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| Topic: Will There Be a New Communist America? | |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Wed 12/05/12 10:42 AM
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) |
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) I have a bridge in Brooklyn you can buy cheap |
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) I have a bridge in Brooklyn you can buy cheap I doubt purchasing the bridge would make as much sense as paying for access to the public community resources,,,, |
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) Well said, msharmony. 
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one. |
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one. not really in an existential sense, of course we 'own' nothing as everything is tied to something else but in a LEGAL sense,, what we have the possession of and legal rights to,,, we OWN... |
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That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one.
Still trying to make an unfalsifiable argument, eh? |
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That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one.
Still trying to make an unfalsifiable argument, eh? There is no need to to make the argument into a personal attack dodo. http://www.petesisco.com/you-dont-own-your-home-and-never-will/ "I’m not talking about the bank holding the mortgage on your home. Even if you think you own your home free and clear, you really don’t own it at all. You lease it from the government and it sets the terms and conditions that allow you to occupy the house or sell it to another lessee. The government owns the house and land in perpetuity and you can not alter this arrangement. My dad never made it the twenty five years. By the time my mom paid off the mortgage the monthly property tax bill was $450 per month! There is no way to pay that off once and for all and, in fact, it is subject to constant increase by political whim. Eventually the money paid in relentless property taxes exceeds the cost of the home. What was true for her is true for all homeowners. Moreover, the terms and conditions under which you occupy “your” home are a further burden to you. You can’t add onto the home without permission, you can’t subdivide the land without permission. You can only have certain pets and only a certain number of them. You must maintain the home to a certain standard. Violation of any rule can cause you to lose the home and be evicted for repeated non-compliance with government orders. (After all, they are the true owners.) Depending on your tax jurisdiction, when you die a large portion of your home’s value can be claimed by the government and your heirs would either have to pony up the cash or sell the home to pay the inheritance taxes. Then the government resets the clock with the new “tenant.” Throughout the long life of the home the government does not contribute a penny to the expense of the home’s upkeep or the costs of complying with the myriad of regulations concerning things like fence heights, swimming pool regulations, tree trimming, wildfire regulations and dozens of other ordinances or bylaws. Moreover, the government-granted monopoly utilities provided to the home – water, phone, gas and electricity – are further taxed at constantly increasing rates which you must pay in order to occupy the home. Claiming to be an “owner” under these unilateral and coercive terms and conditions begs the definition of the word ownership. I have briefly lived in a communist country and I can tell you there is very little practical difference in home ownership there. Oh, plus their kids didn’t have put their hand over their heart and pledge allegiance to the State every morning at school – I guess that would be too Orwellian for them." |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Wed 12/05/12 04:07 PM
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St. Pete Gov’t: You don’t REALLY own your house, you rent it from us!
http://sunbeamtimes.com/2012/08/15/st-pete-govt-you-dont-really-own-your-house-you-rent-it-from-us.aspx |
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profit and wealth are too significant a part of western culture to turn to the type of communism most fear where there is no personal ownership of anything how would our rich stay rich if we let that happen? but our system always has been and always will be changing in some small form or another and I Dont expect that to change just hope it doesnt change to one with nothing but poverty and wealth The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them. I disagree. I own my computer, I pay for the electric required to use it, and for the room in which I use it. Those are the only real resources that come along with having a computer. The electricity to run it and the room to use it in. A home, however, comes with use of the roads around it, the sidewalks, the street lights, the school system (For those with children), and any number of resources which take PUBLIC money to maintain. As part of the community that makes up the public accessing those resources, we pay a tax on the 'property' we reside in which gives us such immediate access to them. the home is still ours, that is why we are free to sale it when and if we so choose on the contrary, I do not own the road, it is shared by the community who all pitch in for it through their taxes as well as an individual , I Cant sell the road,, I Can sell the house I own (hypothetically, for all those who would chime in about my personal economic situation) That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one. not really in an existential sense, of course we 'own' nothing as everything is tied to something else but in a LEGAL sense,, what we have the possession of and legal rights to,,, we OWN... You may have to redefine ownership then. |
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That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one.
Still trying to make an unfalsifiable argument, eh? There is no need to to make the argument into a personal attack dodo. http://www.petesisco.com/you-dont-own-your-home-and-never-will/ "I’m not talking about the bank holding the mortgage on your home. Even if you think you own your home free and clear, you really don’t own it at all. You lease it from the government and it sets the terms and conditions that allow you to occupy the house or sell it to another lessee. The government owns the house and land in perpetuity and you can not alter this arrangement. My dad never made it the twenty five years. By the time my mom paid off the mortgage the monthly property tax bill was $450 per month! There is no way to pay that off once and for all and, in fact, it is subject to constant increase by political whim. Eventually the money paid in relentless property taxes exceeds the cost of the home. What was true for her is true for all homeowners. Moreover, the terms and conditions under which you occupy “your” home are a further burden to you. You can’t add onto the home without permission, you can’t subdivide the land without permission. You can only have certain pets and only a certain number of them. You must maintain the home to a certain standard. Violation of any rule can cause you to lose the home and be evicted for repeated non-compliance with government orders. (After all, they are the true owners.) Depending on your tax jurisdiction, when you die a large portion of your home’s value can be claimed by the government and your heirs would either have to pony up the cash or sell the home to pay the inheritance taxes. Then the government resets the clock with the new “tenant.” Throughout the long life of the home the government does not contribute a penny to the expense of the home’s upkeep or the costs of complying with the myriad of regulations concerning things like fence heights, swimming pool regulations, tree trimming, wildfire regulations and dozens of other ordinances or bylaws. Moreover, the government-granted monopoly utilities provided to the home – water, phone, gas and electricity – are further taxed at constantly increasing rates which you must pay in order to occupy the home. Claiming to be an “owner” under these unilateral and coercive terms and conditions begs the definition of the word ownership. I have briefly lived in a communist country and I can tell you there is very little practical difference in home ownership there. Oh, plus their kids didn’t have put their hand over their heart and pledge allegiance to the State every morning at school – I guess that would be too Orwellian for them." What personal attack? You attempted to make an unfalsifiable argument. I am addressing your argument. A deed to a house has on it the name of its owner(s). So, are there any house deeds that have the names of individuals listed as the owners of the houses? |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Wed 12/05/12 04:34 PM
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What personal attack? You attempted to make an unfalsifiable argument. I am addressing your argument.
A deed to a house has on it the name of its owner(s). So, are there any house deeds that have the names of individuals listed as the owners of the houses? No, you are not "addressing my argument." You were asking me a personal question and it was a loaded questions that assumes that I am "still trying" to make an "unfalsifiable argument. You asked: "Still trying to make an unfalsifiable argument, eh?"
eh? In order for me to even attempt to answer that question I will have to understand what you mean by it.... and even agree that I am "still trying" to do something.. Example: (Are you still beating your wife?) My first statement was: "The illusion that we own our land and our homes is just that, an illusion. If we actually owned them, we would not have to pay taxes on them." msharmony believes she can own her home. My second statement to her was: "That you still believe that you actually own your home, just proves that the illusion is a successful one." She does believe that she can own her home. Right? Thus, the illusion that she can own her home is a successful one. My evidence is that if we owned our homes, we would not be paying the government taxes on them, and having to be dictated to what we can and cannot do with our property, and the government could not take it away for "public domain" uses, or lack of payment for taxes, keeping all the extra money for themselves when they sell it etc. You do not really own it to do with it as you wish. Unless, as I said, you want to redefine the word "ownership." |
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