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| Topic: Recovering from religious extremism - Religiosity | |
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Ms Harmony, I'm truly baffled by our exchange on the other page. You seem to keep repeating yourself, as if by doing so might answer my question, but you keep making statements that have nothing to do with my question. So I'd like to try another approach, just to be sure we are speaking the same language. Suppose you want to have some biscuits made. Bob lives on a farm, has a cow, a field of unharvested grain, and a wood stove. Jim has a canister of pre-made biscuits that you throw in the oven. Obviously, both of them can make biscuits, but that has nothing to do with the complexity or difficulty in doing so. Do you think that these two people can make your biscuits with equal ease? LOLOLOLOL, I was thinking it was just me that sees that. And as for the cowboy, if you are trying to reach some people (who are all doped up on Jesus juice) with simple logic you'd get more out of a turnip. Some people ya just have to leave behind...they have NO mind of their own. If avatars had to be factual: 
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Here is the long and the short of it. THe absence of some information in the bible is not proof it never existed. Noone can PROOVE or DISPROVE that the disciples wrote about Jesus while he was alive, although if they were truly following him I wouldnt think that they would unless he had instructed it. Being that I dont know EVERYTHING he instructed of them, I really dont find the significance of whether they wrote of his actions ON THE DAY, a day after or a year after. I can tell my son about how I met his father, my mom can tell me the same,, these are significant events that took place DECADES AGO BUT I dont doubt the memory would be accurate,, especially if such memory were guided by The Lord himself which is the idea of the whole bible.
As to the 'EASE' of turning people extreme vs the EASE of baking a cake,, although the former is much more complex than the latter, I will humor the analogy. My answer is YES, both could have the same ease or difficulty making those biscuits. The one with the box may do it quicker, but that does not equate to it being easier,,to me. |
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yes the "bible" was written after Jesus. That is because the bible is combined of many documents that was wrote while he was here. That's why acts, revolations, john, and so on aren't called chapters, they are called the books of acts, the books of revolations, ect. And all these were written while he was here on earth. This is the statement under consideration, right? AFAIK, there is no physical evidence that any of this was written during Jesus' life. If any notes were made, they were lost. Am I wrong? Do not need evidence, love for God and Jesus comes from FAITH. God does not need to provide proof for himself, he isn't the one that will either be rewarded or punished for that descision. Work with me here, Cowboy... nothing you said has anything to do with my actual question. Do you agree that none of the "documents" were written "while he was here" ? Or do you not only have faith in Jesus, do you also have 'faith' that these documents were written while he was here? Or other? I it really does not matter when it was written. Knowing or discussing this knowledge has no bearing on my salvation or anyone elses salvation so it is irrelevant and not importatn. |
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Edited by
MiddleEarthling
on
Sun 01/03/10 06:12 PM
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yes the "bible" was written after Jesus. That is because the bible is combined of many documents that was wrote while he was here. That's why acts, revolations, john, and so on aren't called chapters, they are called the books of acts, the books of revolations, ect. And all these were written while he was here on earth. This is the statement under consideration, right? AFAIK, there is no physical evidence that any of this was written during Jesus' life. If any notes were made, they were lost. Am I wrong? Do not need evidence, love for God and Jesus comes from FAITH. God does not need to provide proof for himself, he isn't the one that will either be rewarded or punished for that descision. Work with me here, Cowboy... nothing you said has anything to do with my actual question. Do you agree that none of the "documents" were written "while he was here" ? Or do you not only have faith in Jesus, do you also have 'faith' that these documents were written while he was here? Or other? I it really does not matter when it was written. Knowing or discussing this knowledge has no bearing on my salvation or anyone elses salvation so it is irrelevant and not importatn. Let me include this gem of a statement as well: "THe absence of some information in the bible is not proof it never existed" 
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Here is the long and the short of it. THe absence of some information in the bible is not proof it never existed. Noone can PROOVE or DISPROVE that the disciples wrote about Jesus while he was alive, although if they were truly following him I wouldnt think that they would unless he had instructed it. Being that I dont know EVERYTHING he instructed of them, I really dont find the significance of whether they wrote of his actions ON THE DAY, a day after or a year after. I can tell my son about how I met his father, my mom can tell me the same,, these are significant events that took place DECADES AGO BUT I dont doubt the memory would be accurate,, especially if such memory were guided by The Lord himself which is the idea of the whole bible. Um.... I have no idea why you are saying any of this. It looks to me like Cowboy made a false statement, and everyone is playing twister to avoid admitting that it happened. Why? Are Christians never allowed to be wrong? As to the 'EASE' of turning people extreme vs the EASE of baking a cake,, although the former is much more complex than the latter, I will humor the analogy. My answer is YES, both could have the same ease or difficulty making those biscuits. The one with the box may do it quicker, but that does not equate to it being easier,,to me. You have a very interesting outlook. Thanks for indulging this tangent. |
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yes the "bible" was written after Jesus. That is because the bible is combined of many documents that was wrote while he was here. That's why acts, revolations, john, and so on aren't called chapters, they are called the books of acts, the books of revolations, ect. And all these were written while he was here on earth. it really does not matter when it was written. Knowing or discussing this knowledge has no bearing on my salvation or anyone elses salvation so it is irrelevant and not importatn. This information, by itself, isn't particularly important to me, either. Thanks for elaborating on your views. |
