). Thus the reason that robot can potentially become living being in such a unviverse. Spiritial Pantheism is not a physical concept. It's a spiritual concept. It says that our true nature is not physical but spiritual. Don't even worry about the Big Bang, because that's not what gave rise to spirit. The Big Band merely gave rise to the physical world. We are spirits enjoying this physical "incarnation". I think you guys are becoming atheists and just trying to romanticize atheism. 
There's nothing wrong with that, but it does reduce to a physical construct. If you asign our existence to the physical universe then that's ulimately atheism. No matter how much you romanticize it.
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How about this... No creator = no personification of that which is not human... That includes what is commonly called spirit...
Like I say, I have no problem with that. It just looks like atheism to me. That's all I'm saying. And again, there's nothing wrong with atheism. What I don't understand is why you seem to be determined to make it into something more than atheism. Are you afraid of atheism? If that's what you believe then why not just face it head on? |
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it seems to me very ridiculous the idea of an existance without a final ending. whether a person follows a religious belief or not, is not the biggest issue. for me is very sad and deplorable to see individuals who think that there is nothing after this life. individuals who have the delusion to be in peace their whole life because they are not rule for any set of values whatsover. and they have the idea that after they die their essence will disapear. if i were to hold such believe it would be easier to grab a gun and blow my brain because if it's true that nothing is going to happen after i die, well why the hell i keep living the miserable life of this world? whereas i believe that regardless the belief system there have to be something beyond this life and whatever we become or get after this world is based upon our deeds in this world either good or bad. ================================================== now with regard anthropomorphism I gotta be very naive or stupid, but for me it's very simple. If we were created in God's image and likeness ofcourse we are going to have God's traces in our substance. That is the reason why we are able to relate human feelings to God because feelings and thoughts are part of our soul which is exactly the characteristic that God gave us in order to be in his image and likeness. Therefore, to me is very silly and naive trying to conceive a God who is absolutely apart from us. Do not feel sad for those that do not believe in the existence of God and/or afterlife for it makes their life here on Earth that much more precious! |
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I don't believe I have ever been called an athiest before ...
I am going to make a new badge to add to my collection ...
nah James ... I am spirit ... the rest of it is just an illusion ... 
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I am?
You must have forgotten our conversations at that 'other' site ...
I'm seriously losing my mind Sherrie. It's a miracle when I can remember what happened last week. I think I might be coming down with some form of dementia. |
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I don't believe I have ever been called an athiest before ...
I am going to make a new badge to add to my collection ...
nah James ... I am spirit ... the rest of it is just an illusion ...
I'm not "calling" you anything. I'm just saying that what you describe sounds like atheism to me. If you don't feel that it is, then more power to you. 
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James...
Your insistence upon another's admittance which supports your false understanding of their meaning is troublesome to me. Why must you do this? What is it that drives your need to understand everything? Why is your misunderstanding of another's belief held as having greater validity within yourself than the other's true belief? Do you not realize that man made language only supports man made concepts? Definitions create boundaries. Words which attempt to describe that which cannot be known serve only to lessen it's value.
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I don't believe I have ever been called an athiest before ...
I am going to make a new badge to add to my collection ...
nah James ... I am spirit ... the rest of it is just an illusion ...
I'm not "calling" you anything. I'm just saying that what you describe sounds like atheism to me. If you don't feel that it is, then more power to you.
I haven't found a label that fits so I'm just gonna go with human being
....although I do like the sound of anthropomorphized bit of energy ...
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An eclectic group of one?
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I don't believe I have ever been called an athiest before ...
I am going to make a new badge to add to my collection ...
nah James ... I am spirit ... the rest of it is just an illusion ...
I'm not "calling" you anything. I'm just saying that what you describe sounds like atheism to me. If you don't feel that it is, then more power to you.
...but I said there is part of me that is spirit ... I am confused ...
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An eclectic group of one?
I like that one too
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Oh yeah...
Thanks for the Rumi, Lee... 
Very nice... |
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Your insistence upon another's admittance which supports your false understanding of their meaning is troublesome to me.
Why must you do this? I don't recall insisting on anything. I simply asked questions. I simply suggested that what you've described sounds to me like the standard atheistic picture. Then I asked that if this is truly what you believe, then why not accept that what you believe in is atheism? That's was question Michael, not an insistence. Clearly you disagree that what you have described is the standard atheistic picture. Obviously we have different understandings of what constitutes atheism. No offense meant. I was just asking. What is it that drives your need to understand everything?
I'm a natural born scientist/philosopher. I've been curious about everything my entire life. 
Why is your misunderstanding of another's belief held as having greater validity within yourself than the other's true belief?
I think that's their perception, not mine. Do you not realize that man made language only supports man made concepts?
All too well. But I also haven't seen anyone say, "I'm sorry but I can't put my thoughts into words" Instead they try to explain, and I try to understand.
Definitions create boundaries.
That's the whole purpose behind them.
Words which attempt to describe that which cannot be known serve only to lessen it's value.
Agreed. But I'm not smelling the roses when I discuss religious concepts. When I want to smell the roses I go out and smell them.
You seem to be doing the same thing as Jess. You go into a religious discussion forum and then complain that people are discussing religion using words???? If you want to smell the roses why not go smell them? Why complain to me that I don't smell like a rose???
This isn't a rose garden.
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Edited by
Jess642
on
Thu 06/19/08 10:28 PM
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Oh yeah...
Thanks for the Rumi, Lee...
Very nice... Pleasure Michael,
It felt appropriate.... it resonated with me, in this thread, and pretty much most of them. Who can say that what is in my rain barrel is wrong? or needs to have a different name? It's what USE the contents of my rain barrel can do, that feels appropriate to me. I also want to know more at times, however I find the more one wants to KNOW, the more one seems to engage their mind, and disengage their heart, or their innate sense of what is appropriate for them. Dissecting and describing is a luxury I find one I cannot afford anymore... there seems to be a shortage of language... yet my barrel runneth over.
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