Before I begin . . . it is important to recognice that the Bible does
allow a lot of room for guessing . . . we are not told everything . . .
we MUST be careful as to what we say is fact and what is just an idea.
The Pharasees did not recognize who Christ was becasue they "KNEW" that
the Messiah would be a political leader. Let us not fall into the same
trap.

That said . . . it is likely that were was a layer of water above the
earth, or maybe even more likely . . . ice. Such a layer would prevent
UV rays, reduce sun damage and extend life spans. That layer of
ice/water is the best translation we can come up with for teh idea of
"firmament" as mentioned in Genesis.
If you read through Genesis and add up the ages . . . taking into
account when each was born you will find that the time from the creation
of man to the flood was about 2000 years. [At age 150 Adam had Seth
(btw it here states that Adam and Eve had MORE childres) at age 105 Seth
had Enosh, at age 90 Seth had Kenan, at age 70 Enosh had Mahalalel, at
age 65 Mahalalel had Jared, at age 162 Jared had Enoch, at age 65 Enoch
had Methuselah, at 187 Methuselah had Lamach, and Lamach at age 182 had
Noah. At age 500 Noah had 3 sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth] During that
time you had people with life spans approaching 1000 years. That makes
for a lot of people. How old were Cain and Abel when their exchage
happened. It is possible that both were a couple hundred years old when
Abel was killed.
Genetisists have agreed that even by the time of Noah the gene pool
would be very large. What that means is that between Noah and his wife
it is very likely that they had the genetic material for every race we
see today. Cain and his family were not alive after the flood, the
Bible clearly states that all mankind was destroyed.

For those whole like numbers we have 23 pair of chromosomes . . .
between a mother and father there are 4 different possiblities for the
pairing of each chromosome (2 from dad, 2 from mom, 2x2=4) take 4 to
the 23rd power(the number of chromosomes we have) that is
4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4x4 or 70,368,744,177,664 and
you will have the number of possible offspring. I believe that 70
trillion possibilites could more than account for races and diversity
among humans.

Now this is completely void of of teh number or genetic mutations.
These mutations can happen just from two strands of DNA crossing over
and switching "legs". Take that into account and the number of
possibilities is all but limitless. If you would truely like to
understand how many posibilities there are, take a class in genetics.
Add all the different kinds of mutations to this equasion and it is
positively mind blowing.

As I said before . . . don't put faith in what the Bible doesn't say . .
. and if it doesn't talk about it, it doesn't mean it didn't happen. We
must take all of scripture into account when contemlplating such large
ideas. We are only setting ourselves up for failure if we do otherwise.

In regards to the magnetic field weakening . . . yes it is . . . it is
weakening due to the slowing down of the earths rotation. This can be
seen in various sedimentry layers of stone. More evidnence that it is
slowing down is that if deprived of natural light, humans typically live
in a 23 hour cycle, not 24. We are made for faster days. I think it is
likely that in the last 6000 years we have added an hour a day. The
Second Law of Thermodynamics is that "Everything decays over time (or
moves towards entropy) unless acted on by an outside force." These laws
are sometimes called the laws of nature. (sidenote; its funny how
evolutionts can so easily substitute a theory for the few accepted Laws
in science) Spider does have many of his facts straight . . . I just
believe part of his theory about the origin of races is unbiblical.

Moshe>

Ice in orbit? Yes it could happen. However in a gravity well that ice
once it was disturbed enough to start dropping to the planetary surface
would have entered the atmosphere just like th shuttle challenger did.

It would have been a spectacular display of fire. By the time the ice
reached the surface of the earth the tempreture would have been
scorching. It would have steam cooked Noah and anything else upon the
surface. Or will you now claim that the earths gravitational force was
less in those times. The earth attracts objects towards its center at
the rate of 32 feet per seconed/per second. Friction with the
atmosphere would have not melted the ice but turned it into burning
vapor.

That scenario was researched by the same team that disproved the water
canopy theory as they were trying to find a way to prove the theory
right and only suceeded in disproving it.

The word for 'firmament' in genisis in the hebrew is used many times in
the bible. It means the heavens and only in genesis is it used by
people trying to prove absurd theories.

