What do you think about the idea that without spirit humans are nothing and hold no value.

Why would a spirit world equate to more value than not?

Perhaps "spirit" is just something people made up Humanocentric narcisism

maybe..however if we are spiritual beings having a human experience, there wouldn't be much left open to discussion

Good point

There is no proof that the spirit non sense has any positive aspect on people's lives .

yea, it would be strictly a personal perspective

Quite the contrary. There is 10,000 years of it. The problem is that the proof is necessarily subjective. That is, "positive aspect" depends entirely upon viewpoint. To insist that one viewpoint applies universally to all others is about as blatantly nonsensical as anything I can imagine.

Subjective truth?

Perhaps in ethics, and even then it is truth about the agent in question not the ethical standard.

There is no justification in demonstrable fact that spirit exists.

Show me a subjective truth. I will ask what grounds it, and again, what grounds that, and that... ad infinitum

Truth is based in fact.

Subjective truth does not exist, neither does moral truth.

I beg your pardon sir, but I hold that your opinion on this is itself nothing more than your very own subjective truth.



I AM.

That's my subjective truth.

You say, "I will ask what grounds it"

I will answer, "It is my subjective experience that grounds it".

You claim that you're going to continue to ask your question ad infinitum?

But why bother? I've already give you the final answer.

The buck stops here.

I AM.

That's my subjective truth.

You're still looking for a meaningful answer to life "Out There".

No wonder you're lost in asking questions that go on ad infinitum.

You haven't yet recognized the only subjective truth that you can ever truly know.

In fact, any 'objective' truth that you think you know is actually based on this ultiamte subjective truth. Because all of your experience is subjective.

Even your experience of existence is subjective. You cannot know your own true self objectively, you can only have the subjective experience of being.

The ONLY truth is subjective.

There is no such thing as an "objective" truth. Because everything that you believe that you experience 'objectively' you are truly and ultimately experiencing 'subjectively'.

The only truth is the subjective truth of your very own experience of what is happening right now.

There is no other truth.

I AM, is the only truth you can ever truly know, and it can only be known and experienced subjectively.

The ONLY truth that you can ever know is entirely subjective.

Yet here you are attempting to subjectively assert that subjective truth does not exist.

value in what sense?

in what calculation are you trying figure in the value of human life?

I have to know before I answer the question.

Am I a general commanding an army at war?

Am I a doctor in a hospital?

Am I a sailor stranded at sea and choosing between cannibalism and death?

Have you killed someone I love?

gotta know things like that.

There is a white vehicle parked in my driveway.

There is one moon which revolves around the earth.

I am communicating with a person who has a screen name of Abracadabra.

It is raining right now.



Need this mindlessness continue? Really?

In all of these things, and many more. Does spirit need to exist to be able to find value in human life?

no. life itself is valuable enough. as a commodity, if you like, or a resource. life, human life particularly, has intrinsic value both to itself and it's originating population.

Do bears think anything about the afterlife? doubtful. Do you think they ponder the nature of their existence? highly doubtful. Do you think it even has a concept of what you and I mean when we say "soul" or "spirit"? Most doubtful. but does it value the life of one of it's own? sure. mothers of many species will take in a stranded infant of her own kind more often than not if she feels she can care for it.

same would apply, I think, in the case of human life.

let's say you were a slave trader. if you don't consider that people have spirits or souls, then they're just sacks of flesh. you don't see the slaves as people, only a resource to be exploited and valued. after all, the slave's no good to you dead, so you value his life.

or you can see people , or life, as a resource to exploited for the purpose of breeding soldiers. get the biggest toughest women and breed them to the biggest toughest men. google "nazi joy division"

I could go on but I feel driven this point home.

yes. life has intrinsic value.

Understood!

No, you've proven my point perfectly. Thank you.

You obviously have no idea what truth conditions are.

So be it.

All you did was give me a list of your subjective experiences that you believe to be objective reality.

I'm supposed to be impressed by that?

Do you think there isn't a car sitting in my driveway too?

How do I know?

Because I can go out there and subjectively experience it.

But when I come back in and say that I was just out there and saw it, can a say with certainty that it's still out there?

No, I can't. All I can say is that it was 'out there' when I took my subjective essence 'out there' to look at it.

In fact, when I come back in and close the door, I can't even be sure there is an 'out there' out there. All I have is a memory that I had subjectively experienced an 'out there'.

My subjective experience is the only truth that I can genuinely know for sure.

Everything else is speculation.

I value life with or without a spirit.

Now pass the darn mash potatoes

AKA the soul...I can't show you mine, well not yet anyway. But, you can certainly find your own. Get in tune with yourself.

Here's the potato.

You'll have to mash him yourself if you have the heart to do it.



Just keep in mind that geneticists have discovered that all life on planet Earth started from a single solitary cell.

So this potato, being a living thing, is related to you.

Think about that before you mash his head in.

Then go ahead and enjoy your vegetarian dinner.