many definitions in the dictionary for "naturalism". i'll go with this one as regards philosophy:


Philosophy. a. the view of the world that takes account only of natural elements and forces, excluding the supernatural or spiritual.

b. the belief that all phenomena are covered by laws of science and that all teleological explanations are therefore without value.


i haven't used the term before but i think i will in the future. pretty good description of my own philosophy with regards to nature. hey. does this mean i'm a naturalist? can i now post a nude photo over in the religion forum? nudity is symbolic of my newfound beliefs afterall.

Awe then it is a religion IE: "a BELIEF.

This is why we (and all our logic and evidence and personal experience and reasoning) are being dismissed as being "without value."

This is just like a religion that rejects everyone else's belief system and condemns them to Hell.

But in this case we are "condemned" by being called "delusional" or "uneducated" or just ignorant. If not one of those we are simply told that our thinking is "illogical." Our evidence is "invalid." Our experiences are "hallucination." Our ideas are "fantasy."

These are judgment calls from people who have not been there and cannot see or think subjectively. They have never had an "out of body" experience, and if they did, they would assume they were crazy or hallucinating.

But I'm with you on the 'going naked' part. Lets all continue this debate at a nudist colony.

I'm not sure I like that definition. It pretty much excludes the concept of a "religious philosophy", which I think is an oversight.

For me the definition for "naturalism" is a beautiful and magical word, philosophy, and conscience full of positivity.

It describes that nature is doing its own course of survival regardless of what humans are doing to it. That we can enjoy the beauty nature gives us and also intergrate with it become naturalists if wanted.

It also tells me personally that an evidence for a designer isn't necessary or important and that we should just enjoy the time given to us. To respect our environment and take care of it.

Naturalism means to me that it is independent from many belief systems, yet also supportive of many also at the same time. It holds no sides, yet preserves all idealogies regardless.

Naturalism is in itself beauty, patience, love, serenity, and nourishing to all who embrace it.

That would be my personal dictionary definition.

That's a given.

But we can 'enjoy our existence' and still ask questions.

Note: Note that you stated that our time was "given to us."

That suggests an intelligent designer gave it to us.

Yes maybe there is a intelligent design. Perhaps there isn't. To be honest, I wouldn't know.

Sometimes I have the impression that it is given to us. Well at least this experience anyway.

At other times I say there is no reason or we are not meant to know.

It is a very difficult question indeed. Well if you, Abra, Creative, Shoku, Sky, Billy, Einstein, Newton, Jefferson, Franklin, or the other geniuses of our past and present don't know then I will certainly not know what created or if something created everything as we know it.

Naturalism sounds very good in many ways though.

You all really don't need to go on and on with these threads (although I learn a lot from reading them). I can tell you right now that there IS an intelligent creative force that designed the universe and that we all have a part and a purpose in it. I don't know why you all argue and wonder about it. You could've just asked me at any time.

Well, you won't get an argument from me.

Your wisdom has totally overwhelmed me.

You've left me speechless with no grounds to base an argument on.

I've only responded to your post out of pure awe.

I like your new picture!

Thank you! My hair is longer this year so I figured I should update it. First pic I ever took with my webcam!

I thought 'naturalism' was when everyone took their clothes off, but no one cared that they had done so.

Edit: as in, a synonym for nudism.

Yes naturalism is also used for nudism .

double Post

i went with the definition as the closest to what i think naturalism to be. i suppose i'd change the word belief to thinking.



nope. i'd never dismiss my own experience as being without value. i may dismiss another's testimony of his/her belief or what they claim to have experienced. i do this often with christians who claim to have spoken with god. i simply find no credibility in their claim.



now you're making the proverbial strawman argument. you assumed a premise that i never made. i've not rejected anyone's belief. i'm simply skeptical of the christian that tells me they talk to god for instance. never said they didn't. just consider it highly implausible. nothing religious in the least about skepticism.



i knew we had a similar wikedness about us bean.

Considering that there is no intent or purpose that anyone can show on either side of the argument.........

Show me the intelligence of it all first off. I cannot see intelligence in the "design" at all.

It is beautiful in it's randomness. It is a wonder in the happening of it. It is amazing that it happened the way that it did. But there is no intelligence behind any of it. And there is no intent or purpose to it either.

As for naturalism, I am with Massage on that.

Nothing is truly "random."

Beliefs are not innately religious.

Why do religions get the corner market on belief? Cant I believe that my chair will support my weight without having a church of weigh bearing furniture?

Conversely can we not observe a world around us explainable via natural processes and then take as a given, ie believe, that if it explains everything we look at (research), maybe it will continue to explain everything we look at.

When you can build a circuit board with your mind and get FM (or better yet GOD 93.3) let me know, till then its naturalism for me.

lol. "what is poison for one..............?" it works for me for the very reason it doesn't work for you. it excludes religion.

you'd think huh? but i could find no definition that did not contain the word "belief". i suppose i should have qualified the definition as being nearest two how i'd define the word. my use of the word "belief" with regards to nudity was meant as tongue in cheeck. you don't really think i believe in hanging out naked with people do you?



don't know who the "they" is that you refer too. as far as delusional is concerned, that is a diagnosis in phsychiatry used by psychiatrists. not being a psychiatrist i'd never make such a judgement. "uneducated" means little to me as i never graduated higher than the 12th grade and i've never used the word ignorant when speaking about a fellow human. some thinking i do consider illogical using my standard of logic. seems to me you and the rest here have expressed the lack of logic of people who don't see the logical as you see it. we all do that. evidence is valid only to the person testing the evidence and the results are deemed by the tester to be valid. so evidence that cannot be tested as the tester might desire therefore cannot be determined as valid. until that happens, the evidence remains invalid. i'd never assume someone to be crazy or hallucinating.



i'm becoming fanatically religious more and more about the faith each time you bring it up bean. you can be our pastor. won't even need the robe huh?