One impression of Jesus that we so often carry around in our heads was that he was immaculate in: thought, word, and deed.

i.e. "Oh God, we confess that we have sinned against thee in thought, word, and deed, provoking must justly thy wrath and indignation against us."
a sinner's prayer of repentance. I thought Jesus took God's wrath against us in his own body on a tree/cross?
sounds like God is ready to beat us with a big stick don't it?

Jesus', earthy, worldly, 12 Disciples, must have recited that confession 12 times a day to him. Don't you think? Or perhaps 70 times 7? I'm being facetious.

Because of the way that the Bible has been written, you could even get the impression that the 12 Disciples were immaculate. You don't exactly read any locker room talk going on amongst them. If we were really honest with ourselves, many of us would have to admit that unconsciously, we think Jesus led his 12 Disciples around like a:
12 man, ball and chain gang, and that Jesus was the whip master keeping them in line.

When I was in U.S. Coast Guard Basic Training, Cape May, NJ, my Company marched together in formation wherever we went on the training center campus. If anyone of us had a wandering eye in the process, we heard snapped at us, "EYES IN THE BOAT !!" which meant keep your eyes looking straight ahead. Can you imagine Jesus, out in front, walking backwards to keep an eye on them, marching his 12 Disciples to the Cana wedding, their eyes focused straight ahead, when all of a sudden a pretty girl walks by (married or single they know not) and all heads and eyes turn her direction? Thoughts even go through their minds (and Jesus could read their thoughts).

OH MY GOD!! Would Jesus have come UNGLUED, or what ??
Wouldn't He have popped a major vein in his neck?: facetious again

EYES IN THE BOAT, PHILLIP!! DROP AND GIVE ME 50, THOMAS !!

PETER, SO HELP ME, IF I EVER CATCH YOU LOOKING AT, OR EVEN THINKING ABOUT A WOMAN THAT WAY AGAIN... I'LL... I'LL.. WELL, I JUST WILL !!

Let's Be Real Shall We: Jesus lived in close proximity to his 12 Disciples for years during his earthly ministry. What they did together was probably not that much different than, and just as gross or more gross than, any National Football League Team of males does in the locker room, or off site together - and they have the Media to worry about.

Jesus and His 12 Disciples likely:

Ate together, cooked together, shopped for clothes and groceries together, drank alcohol together, smoked together, washed clothes together, bathed naked together, popped each other's ***** with towels, chewed tabacco together, spit together, changed clothes together, scratched their ***** together, laughed together, pissed together, **** together, wiped their ***** together, belched, farted, and laughed together, bleed, oosed puss, coughed, vomitted, spit, salivated, drooled, hocked lugies, laughed, and picked their noses together, rubbed out the eye gunk each morning, cried together, perspired and stank to high heaven together, perhaps even masturbated together, or even went to see prositutues together, or maybe just had regular girls over for the night (or at least the evening) to play around with together.

Yet very, very, VERY, few of these events are actually recorded in the Bible.
And just because they are not recorded in the Bible, does that mean we can build a theology around this that says that because these things are not recorded in the Bible, they didn't happen? That, somehow, because Jesus was God, that he must have prayed over his Disciples that they (and Himself) be immune from all these unholy, gross facets of human existence, so that they, and Jesus could put their best foot forward and make a good impression for those compiling the Bible for later print?

Many people think of Jesus as being 50% God and 50% human (just the best parts) instead of 100% God and 100% human (including the worst parts).

How can that be though? That's 200%. The answer is that this is an unsolved mystery never to be uncovered in our lifetimes. Just like: How can God be 100% Father, 100% Son, and 100% Holy Spirit? That's 300% God. Perhaps I should have said, Jesus is 300% God, and 100% human? Phillip asked Jesus, "Show us the Father. That is all we need". Jesus said to Phillip in reply, "I have been with you all of this time Phillip, how is it that you ask to see the Father? Believe me when I say that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me. If you have seen me, you have seen the Father." That's 200%. Jesus was conceived by the Holy Ghost. That's 300%.

