"We believe in a God who is Himself progressive, whose majesty is intelligence; whose perfection consists in eternal advancement -- a Being who has attained His exalted state by a path which now His children are permitted to follow, whose glory it is their heritage to share. In spite of the opposition of the sects, in the face of direct charges of blasphemy, the Church proclaims the eternal truth: 'As man is, God once was; as God is, man may be.'" (LDS Apostle James E. Talmage, Articles of Faith, Ch.24, p.430 - p.431, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM

'It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God,' the inspired word continues, 'and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did.' The Father is a glorified, perfected, resurrected, exalted man who worked out his salvation by obedience to the same laws he has given to us so that we may do the same." (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, p.64, LDS Collectors Library '

Thus, on this beautiful spring morning in the Sacred Grove, Joseph Smith witnessed the renewal of God's dealing with his children in accordance with the great gospel plan of redemption. Upon this occasion God the Father and his Beloved Son Jesus Christ appearing as glorified Resurrected Beings unto a chosen servant of God, made known once again the state of immortality which man will attain in preparation for the next estate of eternity; that also the world once again could know the reality of the personal nature of God the Father and his Beloved Son. (LDS Apostle Alvin R. Dyer, Conference Report, April 1963, p.49 - p.50, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)

As we stretch our imaginations to absorb the limitlessness of the creations of God we turn to a favorite song: If you could hie to Kolob in the twinkling of an eye, And then continue onward with that same speed to fly, D'ye think that you could ever, through all eternity, Find out the generation where Gods began to be? Or see the grand beginning, where space did not extend? Or view the last creation where Gods and matter end? Methinks the Spirit whispers, "No man has found 'pure space,'" Nor seen the outside curtains, where nothing has a place. The works of God continue, and worlds and lives abound; Improvement and progression have one eternal round. There is no end to matter; there is no end to space; There is no end to spirit; there is no end to race." (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p.250, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM

"God: Creator And Ruler Of Many Worlds. -- While it is true that evolutionists may be divided between theistic and atheistic groups, yet most of those professing belief in God consider him to be an indefinable force, essence, or power of an incomprehensible nature. According to revelation, however, he is a personal Being, a holy and exalted Man, a glorified, resurrected Personage having a tangible body of flesh and bones, an anthropomorphic Entity, the personal Father of the spirits of all men. (D. & C. 130:22- 23; Moses 6:51, 57; Abra. 3:22-24; Jos. Smith 2:16-19.)"

We are members of the family of the Eternal Father. He is a glorified and exalted and eternal Being, having a resurrected body of flesh and bones. His name is God, and the kind of life he lives is God's life. His name is also Eternal, and the name of the kind of life he lives is eternal life. Eternal life is God's life, and God's life is eternal life. We are commanded to be perfect as he is perfect and to advance and progress until we become like him, or in other words, until we gain eternal life. Thus Joseph Smith said, "You have got to learn how to be Gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all Gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power." (Teachings, pp. 346-47.) Christ our Lord has so obtained, thus enabling him to say to the faithful: "Ye shall be even as I am, and I am even as the Father." (3 Ne. 28:10.)" (LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, The Mortal Messiah, Vol.1, p.23 - p.24, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)

I will prove that the world is wrong, by showing what God is. I am going to inquire after God; for I want you all to know Him, and to be familiar with Him; and if I am bringing you to a knowledge of Him, all persecutions against me ought to cease. You will then know that I am His servant; for I speak as one having authority. ... "I will go back to the beginning before the world was, to show what kind of a being God is. What sort of a being was God in the beginning? Open your ears and hear, all ye ends of the earth. for I am going to prove it to you by the Bible, and to tell you the designs of God in relation to the human race, and why He interferes with the affairs of man. ... "God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens! That is the great secret. If the veil were rent today, and the great God who holds this world in its orbit, and who upholds all worlds and all things by His power, was to make himself visible,--I say, if you were to see him today, you would see him like a man in form--like yourselves in all the person, image, and very form as a man; for Adam was created in the very fashion, image and likeness of God, and received instruction from, and walked, talked and conversed with Him, as one man talks and communes with another. ... "In order to understand the subject of the dead, for consolation of those who mourn for the loss of their friends, it is necessary we should understand the character and being of God and how He came to be so; for I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea, and take away the veil, so that you may see. ... "These are incomprehensible ideas to some, but they are simple. It is the first principle of the gospel to know for a certainty the character of God, and to know that we may converse with Him as one man converses with another, and that He was once a man like us; yea, that God himself, the Father of us all, dwelt on an earth, the same as Jesus Christ Himself did; and I will show it from the Bible. ... "I wish I was in a suitable place to tell it, and that I had the trump of an archangel, so that I could tell the story in such a manner that persecution would cease forever. What did Jesus say? (Mark it, Elder Rigdon!) The scriptures inform us that Jesus said, as the Father hath power in himself, even so hath the Son power--to do what? Why, what the Father did. The answer is obvious--in a manner to lay down his body and take it up again. Jesus, what are you going to do? To lay down my life as my Father did, and take it up again. Do you believe it? If you do not believe it you do not believe the Bible. The scriptures say it, and I defy all the learning and wisdom and all the combined powers of earth and hell together to refute it. Here, then, is eternal life--to know the only wise and true God; and you have got to learn how to be gods yourselves, and to be kings and priests to God, the same as all gods have done before you, namely, by going from one small degree to another, and from a small capacity to a great one; from grace to grace, from exaltation to exaltation, until you attain to the resurrection of the dead, and are able to dwell in everlasting burnings. and to sit in glory, as do those who sit enthroned in everlasting power. And I want you to know that God, in the last days, while certain individuals are proclaiming His name, is not trifling with you or me." (LDS President Joseph Smith, History of the Church, Vol.6, Ch.14, p.305-6, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)

