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| Topic: God is not the boss of me. | |
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I am ultimately agnostic as is everyone whether they confess this truth or not.
When it comes to placing 'faith' in a God this is an extremely simple thing for me. We define the very concept of "God" as being something that if far greater than any mortal being can possible be. We attribute to this concept of "God" the notion that this God is far more righteous, far more compassionate, far wiser, and far more loving than any mortal being can imagine. Therefore, if such a "God" exist, it must necessarily be far more righteous, compassionate, wiser, and loving than myself since I am a mere mortal man. If that is true then I have absolutely nothing to fear from such a "God". For this God to harm me in any way would be totally unrighteous, uncaring, ignorant, and unloving. All of which defy our very notion of what a "God" should be. In fact, if a spiritual entity is that evil when call it a "Devil", not a "God". So the only kind of spiritual entity I would need to fear would be a "Devil", I have no reason to fear any "God" at all. So when it comes to "God" I have complete 100% faith that any God that actually exists will be wonderful and nice to me. At least as nice as I am or more so. The only thing I would have to fear is if Cowboy is right and we were all created by his Devil of Abraham, and we are nothing more than the helpless pets of this hideous demon. But if that is the true state of affairs, then it doesn't matter whether we worship the demon or spit in its face. We would be doomed to suffer its unrighteousness in either case. There would never be any free will at all. You'd be damned if you do and damned if you don't. There would be no escape from such a hideous demon and there would never exist any righteousness for anyone. |
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No one has told me anything ahead of time. All I see are extremely confused superstitious people worshiping ancient rumors that proclaim that our creator is a male-chauvinistic pig who curses women with painful childbirth as a form of punishment for what one particular woman had supposedly done. ohwell Cowboy wrote: Oh but you have been told, a good source is a thing people call the bible. It's got lots of pages with knowledge on it. It is you that wishes to discard this knowledge, it is you that wishes to brush it off as it's fiction. You have been told, you're just refusing to listen and or hear what is being said. Again, not trying to change your views, only pointing out that you have been told when you said you have not been. No Cowboy, you totally miss the point. This isn't about me. This is about how evil and unrighteous the Biblical God would necessary have to be if the bible were indeed true. Was Eve told ahead of time that her actions would be used as an excuse for God to curse billions of women for thousands of years? No she wasn't. Therefore these fables portray a totally unreasonable and unrighteous God. And even if God had explained this to Eve in advance, that still wouldn't justify his cursing of billions of other women who had nothing to do with Eve's choices. In fact, this thread is about FREE WILL is it not? Well, the fact that these fable have their sick demented God cursing billions of women for something that they didn't even personally do would already be a total violation of their personal FREE WILL. They are being punished for something they didn't even do. These stories that you refer to as a "Good Source" are not "good" at all. They are totally sick and demented fables. It is unfortunate that you have been misguided into believing that these perverted fables represent "righteousness". People like you are extremely scary. People like you are the type of people who would write something like that Malleus Maleficarum to justify torturing and burning women alive on stakes as 'witches' in Jesus' name simply because you have been convinced by fables that it is the 'righteous' thing to do. People like you are are the type of people who could start a holy war in the name of Christ as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and easily murder all the lowly "heathens" who deny the Lord. Simply because you believe that these sick demented fables are a righteous reason to murder people. The people have failed to live up to the Will of the God in these fables, and therefore they have failed to pass the judgment of God according to you. So these fables have you believing that their condemnation if "righteous". People like you are the type of people who could create a holocaust murdering those who deny Christ like Hitler did, and proclaim that this is clearly the Will of God and is totally righteous in God's eyes, because these sick demented fables suggest this. People like you are the type of people who might fly planes into buildings killing thousands of people proclaiming that the entire nation those people belong to is a heathen nation of infidels and therefore destroying them is the righteous thing to do. As soon as you start justifying all the hideous behaviors that is attributed to the biblical God as being 'righteous behaviors', then you yourself become an extremely dangerous person. Who knows what activities you might condone or participate in in the name of 'righteousness' simply because the biblical fables have convinced you that some sick demented God condones these kinds of hideous behaviors in the name of "righteousness". ~~~~~~ This is precisely what I mean about how dangerous these fables are. You are arguing that all these hideous unjustifiable acts are indeed justified as being "righteous" simply because they are in these sick demented fables that you have been convinced is an example of the behavior of "God". No. They are not condoned by any "God". You need to get that out of your head right away. These fables represent the sick demented totally unrighteous superstitions, bigotries, and male-chauvinism of sick mortal men. These fables are the produce of a sick society. They are not the 'righteous' behavior of any God. ~~~~~ This isn't about me Cowboy. It's about a collection of sick demented unrighteous fables that are being held up as the WILL of God. 