We have a single verse in the Bible, the shortest one for that matter, which says that, "Jesus wept". Ok, ok, and there is the one also where he spits in his hand, mixes it with dirt to make mud, and rubs it in a blind man's eyes (Jesus, you are soooo gross dude! ), and the one where he sweats drops of blood resisting sin, and of course blood and water pour out his side at his crucifixion when his side is pierced by a Roman soldier's spear.

But does that mean that's all there was to Jesus' bodily excretions?
Could we build a theology around that?

like the Catholic Bishops have built their theology against Premarital Sex around the 6th Commandment and Jesus' commentary on it:

(Do not commit adultery) and Jesus' continued statement regarding the same (But I say to you that whoever even looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart).

Have you ever seen one of those funky pictures that has two ways of looking at it?
For example: there is a picture of an ugly old hag woman that appears obvious, but when you look at it further, perhaps not so intently, but more casually, perhaps leaving and coming back later to look at it again, you then see a picture of a beautiful young woman.

Could the same be true of the Bible verses that the Catholic Bishops have built their anti-Premarital Sex theology on? Perhaps they just see the Ugly Old Hag?

What if what Jesus was really saying was something beautiful like this:
That yes, there was a commandment which said, don't commit adultery (i.e. don't sleep with another man's wife, honor the marriage bed), this you know. But what you don't know is this:

The BAD NEWS, that in order to fullfill God's righteous requirements of that law, you would have to do more than just that. You would have to not even look at a woman or even think of a woman lustfully to keep from breaking that law. The Pharisees think they are going to Heaven because they haven't slept with another man's wife, or broken any other commandment, but the fact is, they, and everyone else in this world, are going to HELL because no one has kept any of the commandments. Not even one!

The GOOD NEWS, then, which I am hear to tell everyone, is that, although you all are not capable of keeping this commandment yourselves, or any commandment for that matter, I have lived a sinless life myself, keeping all the righteous requirements of God's laws, down to the most specific of details, and I am going to die at the hands of evil men, and shed my blood for the whole world's sake, so that God's righteous requirements are fullfilled on everyone's behalf. I do all the suffering, everyone else just believes in their hearts that I was sent from God to save them out of God's own love and mercy alone. You cannot save yourselves. If you believe these things, each of you will go to Heaven for eternity. Or, you can choose (we all have that freedom of choice) to reject ME and try to get to Heaven by keeping God's Laws yourself down to the most minute detail (not even published anywhere in minute detail I might add), which again I tell you, you are incapable of doing.

-- END --

My friend, you are at the point in your life where you need to read

http://www.gracegospel.eu/grace-books/StamI01.pdf

It will address all of your questions.

If u wana know .. Watch the videos of ahmed deedat... U will b 100% satisfied..

Lordy lordy....
*taking a deep breath*

That was quite an earful! I read it through, and I understand the gist of what you were saying...*I think*

In my viewpoint Jesus was 100% human. That was the whole point my friend...
Adam was created a perfect human and he sinned. So Jesus had to live as a human, to prove that as a human, he could remain faithful to his God.
Also, through Adam sin entered the world...so then through Jesus we have everlasting life.

God's perfect sense of justice and wisdom could not have come up with a more perfect answer to Adam's failure.

Jesus was a perfect high priest for us in that he experienced everything we experience. He was not a squeaky clean human being that did not experience/exhibit all the gross facets of humanity that we ourselves exhibit. And the 12 Disciples. They were human too like the rest of us, with desires just like the rest of us. Both Jesus and the Disciples picked their noses, belched, farted, poped each other in the butt with towels, oozed puss, sneezed, peed, did nbr 2, adjusted their privates, had smelly feet, smelly pits, etc. etc. but this is not recorded in the Bible, but that does not mean they didn't. And so we can't assume that some type of sexual activity did not also occur during the years Jesus and his disciples lived in close proximity with one another. And we know women followed along with the 12 and Jesus and looked after their daily needs. One was even a prostitute. They were men just like the rest of us men with natural desires.

