Community > General Religion Chat

Topic: Do you believe in Satan?
s1owhand Joined Fri 05/18/07 Posts: 29437	Sat 06/23/12 11:27 AM
He exists and turns out he is not a bad hockey player!

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:28 AM
No i don't but in the OT he is mentioned after the Babylonian exile.Matter of fact satan was one of Gods angels that did what God commanded him to do according to hebrew faith,which by the way was before christianity. Christians claim he was the talking serpant even though genesis never mentions it.The christians over time have made satan out to be what they want him to be. So depending on what you choose to believe is how you would see satan. Sounds like the "serpent" is in reference to Satan to me. Notice verse 14. Revelations 12 12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. 14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. 15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. Revelations is in the New Testament not Old Testament.The serpant doesn't mean anything because it's all mythology. Why does it matter that revelations is not from the old testament? Does that mean when it says "LORD God" in the old testament, it's speaking of a different being then when it says "LORD God" in the new testament? What exactly is your point because it's from two different testaments?

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:34 AM
No i don't but in the OT he is mentioned after the Babylonian exile.Matter of fact satan was one of Gods angels that did what God commanded him to do according to hebrew faith,which by the way was before christianity. Christians claim he was the talking serpant even though genesis never mentions it.The christians over time have made satan out to be what they want him to be. So depending on what you choose to believe is how you would see satan. Sounds like the "serpent" is in reference to Satan to me. Notice verse 14. Revelations 12 12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. 13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. 14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent. 15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood. Be ye wise as Serpents. Moses was ordered to fashion a Serpent in the Desert during the Serpent-Plague,and whoever beheld the Serpent was saved! The Serpent in Antiquity was the Symbol of Wisdom until the Religionists subverted it! Genesis 3:1 3 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? Nobody said the serpent wasn't "wisdom". The "serpent" in general isn't "evil" or anything of such. It's not a symbol of evil or anything foul. So no, "religionist" if that's what you wish to call them have subverted nothing. so what the Serpent in the Garden did was actually GOOD! Besides,I have seen Christians go on Snake-Killing Sprees for the simple reason,that the Snake,according to the,was the Impersonation of the Devil,Evil! And you try tell me the Religionists haven't subverted anything? No, what the serpent did was "evil" was against God's will. How does that make the action the serpent did "good"? And no, you have no seen "Christians" go on a killing spree of snakes. Notice the word Christian, "Christ"ian. That is someone whom obey's our Christ's commandments. And Jesus never told us to do anything to any serpents or snakes or anything of that matter. Proverbs 12:10 10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel And many more verses telling us to love the animals. Not one tells us to kill serpents or anything of that such.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:34 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:41 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me. God of war? Please give a verse where it refers to God as a God of war in an exact context you're trying to use it here eg., making God out to be a blood thirsty kind of war hungry God.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:43 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me. God of war? Please give a verse where it refers to God as a God of war in an exact context you're trying to use it here eg., making God out to be a blood thirsty kind of war hungry God. God is a righteous loving God. Yes being righteous one would occassionally "punish" someone(s). But he's not a God of war in the sense of just terrorizing someone(s).

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:47 AM Edited by Jeanniebean on Sat 06/23/12 11:48 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me. God of war? Please give a verse where it refers to God as a God of war in an exact context you're trying to use it here eg., making God out to be a blood thirsty kind of war hungry God. Are you going to restrict and confine my information to the Bible? If so you are barking up the wrong tree. It is clear that Jehovah is a God of War as he leads armies against their "enemies" and instructs his people to kill without mercy.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:49 AM
All cultures have anthropomorphized their gods into humanoid (if sometimes grotesque) form. Were the Jews the exception? Hardly. We know precisely what the Hebrew god looked like. We are, after all, fashioned in his own likeness! "Yahweh", in fact, is an abbreviation of the longer name, "Yahweh Sabaoth." It means, "He who musters armies." Thus Yahweh's name identifies the god primarily as the military leader of the tribe. No wonder the God bequeathed to the world by the Jews turned out to be a monster.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:51 AM
The most disturbing aspect of Yahweh’s humanoid personality, however, is his blood-lust. The smell of burning flesh is a ‘sweet savour unto the lord’ – so sweet, in fact, that the phrase appears in the Old Testament no fewer than twenty-three times. The butchery demanded by god is truly monumental. Believers are required to sacrifice two lambs day-by-day continuously – and that’s just for starters! Just as well Yahweh had several thousand priests to help him trough through the banquet! Livestock bears the brunt of god’s appetite but humans could so easily get the chop from the big guy. God kills Uzzah for simply steadying the tumbling Ark (1Chronicles 13.9,10). Poor Onan was zapped for using the withdrawal method of birth control (Genesis 38.10). But such isolated vindictiveness palls in comparison with the mass killings of the Lord. When the autocratic Moses faces a rebellion led by Korah, God uses an earthquake and fire to consume two hundred and fifty rebels. When indignant sympathizers protest at the injustice, God wipes out another fourteen thousand seven hundred with a plague (Numbers 16). What a guy!