It can not be used to mean one thing just for a single chapter and yet
be something different in all other chapters.

It is just one idea to explain the world before the flood . . . there
was no rain and people had extremely long life. If heavens was
synonomoys (sp?:) ) with firmamint . . . then why two differnt words . .
. Having studied hebrew for a couple years there are many times that
words have diffenent meaning in differnt contexts. The most literal
definition of firmamint is an expanse between the heavens and the earth
. . . the water/ice shild seems to fit that concept . . . it would also
explain the lack of rain, (when the sun finially melted through that
would be one hell of a rain storm . . . . a flood?) it would explain the
long life spans. Do I believe it is fact . . . not necessarily . . .
but I have yet to hear a better explanation. If you have one please
share:)

btw the ice i was referring to was not particles but perhaps a sheet
encasing the globe. The distace wouln't have to be great . . . and from
this you wouldn't have heat from the falling particles. However the
world was when God created it, i'm sure it was amazing:)

I posted on in the thread on water canopys.

The best explanation is the simplest.

It rained.

I do like that answer:) however i cannot help but wonder what started
the rain since it hadn't happened before. I also wonder what could have
created an enviornment that would allow reptiles to grow to such great
sizes. I wonder also what was differnt that allowed so many people to
live close to a millenia.

My personal beleif is that a magnetic shift started the process. If it
happened suddenly it would have caused a catastrophic change in the tilt
of the earth. Or perhaps a large enough asteriod would cause the same
tilt. Either could have resulted in a sudden and massive ice melt.

As far as being protected from the sun thus haveing longer lives. Our
telescopes can now look far enough into the universe that we have seen
as a new star forms. A young star has about it a dust cloud which could
have dimmed the sun and protected the new life upon a small planet such
as ours. It would not have had to be thick just of the right material
to block out the harmful rays and allow light to shine through.

So how do you explain Genesis 1:7 "And God made the firmament, and
divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters
which [were] above the firmament: and it was so." Also, how long did
this dust cloud last? What happened and how did it disappear?

The word that is used to describe the firmament can be found in a least
16 other places in the OT. In all other cases but genesis it is used to
describe the place where the birds fly and the place where the stars
are. Genesis alone appears to have drawn a different 'interpretation'
from a small group of scholars whos findings are in great dispute from
other groups of scholars. My personal believe is if it means something
in all other aspects it means the same thing in this one aspect.

Dust clouds around young stars clear in an observed natural sequence.
The mechanics are not proven but it appears that the flare activity
within the stars normal cycle eventuall pushes the dust away from the
star. Some of it may be sucked in by the stars gravitational forces.
Some of it may be swept up by planets orbiting the star. (We can not be
sure of this because our equipment is not focused enough to see small
planets)

the mechnics mean nothing. Once a star matures the dust clouds are
gone.

that makes sense, but still doesn't answer the question of the water
ABOVE the firmamint.

Also of the 17 occurances of the word firmamint, 7 are in reguards to
creation, the one in Genesis 1:20 seems to identify it as part of
heaven, which would coinside with the ice/water idea. The use in Psalms
150:1, and Ez 1:22 don't really point one way or another since they are
giving these charactics to people. The only place I could easly replace
it with heaven would be Psalm 19:1, but it could still be a seperate
thing. The reference to a frimamint in Daniel indicates brightness . .
. not sure how that plays in. There are maybe 2 or 3 more where it
could possible be replace with heaven, but that doesn't necessarily make
it the defination.

My point being . . . taking into account the other uses, the definition
is still vague. To say that I am using the term wrong is grossly
inaccurate. To say the other 16 uses are a completly differnet meaning,
is also inaccurate. I question any scolar who says he as a definate
defination of this word. I still believe it is something differnt from
heaven, because it is a differnt word. There is an extra meaning
intended here.

Perhaps it does have more meaning.

Then again it all happened. The flood happened and of that there is not
dispute.

Why then worry about the mechanics of a young planet.

More important things are on the horizon of this time of times and that
is where all of our energy should be focused.

for sure:) we are in an interesting age