Was Eve told ahead of time that her actions would be used as an excuse for God to curse billions of women for thousands of years? Is irrelevant. I know not if he told her or not, doesn't matter though. It is still mute and irrelevant. God does not have to tell us what our punishment may or may not be for doing or not doing certain actions. He is not obligated to do anything. All he has to do is tell us not to, or tell us to do depending on the matter at hand. What the punishment might be if one is disobedient is irrelevant. No she wasn't. Therefore these fables portray a totally unreasonable and unrighteous God. And even if God had explained this to Eve in advance, that still wouldn't justify his cursing of billions of other women who had nothing to do with Eve's choices. Sure it does. We are punished as a whole, not a single part. So what you're saying is when Adam and Eve ate of the fruit, only they should have been kicked out and God should have created more inside of the paradise called The Garden of Eden. No, the human race was kicked out of the garden. And outside of the Garden women have the pain of labour. God offers a way back into the paradise if one wishes to accept it. But this time it is earned through our obedience to show we are not disobedient as they were and that we do deserve to live in the paradise. Well, the fact that these fable have their sick demented God cursing billions of women for something that they didn't even personally do would already be a total violation of their personal FREE WILL. And how would that be a violation of their free will? Again, all free will is, is the ability to choose to do an action or choose not to. Has nothing to do with any punishment or anything of such. Just purely gives us a choice. People like you are are the type of people who could start a holy war in the name of Christ as the King of Kings and Lord of Lords, and easily murder all the lowly "heathens" who deny the Lord. Simply because you believe that these sick demented fables are a righteous reason to murder people. The people have failed to live up to the Will of the God in these fables, and therefore they have failed to pass the judgment of God according to you. So these fables have you believing that their condemnation if "righteous". Passing false judgements now? First off, there is no such thing as a "holy" war. We are to turn the other cheek, so how would we "start" a war by turning the other cheek? And secondly no one would murder anyone, for that is even one of the simple 10 commandments. Doesn't say thou shalt not kill ..... unless... No, tells us not to kill. |
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So what you're saying is when Adam and Eve ate of the fruit, only they should have been kicked out and God should have created more inside of the paradise called The Garden of Eden. Absolutely. That would have been the only righteous way to handle the situation. Things like this is how we know that these fables are false. And how would that be a violation of their free will? Again, all free will is, is the ability to choose to do an action or choose not to. Has nothing to do with any punishment or anything of such. Just purely gives us a choice. No you're wrong. The biblical fables constantly speak in terms of punishments, and they also speak in terms of condemnation and everlasting punishment for those who do not obey. So its not merely a "choice" of whether or not you wish to receive a so called 'gift'. If you refuse to accept the gift you will be severely punished. That's demonic Cowboy, there is nothing righteous about it. It's a sick demented perversion of the very ideal of righteousness. Passing false judgements now? First off, there is no such thing as a "holy" war. We are to turn the other cheek, so how would we "start" a war by turning the other cheek? And secondly no one would murder anyone, for that is even one of the simple 10 commandments. Doesn't say thou shalt not kill ..... unless... No, tells us not to kill. The Christian Crusaders and Witch Burners had no problem declaring war on witches and heathens and killing them in God's name. Turning the other cheek is clearly only very small part of these doctrines. Jesus also taught that not one jot nor one tittle shall pass from law. And it was indeed God's law that heathens should be killed. So obviously if Jesus taught people to turn the other cheek he was speaking about "Brotherly Love" among those who already believe in God. That would not apply to heathens. You have already been commanded by God to kill heathen and not one jot nor one tittle shall pass from law until heaven and earth pass away. Those are the instructions of Jesus Cowboy, so grab your sword and get out there and start lopping off the heads of heathens. It's your duty to God to seek them out and kill them. Jesus is no excuse to disobey that directive. You will be proclaimed to be a sinner on judgment day if you don't do as you are instructed to do. Jesus said, not one jot not one tittle shall pass from law. So don't be using Jesus as an excuse to be a sinner. |