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:51 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me. God of war? Please give a verse where it refers to God as a God of war in an exact context you're trying to use it here eg., making God out to be a blood thirsty kind of war hungry God. Are you going to restrict and confine my information to the Bible? If so you are barking up the wrong tree. It is clear that Jehovah is a God of War as he leads armies against their "enemies" and instructs his people to kill without mercy. You're speaking of a specific belief in God. So with speaking of that specific belief, you would need to use the thing that knowledge comes from, in this case the scriptures of the bible. And yes God has instructed people to do as such. But again, it was a judgement on someone(s). This knowledge you are speaking of came from the old testament. In the times of the old testament, we were under the old covenant that is now finished with. But in the old covenant the judgement was carried out by our peers. So therefor, yes God did tell someone(s) to carry out something according to his judgement.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:51 AM
Yahweh is Satan himself.

Ladylid2012 Joined Sun 07/05/09 Posts: 42269	Sat 06/23/12 11:54 AM
Cowboy, are you saying that the God of war Jehohvah is the same "Lord God" (Jesus) in the New Testament? They don't seem like the same god to me. God of war? Please give a verse where it refers to God as a God of war in an exact context you're trying to use it here eg., making God out to be a blood thirsty kind of war hungry God. What most humans consider god(s) obviously is of war.... look at our world. Smite your enemies and eye for an eye punishment fear judgment These are not terms used for the purpose of promoting love and peace.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:54 AM
All cultures have anthropomorphized their gods into humanoid (if sometimes grotesque) form. Were the Jews the exception? Hardly. We know precisely what the Hebrew god looked like. We are, after all, fashioned in his own likeness! "Yahweh", in fact, is an abbreviation of the longer name, "Yahweh Sabaoth." It means, "He who musters armies." Thus Yahweh's name identifies the god primarily as the military leader of the tribe. No wonder the God bequeathed to the world by the Jews turned out to be a monster. yahweh sabaoth - The Lord of Hosts” (1 Samuel 1:3; Jeremiah 11:20; compare 1 Samuel 17:45)

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 11:54 AM
You're speaking of a specific belief in God. So with speaking of that specific belief, you would need to use the thing that knowledge comes from, in this case the scriptures of the bible. No, I'm speaking of the myth of Yahweh and Jehovah. If they were real, then I'm speaking of the beings themselves who waged war, and were mentioned in the Bible. My question is, are they really Gods? Or are they fallen angels or demons from the sky, or aliens?