Intelligent beings are organized to become Gods, even the Sons of God, to dwell in the presence of the Gods, and become associated with the highest intelligences that dwell in eternity. We are now in the school, and must practice upon what we receive." (LDS President Brigham Young, Discourses of Brigham Young, p.245, LDS Collectors Library '97 CD-ROM)

This was the calling of Joseph Smith. He taught anew that God was in the form of man; that man was made in the image of God; and he taught the principles of justice, mercy, charity, and forgiveness. ... He taught the truths that the Prophets before him had taught; and he went beyond them. ... Joseph Smith taught men to look up to heaven and conceive of a God in the form of man. He taught them that they could become like their Father and God, who was 'an exalted Man.' And what is more simple and reasonable? Don't you parents expect your children to become like you? Or do you expect your children to be something else than men and women? No. You men will see your sons become men; you women will see your daughters become women. Then God our Father--yes, and our Mother--in heaven, looking down upon this world-- this school house in which their children are being educated--expect, and Joseph Smith taught it as a truth, that their children will be exalted, if they pursue the proper course, until they shall become divine beings themselves, worthy to stand upon that plane where stand their Father and their Mother in heaven. Like begets like; and the principle of eternal progress will make of man a God. (LDS Apostle Orson F. Whitney, Collected Discourses, Vol.5, May 8, 1898, LDS Collectors

were is this in the bible please tell me

Bid, I'm kind of lost. Where are you going with this? I'm not Mormon or even Christian. However, I do work with a lot of people who are LDS members and consider them friends.

M

bidright,

Not only are many of the beliefs of Mormons nowhere in the Bible, they are also not in the Book of Mormon. Nowhere in the Book of Mormon does it say that Jesus and Satan are brothers. Nowhere in the Book of Mormon does it say that God was once a man. Those beliefs were added by presidents of the LDS. I'm not going to say they are right or wrong, just offering the facts.

these are the mormans beliefs this is what they are taught from day 1

they say they are christians and belief in the bible they wrote there own bible they change therules how they see fit polagamy now they say no no caffine now they drink pepsi in fact they own the the company the bible dosnt change

Bidwell,
I am curious as to why you have decided that the Mormons are not Christian? It seems to me you are on a rampage for some reason.

You seem to believe that the Mormon faith wrote its own Bible? That is far from the truth, the Book of Mormon is the teachings of Christ on this the American Continent. Where if anyplace has one of the Church leaders EVER referred to the Book of Mormon as the Bible?

You have taken information/facts spoken by leaders of the church yet you did not list it in its entire piece, why would you do this? Are you a reporter that takes phrases out of context? Without posting what these leaders said in its entire form you are doing just that. You have clipped out these portions to try and justify your claims.

I challenge you to read or listen to these leaders sermons and then tell me you honestly believe they are teaching doctrines that are not of Jesus Christ's teachings.

The ideas of polygamy went by the wayside long ago, go read back as you did on another post you dragged up and you will be enlightened.



G

Mr. Bidwell: Please offer us your criteria for being a christian. I think this discussion should start with a definition of shat we are talking about instead of a bunch of smoke and mirrors from your side. I you have one to share

Gryphyn,

When you accuse Bidright by saying, "You have taken information/facts spoken by leaders of the church yet you did not list it in its entire piece, why would you do this? Are you a reporter that takes phrases out of context? Without posting what these leaders said in its entire form you are doing just that. You have clipped out these portions to try and justify your claims. " how is that different than what Mormon's do when taking Biblical scripture out of context to justify their man-made doctrine?

As a former Mormon with 21 years of intense indoctrination under my belt, involvement in temple rituals, and a deep understanding of all that the Mormon Church is, I know that Bidright's comments are valid. In my desire to build a relationship with Jesus Christ, based on biblical teachings and not man-made doctrine, I am finally free of the oppressive doctrine of the church and assured of eternal salvation. I too know many Mormons, and still have family that are members, but being a good person is not enough to get you into heaven. The key to that can only be found in the Bible!

christians are stricly a bible teaching church no more no less they belive in the cross mormons dont ever show the cross dont wear a cross mormans change the bible states that paul was the last profit in luke after him there are no more the mormon church teaches that its the true truch the bible says if you bring jesus christ into your life that you believe he died for your sins youy hvae a personal relationship with him you confess your sins to him you will be saved mormonism is a made up mam made religon christ isnt the leaders of the mormon church made alot of money on the scare tactic if i leave my church and go to another oh well my choice they dont sacre me and tell me i am going into the lake of fire

Hi JSH,

I'm guilty of not reading this thread in detail. Basically I'm taking a brain break, and decide to come over. I saw the title and clicked on.

I don't know where anyone stands on Mormons, and I'm not sure I care. I do want to say though that 3 months ago I had a chance to pray with Mormon leaders. It was a blast. It was so different from hanging out with some of the older school Mormons. These guys had none of the preachy stereotypical traits that I use to run into all the time. They were telling me that there are major changes that have happened inside their church over the last few years.

It doesn't matter to me what someone calls them-self, it's just cool to be around spiritual people. BTW, all of the guys finished their prayers the same way. "In the name of our lord Jesus Christ". They did tell me one other interesting thing that kinda took me back. These Mormons told me that they didn't follow all the teachings of J. Smith, but do believe in modern day prophets.

Nice guys!

I like loving a God of love, I guess that would be the name of my church. I wonder if God goes to church?

peace,

michael

Well said, Michael. You have the heart of a poet. I can see why you and Bonny are meant for each other.

Hugs, M