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So what you're saying is when Adam and Eve ate of the fruit, only they should have been kicked out and God should have created more inside of the paradise called The Garden of Eden. Absolutely. That would have been the only righteous way to handle the situation. Things like this is how we know that these fables are false. And how would that be a violation of their free will? Again, all free will is, is the ability to choose to do an action or choose not to. Has nothing to do with any punishment or anything of such. Just purely gives us a choice. No you're wrong. The biblical fables constantly speak in terms of punishments, and they also speak in terms of condemnation and everlasting punishment for those who do not obey. So its not merely a "choice" of whether or not you wish to receive a so called 'gift'. If you refuse to accept the gift you will be severely punished. That's demonic Cowboy, there is nothing righteous about it. It's a sick demented perversion of the very ideal of righteousness. Passing false judgements now? First off, there is no such thing as a "holy" war. We are to turn the other cheek, so how would we "start" a war by turning the other cheek? And secondly no one would murder anyone, for that is even one of the simple 10 commandments. Doesn't say thou shalt not kill ..... unless... No, tells us not to kill. The Christian Crusaders and Witch Burners had no problem declaring war on witches and heathens and killing them in God's name. Turning the other cheek is clearly only very small part of these doctrines. Jesus also taught that not one jot nor one tittle shall pass from law. And it was indeed God's law that heathens should be killed. So obviously if Jesus taught people to turn the other cheek he was speaking about "Brotherly Love" among those who already believe in God. That would not apply to heathens. You have already been commanded by God to kill heathen and not one jot nor one tittle shall pass from law until heaven and earth pass away. Those are the instructions of Jesus Cowboy, so grab your sword and get out there and start lopping off the heads of heathens. It's your duty to God to seek them out and kill them. Jesus is no excuse to disobey that directive. You will be proclaimed to be a sinner on judgment day if you don't do as you are instructed to do. Jesus said, not one jot not one tittle shall pass from law. So don't be using Jesus as an excuse to be a sinner. Absolutely. That would have been the only righteous way to handle the situation. Things like this is how we know that these fables are false. And in doing this we would never had moved forward. We would have continued to create in the Garden, then kick them out, then create in the Garden, then kick them out, ect ect. Would have gotten us no where. No you're wrong. The biblical fables constantly speak in terms of punishments, and they also speak in terms of condemnation and everlasting punishment for those who do not obey. How am I wrong? You replied to my statement on what free will is with this. All free will is, is the ability to choose what action you take. You choose to eat or not, you choose to steal or not, you choose to love another or not, you choose to hate or not, ect ect. That is all free will is. Free will in itself has absolutely nothing to do with a punishment or a gift, again, all free will is, is a choice. So its not merely a "choice" of whether or not you wish to receive a so called 'gift'. If you refuse to accept the gift you will be severely punished Your statement makes no sense, and is a contradiction in itself. First you say it's not a choice weather you wish to receive the gift or not, then you directly state if you REFUSE. A refusal is a choice, it is an action, it is a decision, it is what we will be judged on. We are judged on our actions/decisions and our faith. And no one will not be severely punished for simple not receiving the gift, people will be punished for disobedience, and with this disobedience they will not receive the gift. You're really funny Abra :), I like yah. The Christian Crusaders and Witch Burners had no problem declaring war on witches and heathens and killing them in God's name. Turning the other cheek is clearly only very small part of these doctrines. Both of these went directly against the laws God has given us, so you figure it out lol. These people's actions don't represent Christianity in anyway. They may have claimed to be, but by no means were their actions in line with the Christian belief. You know the saying "Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's gotta be a duck"? Well the Crusades and witch burnings and all that were not people walking like a Christian. By no means does Jesus allow for these actions nor does he tell us to do them. |
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The way Christians look at "free will" is this.