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:56 AM
The most disturbing aspect of Yahweh’s humanoid personality, however, is his blood-lust. The smell of burning flesh is a ‘sweet savour unto the lord’ – so sweet, in fact, that the phrase appears in the Old Testament no fewer than twenty-three times. The butchery demanded by god is truly monumental. Believers are required to sacrifice two lambs day-by-day continuously – and that’s just for starters! Just as well Yahweh had several thousand priests to help him trough through the banquet! Livestock bears the brunt of god’s appetite but humans could so easily get the chop from the big guy. God kills Uzzah for simply steadying the tumbling Ark (1Chronicles 13.9,10). Poor Onan was zapped for using the withdrawal method of birth control (Genesis 38.10). But such isolated vindictiveness palls in comparison with the mass killings of the Lord. When the autocratic Moses faces a rebellion led by Korah, God uses an earthquake and fire to consume two hundred and fifty rebels. When indignant sympathizers protest at the injustice, God wipes out another fourteen thousand seven hundred with a plague (Numbers 16). What a guy! It is because especially in those days where you didn't have a local wallmart to go to, food was more scarce, you had to work for your food. Thus it was more valuable in that sense then, compared to how it is now. Thus, why the sacrifice was sweet to the LORD God, it was giving up something that was important and wasn't very convenient to have.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 11:59 AM
You're speaking of a specific belief in God. So with speaking of that specific belief, you would need to use the thing that knowledge comes from, in this case the scriptures of the bible. No, I'm speaking of the myth of Yahweh and Jehovah. If they were real, then I'm speaking of the beings themselves who waged war, and were mentioned in the Bible. My question is, are they really Gods? Or are they fallen angels or demons from the sky, or aliens? Again, any instruction of a "war" or taking of a land, is taken from the old testament. And again in the old testament times, we were under the old covenant. In the old covenant, the judgement was carried out by the people of this world, until Jesus in the flesh came into the picture. Where after the Word was made flesh and could carry out the judgement on his own. They were not just cold blooded murdering wars, they were once again a judgement put on a land of people.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 12:16 PM
You're speaking of a specific belief in God. So with speaking of that specific belief, you would need to use the thing that knowledge comes from, in this case the scriptures of the bible. No, I'm speaking of the myth of Yahweh and Jehovah. If they were real, then I'm speaking of the beings themselves who waged war, and were mentioned in the Bible. My question is, are they really Gods? Or are they fallen angels or demons from the sky, or aliens? Again, any instruction of a "war" or taking of a land, is taken from the old testament. And again in the old testament times, we were under the old covenant. In the old covenant, the judgement was carried out by the people of this world, until Jesus in the flesh came into the picture. Where after the Word was made flesh and could carry out the judgement on his own. They were not just cold blooded murdering wars, they were once again a judgement put on a land of people. None of that makes any logical sense. I believe that these entities you call Jehovah, Yahweh, Allah, Satan, Lucifer may have all been "fallen angels" and they just pretended to be "gods." I don't believe the stories in the plagiarized rewritten Bible as being the word of God, so your logic is lost on me.

CowboyGH Joined Mon 10/05/09 Posts: 13651	Sat 06/23/12 12:24 PM Edited by CowboyGH on Sat 06/23/12 12:27 PM
You're speaking of a specific belief in God. So with speaking of that specific belief, you would need to use the thing that knowledge comes from, in this case the scriptures of the bible. No, I'm speaking of the myth of Yahweh and Jehovah. If they were real, then I'm speaking of the beings themselves who waged war, and were mentioned in the Bible. My question is, are they really Gods? Or are they fallen angels or demons from the sky, or aliens? Again, any instruction of a "war" or taking of a land, is taken from the old testament. And again in the old testament times, we were under the old covenant. In the old covenant, the judgement was carried out by the people of this world, until Jesus in the flesh came into the picture. Where after the Word was made flesh and could carry out the judgement on his own. They were not just cold blooded murdering wars, they were once again a judgement put on a land of people. None of that makes any logical sense. I believe that these entities you call Jehovah, Yahweh, Allah, Satan, Lucifer may have all been "fallen angels" and they just pretended to be "gods." I don't believe the stories in the plagiarized rewritten Bible as being the word of God, so your logic is lost on me. rewritten bible? How is the logic lost? What doesn't seem logical? And if you believe they "all" are fallen angels, where do you get your information of such? And how can someone/something "pretend" to be "God". A "god" is not a species, or a type of being in that exact sense. God isn't able to do what he does, just because he is a "God". He is "God" because of what he has and can do. "God" means being of authority. Thus, why it is said "know ye not, that ye are Gods", "I have said ye are Gods and children of the most high" and "Even the devils know there is one God, and tremble", but this is not a contradiction to one another. We are "gods" because OUR God has given us dominion over the beasts of this world. Thus with us having dominion/power over them, we are made their gods. But yet there is but one God above us, thus "There is but one God". For God is God over all.

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 12:32 PM
"God" means being of authority. To most people and to most religions who claim to worship God, this is not true. The God they worship is "the creator." A "being of authority" could be the president or the Pope. They are not "God." Therefore, the common definition of "God" is "the Creator"

Jeanniebean Joined Wed 01/30/08 Posts: 40028	Sat 06/23/12 12:34 PM
But yet there is but one God above us, thus "There is but one God". For God is God over all. That belief would completely depend what you perceive "God" to be.