Creative Soul... everything that was PROPHESIED about Jesus came to pass.

Read the whole book of Isaiah...read proverbs..in fact, read the whole old and new testaments.

Again....Everything that the prophets spoke over Jesus life ,came to pass.. to the very nit and tiddle.

I think you missed my point Miguel. I’m asking what good will it do?

If a man rapes your daughter and murders her, do you say to him, “Here’s my son, kill him too and I’ll forgive you”.

My point is this,… How does having men do even more wrongful things make them any more forgivable?

Why does more violence always need to be the solution to previous violence?

This is just another example of the biblical God viewing violence as always being the solution to problems.

Men are sinful. Great, let’s have them brutally murder God’s son so God can forgive them????

I don’t see the point to it.

How did having men murder Christ make them any more forgivable?

I’m adding the following after reading a few more posts:

The idea of animal sacrifice and spilling blood to pay for sins was rampant in all mythologies. It’s not the least bit unique to Christianity or the biblical picture of God.

So from my point of view, the whole idea of sacrificial blood is just more evidence that the biblical picture is no different from all the other mythologies of the time. Including Greek Mythology which was full of blood sacrifices to the gods. This was just a common superstition that men had in those days.

Why should I believe that the real creator of the universe would just go along with the status quo of all other manmade mythologies?

Isn’t it much more reasonable to recognize that the biblical account of god is just more of the same?

Some homework for you Creative Soul....

you go find in the bible where Jesus wept in the garden before his cruxificion...and find out what he said there ,while he wept great drops of blood.....

also go find out what he said to his apostles , while he sat at the last supper and ate with them....come back and tell us here, what Jesus said on both occasions

Yes I think he did in Luke 19-10

9And Jesus said unto him, This day is salvation come to this house, forsomuch as he also is a son of Abraham.

10For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

For a little more clarification on who the son of man is...
John20:28-31 documents that Jesus is all that we think he is...Luke was a physician who traveled with the apostle Paul and was written 60-65 AD. And John was written by himself and was himself an apostle of Jesus. Hope this helps.


28And Thomas answered and said unto him, My LORD and my God.

29Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

30And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:

31But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

your point is valid since you consider yourself sinless. I respect ur view of urself.
therefore, i will use myself as an example to make my point. There has to be an exchange for what i have done wrong (sin), my wrongdoing must be washed. I (Miguel "TLW" nobody else) believe that Jesus' sacrifies does that.
However, i would be very short if i just stay with the idea of the death of my Lord.
My Lord had to day because he needed to be resurrected, but how could He have been able to resurrect if He did not die first.
Jesus had to die in order to destroy death through his resurrection.
However, I know James resurrection is a myth for you. That is why I'm just telling you what I hold as truth for me.

Luke22:70 Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.

Luke22:71 And they said, What need we any further witness? for we ourselves have heard of his own mouth.

Oh wow... this question has brought up so many responses... so quickly also...

I will have to read them all and get back as neccessary...

Thank you all...

Anytime!

“I am the resurrection and the life” (John 11:25). “I will raise him up at the last day” (John 6:40)

Ok... reading over the responses, I have seen an Old Testament book, Isaiah, and two New testament books, Luke and John, being used to support the notion that Jesus himself believed that his purpose was to be sacrificed for the forgiveness of all man's sin...

I am still failing to see this clearly...

Without Paul of Tsarsus, Christianity does not exist...

Luke was a physician, hung out with Paul... never met Jesus... scratch his testimony... hearsay...

Although his is a brilliant writer, Paul never met Jesus... scratch his also... hearsay...

John was written by more than one person, and it is in doubt as to whether or any of it's author's, is John the disciple...

Jesus' words on John, the disciple, were as such...

Of all men born of woman, John is the greatest... but he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he...

Scratch John, the disciple...

All we have left are the synoptic gospels, and the gnostics...

It is all a matter of faith, I suppose...

I resonate more with all of the parables.... which reflect what is within us... placed there by 'God'... pointed out repeatedly by Jesus...

Jesus came as a result of 'God' not being pleased with mankind's attempts at pleasing 'God'. The blood sacrifices of animals and first born sons were not pleasing, therefore why on this green earth would anyone want to believe that 'God' would plan to send his only begotten son to be murdered?

Although I have also read in this thread where belief has completely circumvented actuality, I will leave those falsities to their believer and the comfort that it creates...

Bless you all...

Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Luk 10:16 He that heareth you heareth me; and he that despiseth you despiseth me; and he that despiseth me despiseth him that sent me.



Jhn 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life



Jhn 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.



Jhn 4:34 Jesus saith unto them, My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work.



Jhn 7:28 Then cried Jesus in the temple as he taught, saying, Ye both know me, and ye know whence I am: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not.

Oops sorry you said to scratch John.