You only have two choices. Obey God and accept Jesus or not. That's it. News flash! Having only two choices is NOT free will. What happens if you do not obey God and accept Jesus? You will either die, or go to hell or both depending on who you believe. It reminds me of a man who took a loaded gun to his wife's head and demanded that she love him or else. She had two choices. If she chose to love him and marry him he would take care of her forever, if not, he would shoot her in the head. She had the same kind of "free will" that Christians say we do. That is their idea of "Free will." Obey God, accept Jesus and all that goes with that... or not. Free will my ssa. |
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The way Christians look at "free will" is this. You only have two choices. Obey God and accept Jesus or not. That's it. News flash! Having only two choices is NOT free will. What happens if you do not obey God and accept Jesus? You will either die, or go to hell or both depending on who you believe. It reminds me of a man who took a loaded gun to his wife's head and demanded that she love him or else. She had two choices. If she chose to love him and marry him he would take care of her forever, if not, he would shoot her in the head. She had the same kind of "free will" that Christians say we do. That is their idea of "Free will." Obey God, accept Jesus and all that goes with that... or not. Free will my ssa. Free will is a whole lot more then just accepting Jesus or not. Free will is that, is down to seeing a hungry homeless person and choosing to just walk away, seeing something you like laying on a table and choosing to just take it or pay for it, and or any number of possibilities. Free will is a choice you make, not only the choice to place faith in Jesus. But choices all around you in your life. We won't just be judged on if we chose to accept Jesus as our lord or not, we will be judged on every choice or other we have made in our lives. |
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The way Christians look at "free will" is this. You only have two choices. Obey God and accept Jesus or not. That's it. News flash! Having only two choices is NOT free will. What happens if you do not obey God and accept Jesus? You will either die, or go to hell or both depending on who you believe. It reminds me of a man who took a loaded gun to his wife's head and demanded that she love him or else. She had two choices. If she chose to love him and marry him he would take care of her forever, if not, he would shoot her in the head. She had the same kind of "free will" that Christians say we do. That is their idea of "Free will." Obey God, accept Jesus and all that goes with that... or not. Free will my ssa. Free will is a whole lot more then just accepting Jesus or not. Free will is that, is down to seeing a hungry homeless person and choosing to just walk away, seeing something you like laying on a table and choosing to just take it or pay for it, and or any number of possibilities. Free will is a choice you make, not only the choice to place faith in Jesus. But choices all around you in your life. We won't just be judged on if we chose to accept Jesus as our lord or not, we will be judged on every choice or other we have made in our lives. And with choice their is an outcome. We have been told the outcome of sin, the only reward for sin is death. That is what we will be judged on, our choice of actions through our lives. Wouldn't be much of a "judgement" if it was as easy as if one accepted Jesus or not. Would be more of a sentencing. |
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You got that right. You make choices every day.