Jesus is God's Son. God came in the flesh through Jesus.


For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: these three agree in one. (I John 5:7,8) kjv


He that hath the Son hath life: and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. (I John 5:12) kjv

First off, you have to ask yourself, "What is a human?". Does the scriptures say anything about God creating any "humans"? No it does not in fact EVER use the terminology "human".

Jesus was 100% God.

I agree.

I don't believe any living thing can be tallied up in neat little percentages

for me, Jesus was the spirit of God in the flesh,, just as my daughter is a version of my physical dna in the flesh,,,

Well, I think's it unfair to compare Jesus Christ to God the Father, as they are two separate entities.

Was Jesus 50% human? absolutely; if not more than 50%. Jesus was just like you and me, bud. His life has been chronicled throughout history to give us an example on how to walk in his footsteps.

I believe I'm kinda on the same page as toodygirl, in that Jesus is the "Son" and completely dissimilar from God himself.

This is when we get into "fine lining" stuff.

Jesus is OUR God.

Don't know if Jesus' Father's name was originally included in the original scriptures. But in the english version(s) which most to all of us having these discussions reads, it only says God and not his name.

But nevertheless Jesus is 100% our God. "God" is not the name of a species. It is a word used to show their authority over us. It is used to keep them higher then us and not make them "one of us".

That is why the scriptures always say "Jesus is OUR God".

And is why there is no contradiction when it says "Know ye not that ye are Gods" And "There is only one God, and the devils tremble".

There is only one God, that is God the father. But the father has allowed for us to have dominion over the beasts of this world, or other words, he has given us "authority" over them. Thus now making us Gods.

Since the english translation is just that, a translation. It is important to keep grammar in context. When it refers to the father it says "God" and when it refers to us it says "god(s)".

It's at this point in religious debates that I get myself into a whole lot of trouble....*deep breath* here we go...

"God" is not a name....a god is a god...there's thousands and thousands of different kinds of gods.
These days OUR God doesn't have a name because of the belief by the Hebrews that to utter His name is to sin. So for a while He was "He who shall remain nameless" or "Most High", or "Soverign Lord", et...etc....
Was Jesus himself A god? Mayhap. Was he THE GOD? No, absolutely not. If he was, then do you mean to tell me that he prayed to himself the many times he prayed to the Father?
Did he not repeatedley, time, and time again, point all praise and worship to his Father in Heaven...THE GOD????
Should we pray TO Jesus? No, absolutely not. All praise and honor go to THE GOD. We have been instructed to pray THROUGH Jesus, and IN HIS NAME...but never, ever to him. Because Jesus is not THE GOD...he is perhaps A god...but not THE GOD.
He came to us in flesh...born of a fleshly woman. Jesus was a man while on earth, for the reason I explained in my earlier post.

okay...go ahead and beat me up.

Interesting.

The exclusion of the Father's name does offer a valid point of view. I suppose Jesus could have been sent (and even appointed by the Father) to be the God of the human world. Afterall, we humans do tend to assimilate our own likes to those of Jesus Christ, who happens to be easily relatable.

His burdens have become our burdens.

Thanks for offering that point of view, bud.

huh... and didn't "god" say don't put any other gods before him?... sounds like your breaking a "god law" here...

But when they're all part of the same Trinity (the head of three), how is that putting a god before God the Father....

You put your take on it so eloquently.

i'm not trying to put anyone's faith down here, but it is all man-made stories designed to appease/control the masses... they did a good trying to tie up the loose ends, but dividing god into 3 parts makes no sense...

Right, and that's why religion isn't a mandated part of life.

that's a recent development... Texas in the 80's was controlled by the southern baptist, the blue laws had everything closed on Sundays... the SB still has a lot of pull, but nowhere near what it was...

Perhaps that's geographical? You can't tell me all of our country was like that then.

If you lived in Texas in the 80's (sorry if you did) why didn't you move? Just a thought, bud.