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Topic: "Stop loss" = new slavery...Forced to stay in the Army.
Fanta46's photo
Thu 10/18/07 04:55 PM
Come on man, Noone is attacking America. Unless you consider one idiot, (Bush) to be the voice and soul of America.

I dont, and am insulted that anyone would consider lumping us all in to one big pile of **** like that.

We are a government of the people, by the people, for the people.

George Bush has attacked that and in doing so has attacked America. He is the enemy, not America!!!

bibby7's photo
Thu 10/18/07 06:19 PM
Bravo...Fanta..Eloquently said!!drinker

karmafury's photo
Thu 10/18/07 07:00 PM
"this is probably the most "legal" war, (if there is such a thing) in history. we gave countless warnings and deadlines or did you forget? we had how many UN Resolutions?"

You didn't give give countless warnings and deadlines, the United Nations did. Yes there were UN resolutions which the the President threw out the window because they didn't suit him. He chose to go in without the sanction of the United Nations and then tried to bully others into joining.
It isn't a war in the legal sense of the word. Wars are declared by Congress not the President. It is a Congressionally Authorized Military Engagement. What the difference is makes no sense to the grunt on the ground however.
Should the Forces be pulled out of Iraq. Yes. But not a wholesale pullout a la Vietnam where those who assisted the Americans were hunted down afterwards (Montagnards). A gradual pullout leaving behind troops to assist / train a recovering military and police force(maybe even God forbid, asking the UN to send in Peacekeepers to assist with this).

Fanta46's photo
Thu 10/18/07 09:21 PM
What follows are just the most outrageous and significant of the dozens of outright lies uttered by Bush and his top officials over the past year in what amounts to a systematic campaign to scare the bejeezus out of everybody:

LIE #1: "The evidence indicates that Iraq is reconstituting its nuclear weapons program ... Iraq has attempted to purchase high-strength aluminum tubes and other equipment need for gas centrifuges, which are used to enrich uranium for nuclear weapons." – President Bush, Oct. 7, 2002, in Cincinnati.

FACT: This story, leaked to and breathlessly reported by Judith Miller in the New York Times, has turned out to be complete baloney. Department of Energy officials, who monitor nuclear plants, say the tubes could not be used for enriching uranium. One intelligence analyst, who was part of the tubes investigation, angrily told The New Republic that, "You had senior American officials like Condoleezza Rice saying the only use of this aluminum really is uranium centrifuges. She said that on television. And that's just a lie."

LIE #2: "The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa." – President Bush, Jan.28, 2003, in the State of the Union address.

FACT: This whopper was based on a document that the White House already knew to be a forgery thanks to the CIA. Sold to Italian intelligence by some hustler, the document carried the signature of an official who had been out of office for 10 years and referenced a constitution that was no longer in effect. The ex-ambassador who the CIA sent to check out the story is pissed: "They knew the Niger story was a flat-out lie," he told the New Republic, anonymously. "They [the White House] were unpersuasive about aluminum tubes and added this to make their case more strongly."

LIE #3: "We believe [Saddam] has, in fact, reconstituted nuclear weapons." – Vice President Cheney on March 16, 2003 on "Meet the Press."

FACT: There was and is absolutely zero basis for this statement. CIA reports up through 2002 showed no evidence of an Iraqi nuclear weapons program.

LIE #4: "[The CIA possesses] solid reporting of senior-level contacts between Iraq and al-Qaeda going back a decade." – CIA Director George Tenet in a written statement released Oct. 7, 2002 and echoed in that evening's speech by President Bush.

FACT: Intelligence agencies knew of tentative contacts between Saddam and al-Qaeda in the early '90s, but found no proof of a continuing relationship. In other words, by tweaking language, Tenet and Bush spun the intelligence180 degrees to say exactly the opposite of what it suggested.

LIE #5: "We've learned that Iraq has trained al-Qaeda members in bomb-making and poisons and deadly gases ... Alliance with terrorists could allow the Iraqi regime to attack America without leaving any fingerprints." – President Bush, Oct. 7.

FACT: No evidence of this has ever been leaked or produced. Colin Powell told the U.N. this alleged training took place in a camp in northern Iraq. To his great embarrassment, the area he indicated was later revealed to be outside Iraq's control and patrolled by Allied war planes.

LIE #6: "We have also discovered through intelligence that Iraq has a growing fleet of manned and unmanned aerial vehicles that could be used to disperse chemical or biological weapons across broad areas. We are concerned that Iraq is exploring ways of using these UAVs [unmanned aerial vehicles] for missions targeting the United States." – President Bush, Oct. 7.

FACT: Said drones can't fly more than 300 miles, and Iraq is 6000 miles from the U.S. coastline. Furthermore, Iraq's drone-building program wasn't much more advanced than your average model plane enthusiast. And isn't a "manned aerial vehicle" just a scary way to say "plane"?

LIE #7: "We have seen intelligence over many months that they have chemical and biological weapons, and that they have dispersed them and that they're weaponized and that, in one case at least, the command and control arrangements have been established." – President Bush, Feb. 8, 2003, in a national radio address.

FACT: Despite a massive nationwide search by U.S. and British forces, there are no signs, traces or examples of chemical weapons being deployed in the field, or anywhere else during the war.

LIE #8: "Our conservative estimate is that Iraq today has a stockpile of between 100 and 500 tons of chemical weapons agent. That is enough to fill 16,000 battlefield rockets." – Secretary of State Colin Powell, Feb. 5 2003, in remarks to the UN Security Council.

FACT: Putting aside the glaring fact that not one drop of this massive stockpile has been found, as previously reported on AlterNet our own intelligence reports show that these stocks – if they existed – were well past their use-by date and therefore useless as weapon fodder.

LIE #9: "We know where [Iraq's WMD] are. They're in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south, and north somewhat." – Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, March 30, 2003, in statements to the press.

FACT: Needless to say, no such weapons were found, not to the east, west, south or north, somewhat or otherwise.

LIE #10: "Yes, we found a biological laboratory in Iraq which the UN prohibited." – President Bush in remarks in Poland, published internationally June 1, 2003.

FACT: This was reference to the discovery of two modified truck trailers that the CIA claimed were are potential mobile biological weapons lab. But British and American experts – including the State Department's intelligence wing in a report released this week – have since declared this to be untrue. According to the British, and much to Prime Minister Tony Blair's embarrassment, the trailers are actually exactly what Iraq said they were, facilities to fill weather balloons, sold to them by the British themselves.


no photo
Fri 10/19/07 09:27 AM
yup and all that was from using intel from the clintonistas regime. There was his big mistake.

Fitnessfanatic's photo
Fri 10/19/07 11:47 AM
Ramble you whine too much about Cliton's presidentency. Real just because he didn't start a war to support your "contract" (AKA mercenary) company profit margins. He wouldn't create a network of lies to start a disastous war like Bush did that his wife have to savage America's reputation from.

And aside from that why did Bush use old intel that was out dated and ignored the then current data that there was no evidence of futhering WMD ambitions by Iraq.

Face facts Ramble this war has over stretch American forces and made more ememies than Allies, and made America appear weak in the eyes of an old cold war ememy, Russia. Russian president Putin scolded Bush's war as "pointless" and he went to Iran to support them.

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