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God is not the boss of me because I have free will. Any religious leader who tries to tell you how you should live your life is not the boss of you either. Free will is free will. There are not strings attached. You shouldn't do crack and become a whore. That's not trying to pull strings, it's just good advice. Just like God and many religious leaders offer. Take it or leave it, the choice is yours. |
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You got that right. You make choices every day. Yes, exactly. You having the ability to make those choices is what free will is. You're not just a robot, a puppet, a doll, or something of such. You're a breathing, self thinking being who can make choices. And those choices that you make is what we will be judged on. |
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And in doing this we would never had moved forward. We would have continued to create in the Garden, then kick them out, then create in the Garden, then kick them out, ect ect. Would have gotten us no where. What are you talking about? Given enough tries eventually God would have created an Adam as least as good as me, and an Eve as good as Mary was supposed to have been, and then he'd have the seeds for a perfect humanity. In fact, for all we know, maybe the Adam he had created was already good enough. Maybe if he would have created a Mary for him instead of a bimbo like Eve he would have gotten it right the first time. Do you think Mary would have fallen from grace? According to the story it wasn't Adam's idea to eat the forbidden fruit. In fact, it wasn't even Eve's idea. Eve herself was coerced by someone like you who preaches unrighteous filth as supposedly being righteous. Like Jeanniebean says, we have far more faith in God than you do. Given enough chances I have faith that a REAL GOD would eventually get the creation of humanity right. Although, in truth Cowboy, a REAL GOD would have gotten it right the first time. God is supposed to be perfect and incapable of failure. This is how we know that the Hebrew fables are false Cowboy. Just like we know that the Greek fables are false. How many chances does the Hebrew God need to get it right? It's a flawed story of a God from the get go. Clearly nothing more than a very poorly written fairy tale. |
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And in doing this we would never had moved forward. We would have continued to create in the Garden, then kick them out, then create in the Garden, then kick them out, ect ect. Would have gotten us no where. What are you talking about? Given enough tries eventually God would have created an Adam as least as good as me, and an Eve as good as Mary was supposed to have been, and then he'd have the seeds for a perfect humanity. In fact, for all we know, maybe the Adam he had created was already good enough. Maybe if he would have created a Mary for him instead of a bimbo like Eve he would have gotten it right the first time. Do you think Mary would have fallen from grace? According to the story it wasn't Adam's idea to eat the forbidden fruit. In fact, it wasn't even Eve's idea. Eve herself was coerced by someone like you who preaches unrighteous filth as supposedly being righteous. Like Jeanniebean says, we have far more faith in God than you do. Given enough chances I have faith that a REAL GOD would eventually get the creation of humanity right. Although, in truth Cowboy, a REAL GOD would have gotten it right the first time. God is supposed to be perfect and incapable of failure. This is how we know that the Hebrew fables are false Cowboy. Just like we know that the Greek fables are false. How many chances does the Hebrew God need to get it right? It's a flawed story of a God from the get go. Clearly nothing more than a very poorly written fairy tale. You and all your greatness is not because of how you were created. You have chosen to be so great and pure, you have chosen to be perfect in every way. The only way God could have prevented Adam and or Eve from eating of the tree was to have taken away their free will, which God does not do. Man's fall from grace is man's fault. It is his fault he disobeyed God. Not God's fault. |
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And in doing this we would never had moved forward. We would have continued to create in the Garden, then kick them out, then create in the Garden, then kick them out, ect ect. Would have gotten us no where. What are you talking about? Given enough tries eventually God would have created an Adam as least as good as me, and an Eve as good as Mary was supposed to have been, and then he'd have the seeds for a perfect humanity. In fact, for all we know, maybe the Adam he had created was already good enough. Maybe if he would have created a Mary for him instead of a bimbo like Eve he would have gotten it right the first time. Do you think Mary would have fallen from grace? According to the story it wasn't Adam's idea to eat the forbidden fruit. In fact, it wasn't even Eve's idea. Eve herself was coerced by someone like you who preaches unrighteous filth as supposedly being righteous. Like Jeanniebean says, we have far more faith in God than you do. Given enough chances I have faith that a REAL GOD would eventually get the creation of humanity right. Although, in truth Cowboy, a REAL GOD would have gotten it right the first time. God is supposed to be perfect and incapable of failure. This is how we know that the Hebrew fables are false Cowboy. Just like we know that the Greek fables are false. How many chances does the Hebrew God