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Here is the long and the short of it. THe absence of some information in the bible is not proof it never existed. Noone can PROOVE or DISPROVE that the disciples wrote about Jesus while he was alive, although if they were truly following him I wouldnt think that they would unless he had instructed it. Being that I dont know EVERYTHING he instructed of them, I really dont find the significance of whether they wrote of his actions ON THE DAY, a day after or a year after. I can tell my son about how I met his father, my mom can tell me the same,, these are significant events that took place DECADES AGO BUT I dont doubt the memory would be accurate,, especially if such memory were guided by The Lord himself which is the idea of the whole bible. Um.... I have no idea why you are saying any of this. It looks to me like Cowboy made a false statement, and everyone is playing twister to avoid admitting that it happened. Why? Are Christians never allowed to be wrong? As to the 'EASE' of turning people extreme vs the EASE of baking a cake,, although the former is much more complex than the latter, I will humor the analogy. My answer is YES, both could have the same ease or difficulty making those biscuits. The one with the box may do it quicker, but that does not equate to it being easier,,to me. You have a very interesting outlook. Thanks for indulging this tangent. You are welcome. And I believe I posted several pages back that Cowboy is not ALways right(ie, he is sometimes wrong). |
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the bible isn't Jesus's entire life. And it's a person we're talking about not some fictional character someone thought up and wrote down. well to be fair I only debate about Jesus as if he wasn't a fictional character but in reality for all you know he could be ...in other words this you know...for the bible tells you so well then abraham lincoln was a fictional character? Adolf hitler? George Washington? And any other person in history? The only knowledge of them you have is what you've read, you've never met them in person so why believe they were real people? Cowboy....Abraham lincoln, Adolf Hitler and George Washington could have indeed been fictional characters but no one is required to have faith in them or need faith to believe they existed beyond the history books... but faith is needed to believe in Jesus and that Jesus existed beyond being just a character in the bible therefore it is faith and the believers themselves that makes Jesus a fictional character also I can understand why you would want Adolf Hitler to be a fictional character ...since he was a Christian |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally.
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I hardly ever participate in these thread other than to just make fun of some people who are so impressed with themselves
I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. Because those that do are only trying to plant the seeds of doubt and deny the faith of others the Enemy is a master of deceit and manipulation and only strives to destroy through false logic and circular argument. and I see that a LOT in this thread still just a lot of people trying to make other people live the way they think they should. it doesnt matter if they are fundamentalists evangelizing or atheists debunking. its all the same |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally. Msharmony.....only doubt requires faith |
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I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. you mean you were programmed not to |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally. Msharmony.....only doubt requires faith Faith : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; I guess miriam webster forgot to mention the doubt thing,,,, |
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I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. you mean you were programmed not to lol non of us are programed for anything lol. We are who we choose to be and act how we choose to act and think. |
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I hardly ever participate in these thread other than to just make fun of some people who are so impressed with themselves I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. Because those that do are only trying to plant the seeds of doubt and deny the faith of others the Enemy is a master of deceit and manipulation and only strives to destroy through false logic and circular argument. and I see that a LOT in this thread still just a lot of people trying to make other people live the way they think they should. it doesnt matter if they are fundamentalists evangelizing or atheists debunking. its all the same Of course because if you are a master at mind control you make sure to put into your texts that anyone for any reason disputing your beliefs is evil and not to listen to them...lol Otherwise no religion could withstand the scrutiny...lol What would possibly be the purpose for the atheists? They don't need to get more donations in the church, they don't need to be reassured at any level. They don't even want the religion to go away, they just want the religious to stop imposing their beliefs into the government of all with the doctrines of a few. |
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I hardly ever participate in these thread other than to just make fun of some people who are so impressed with themselves I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. Because those that do are only trying to plant the seeds of doubt and deny the faith of others the Enemy is a master of deceit and manipulation and only strives to destroy through false logic and circular argument. and I see that a LOT in this thread still just a lot of people trying to make other people live the way they think they should. it doesnt matter if they are fundamentalists evangelizing or atheists debunking. its all the same Of course because if you are a master at mind control you make sure to put into your texts that anyone for any reason disputing your beliefs is evil and not to listen to them...lol Otherwise no religion could withstand the scrutiny...lol What would possibly be the purpose for the atheists? They don't need to get more donations in the church, they don't need to be reassured at any level. They don't even want the religion to go away, they just want the religious to stop imposing their beliefs into the government of all with the doctrines of a few. you can call them evil for not believing, or ignorant, brainwashed, stupid, and prone to fantasy for believing,, its all silly ad lidem debating that serves no useful purpose |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally. Msharmony.....only doubt requires faith Faith : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; I guess miriam webster forgot to mention the doubt thing,,,, to believe is to doubt |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally. Msharmony.....only doubt requires faith Faith : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; I guess miriam webster forgot to mention the doubt thing,,,, to believe is to doubt okie dokie,,,,God loves you too... |
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I was taught to not debate the Bible or validity of faith in God. you mean you were programmed not to lol non of us are programed for anything lol. We are who we choose to be and act how we choose to act and think. sorry but quietman said that he was taught not to think beyond the validity of faith in God....that's called being programmed |
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We are required to put FAITH in the validity of most documents that dont record something we experienced personally. Msharmony.....only doubt requires faith Faith : something that is believed especially with strong conviction; I guess miriam webster forgot to mention the doubt thing,,,, to believe is to doubt okie dokie,,,,God loves you too... did a voice tell you this or you read it in a book |
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