need to get it right? It's a flawed story of a God from the get go. Clearly nothing more than a very poorly written fairy tale. Like Jeanniebean says, we have far more faith in God than you do. Given enough chances I have faith that a REAL GOD would eventually get the creation of humanity right. Although, in truth Cowboy, a REAL GOD would have gotten it right the first time. God is supposed to be perfect and incapable of failure. God did get it right the first time lol. You keep forgetting mankind has FREEWILL, we have CHOICE. We can CHOOSE to do as we wish. Again, if God would have literally stopped them from eating of the tree, he would have been taking our free will away. If he was going to take our free will away, why put it there in the first place? It was our fault we fell from the grace of God, WE choose to sin, WE choose to be disobedient. Again, God has no control over what we do because he gave us free will. Yes, granted he can control us if he wanted to, but then what would be the point? We would be more or less just dolls in God's hands as he was playing house. And that's not what he wants. He wants us to willingly love him, he wants us to willing love others. |
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You got that right. You make choices every day. Yes, exactly. You having the ability to make those choices is what free will is. You're not just a robot, a puppet, a doll, or something of such. You're a breathing, self thinking being who can make choices. And those choices that you make is what we will be judged on. No, I will not be judged unless I get arrested and have to go to trial. 
Every choice I make will effect my life. I will pay the price for bad choices. I take full responsibility for my bad choices. We are allowed to make mistakes and we are allowed to make bad choices and we will pay the price for them. It is only the law of cause and effect that helps us to see the consequences of our actions. No one sits on some thrown passing judgement. That is myth. |
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Cowboy wrote:
You and all your greatness is not because of how you were created. You have chosen to be so great and pure, you have chosen to be perfect in every way. Yes that may very well be true, I suspect it is, but you would have this God condemn me anyway simply because I don't believe in the Hebrew Fables. So once again, your portrait of this God is flawed. And the Hebrew fables must necessarily be false. If God is going to judge people on their righteousness, and on their purity of heart, then there would be no need to have this God condemning people for not believing in Hebrew hypocrisy. Also if people are being judged based on their own choices then there would be no need to have Jesus nailed to a pole to pay for their sins. That would have nothing to do with people's personal choices. So if you want to believe in a righteous God toss out the Hebrew mythology. Jesus as a Mahayana Buddhist Bodhisattva makes far more sense. 
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Cowboy wrote:
God did get it right the first time lol. You keep forgetting mankind has FREEWILL, we have CHOICE. We can CHOOSE to do as we wish. Again, if God would have literally stopped them from eating of the tree, he would have been taking our free will away. If he was going to take our free will away, why put it there in the first place? It was our fault we fell from the grace of God, WE choose to sin, WE choose to be disobedient. Again, God has no control over what we do because he gave us free will. Yes, granted he can control us if he wanted to, but then what would be the point? We would be more or less just dolls in God's hands as he was playing house. And that's not what he wants. He wants us to willingly love him, he wants us to willing love others. According to the Hebrew Fables God did not get it right the first time. He created a defective couple. God would not have had to stop them from eating the fruit. That's not what I had suggested. I suggested that God deals with that couple for their OWN behavior and then deals with the next couple based on their OWN behavior and so on. Do you think it would be righteous if YOU were to be judged or punished for things that Hitler did, for example? Of course, that would be totally unrighteous. Well whether it's Hilter or Eve doesn't really make any difference. For you to be judged and/or punished for something someone else did is unrighteous. So the Hebrew myths are necessarily false because that the kind of scenario the portray. And that would be unrighteous which flies in the face of what God is supposed to be. |
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Cowboy wrote:
You and all your greatness is not because of how you were created. You have chosen to be so great and pure, you have chosen to be perfect in every way. Yes that may very well be true, I suspect it is, but you would have this God condemn me anyway simply because I don't believe in the Hebrew Fables. So once again, your portrait of this God is flawed. And the Hebrew fables must necessarily be false. If God is going to judge people on their righteousness, and on their purity of heart, then there would be no need to have this God condemning people for not believing in Hebrew hypocrisy. Also if people are being judged based on their own choices then there would be no need to have Jesus nailed to a pole to pay for their sins. That would have nothing to do with people's personal choices. So if you want to believe in a righteous God toss out the Hebrew mythology. Jesus as a Mahayana Buddhist Bodhisattva makes far more sense.
Yes that may very well be true, I suspect it is, but you would have this God condemn me anyway simply because I don't believe in the Hebrew Fables. James 2:14 14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? James 2:18-19 18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. 19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. James 2:22 22Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect? Takes both faith and works. Works alone can not save a man, nor can faith. |
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You got that right. You make choices every day. Yes, exactly. You having the ability to make those choices is what free will is. You're not just a robot, a puppet, a doll, or something of such. You're a breathing, self thinking being who can make choices. And those choices that you make is what we will be judged on. No, I will not be judged unless I get arrested and have to go to trial.
Every choice I make will effect my life. I will pay the price for bad choices. I take full responsibility for my bad choices. We are allowed to make mistakes and we are allowed to make bad choices and we will pay the price for them. It is only the law of cause and effect that helps us to see the consequences of our actions. No one sits on some thrown passing judgement. That is myth. Cowboy keeps arguing for an unrighteous God in order to save Hebrew mythology. It makes far more sense to just toss out Hebrew Mythology, and then we can imagine a truly righteous God without any need to make excuses for the Hebrew myths. It's the Hebrew mythology that is extremely problematic here. Not the concept of a genuine all-righteous God. Jesus as a Mahayana Buddhist Bodhisattva also makes far more sense than the idea that he was a demigod who totally disagreed with immoralities that had been taught in the Torah as the word of God. So the Hebrew myths are the problem here. Not the concept of a righteous God. It's the Hebrew myths that are totally unrighteous. |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Wed 08/10/11 10:32 PM
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it may be hard to get the bigger picture,
I can say as a parent though, that there are many risks that I would take if I didnt have children, many consequences I would be willing to take upon myself but a much harsher discipline/punishment/deterrent would be the thought of consequences falling upon my children ..its harsh, but effective in the long run to show and encourage a concern for something larger than just our own immediate consequence,,, just being shown that our actions can indeed effect someone OTHER than just ourself, even when they seem to just be our own 'business' or our own 'personal choice' |
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Cowboy wrote:
God did get it right the first time lol. You keep forgetting mankind has FREEWILL, we have CHOICE. We can CHOOSE to do as we wish. Again, if God would have literally stopped them from eating of the tree, he would have been taking our free will away. If he was going to take our free will away, why put it there in the first place? It was our fault we fell from the grace of God, WE choose to sin, WE choose to be disobedient. Again, God has no control over what we do because he gave us free will. Yes, granted he can control us if he wanted to, but then what would be the point? We would be more or less just dolls in God's hands as he was playing house. And that's not what he wants. He wants us to willingly love him, he wants us to willing love others. According to the Hebrew Fables God did not get it right the first time. He created a defective couple. God would not have had to stop them from eating the fruit. That's not what I had suggested. I suggested that God deals with that couple for their OWN behavior and then deals with the next couple based on their OWN behavior and so on. Do you think it would be righteous if YOU were to be judged or punished for things that Hitler did, for example? Of course, that would be totally unrighteous. Well whether it's Hilter or Eve doesn't really make any difference. For you to be judged and/or punished for something someone else did is unrighteous. So the Hebrew myths are necessarily false because that the kind of scenario the portray. And that would be unrighteous which flies in the face of what God is supposed to be. How was the first couple "defective"? lol. God does not do anything with you will less you ask for the guidance. They chose to eat of the tree on their own, nothing to do with God, THEY did the action, THEY chose to do that with their FREE WILL. |
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