I say they Have. The shooting in SF. is quite eveident and easy to see what happened.

In Moberly Mo. I know of 2 different people were Killed when tazed.

This has became a normal police procedure if they feel any threat at all percieved or unpercieved.

It does not matter they are presumed Innocent. WHY?

If something happens and someone dies around you are you presumed Innocent?

or does the prosecuted file charges just to appease the public for re-election?

Our Judicial System and Law inforcement IMO has gone haywire.

The rich get by with murder. So do the Police!!

I am outraged as when the year old young man that died in Randolph county Mo. out side of Moberly they had Tazed him once had him Handcuffed with one cop holding him over the trunk of the car.

The other said he struggled and just gave him a LITTLE taze.

What BS.. How can you give someone a little Taze?

When I went through Electronics school we were told that as little as 1/4 of an amp can stop your heart.

Why do you think we have so much safety in industry about being shocked?

Our Govt. has desided that it is quite fine to Taze our citizens.

We are a part of the united Nations and we are to ab ide by thier rules in war Time.

What has the United Nation come to Conclusion of and Outlawed?

They say it is TORTURE. WE ARE BEING TORTURED BY OUR OWN POLICE!!!!!

When are we going to wake up and call for ACCOUNTABILITY.. GET rid of PATRIOT ACT.

This is when we saw our Judicial system and Police decide they are Judge and Exicutinioner.

U. N> Mandate for TAZERS>...

The United Nations Committee against Torture reported that the use of Tasers can be a form of torture, due to the acute pain they cause, and warns against the possibility of death in certain cases.[56][57] Amnesty International has reported several alleged cases of excessive electroshock gun use, that possibly amount to torture, including the death of an individual after being struck 12 times with a Taser in Orange County, Florida.[58][dead link] They have also raised extensive concerns about the use of other electro-shock devices by American police and in American prisons, as they can be (and according to Amnesty International, sometimes are) used to inflict cruel pain on individuals. For example, Eric Hammock of Texas died in April 2005 after receiving more than 20 taser shocks by Fort Worth police officers.[59][dead link] Maurice Cunningham of South Carolina, while an inmate at the Lancaster County Detention Center,[60][61] was subjected to continuous shock for 2 minutes 49 seconds, which a medical examiner said caused cardiac arrhythmia and his subsequent death. He was 29 years old and had no alcohol or drugs in his system.[62]

In response to the claims that the pain inflicted by the use of the Taser could potentially constitute torture, Tom Smith, the Chairman of the Taser Board, has stated that the U.N. was "out of touch" with the needs of modern policing.

"Pepper spray goes on for hours and hours, hitting someone with a baton breaks limbs, shooting someone with a firearm causes permanent damage, even punching and kicking - the intent of those tools is to inflict pain, ... with the Taser, the intent is not to inflict pain; it's to end the confrontation. When it's over, it's over


WHAT ABOUT OUR CHILDREN? WE SEE POLICE AT SCHOOL WOULD THEY TAZE THEM?

Police officers that patrol schools, including grade schools, in several U.S. states (including Kansas, Minnesota, Kentucky, and Florida), currently carry tasers. In 2004, the parents of a 6-year old boy in Miami sued the police department for tasering their child. The police said the boy was threatening to injure his own leg with a shard of glass, and claimed that using the taser was the only option to stop the boy from injuring himself. Taser International asserts that the taser is safe for use on anyone weighing 60 pounds (27 kg) or more. Nevertheless, the boy's mother told CNN that the three officers involved might have found it easier to reason with her child. Two weeks later, a 12-year-old girl skipping school was tasered in Miami-Dade.[48] In March 2008, an 11-year old girl was shocked by taser.[49]

Supporters of taser use in schools argue that merely switching on the device, and threatening to use it, can be effective in frightening violent or uncooperative students into desisting from inappropriate behaviour, if verbal reprimands have not succeeded. Critics counter that tasers may interact with preexisting medical complications such as medications, and may even contribute to someone's death as a result. Thus, critics say, they should either be prohibited altogether in schools, or classified as possibly lethal weapons and as a consequence, should be regulated very tightly. Critics also argue that using a taser on a minor, and especially a young child, is effectively cruel and abusive punishment, and therefore it should be banned on the same grounds that other, older forms of physical punishment such as canings have been banned from use in many schools. [50] [51] [52] [53] [54]

This practice neeeds to STOP and I hope all HELL is Raised in California.

They lie to us constantly.. How long are we going to TAKE IT?

I believe that it is torture too

I am not saying you are wrong here, but do want to give a slightly different perspective. My father was a cop, killed in the line of duty. Do you want to know how? It was a 14 year old kid, one who was presumed innocent and non-threatening. They didn't have tazers then to stop him when his little struggle turned into a death brawl when his brothers and mother decided they didn't want their little hyped up on pcp 14 year old rapist baby going to jail.

Thing is, you don't always have the whole story and the cops don't always know (if ever) what someone is going to do. That's how cops get killed every damn day in this country and around the world.

My father is dead because of a criminal and frankly, I'd far rather see the criminal dead than another cop whose only job is trying to keep others safe. If it turns out to be a mistake, oh well, they shouldn't have been doing whatever they were doing.

That's my perspective.

I am sorry for your loss and I can understand how you feel.

Our police are in a difficult situation.

But that does not put them above the Law does it?

Why should police get by with what you or me can not?

Like lets look at the case of a child.

The police are using Tazers to stop bad behavior of school children.

So does that give me the right as a parent of a unruly teenager since physically taking them down Or any other physical force it might take say to keep them from leaving the house and going out.

I decide to buy a Tazer and when my kid acts up I just Taze him.

It is easier and more effective..

So are you in favor of parents Tazing thier school aged kids when they mis behave?

If the cop can can't I?

If used correctly the taser can be, and is, a valuable tool (less than lethal) to subdue combative/resistant subjects. I'm not telling you to use them on your children and I'm not saying that police should (or shouldn't). I'm merely stating that when used properly, I support their use by officers.

tell me i curious to know because it seems you may know alittle about them..

Do you know what charge they hit you with.

In any measure of unit.. Say watts, amps or volts?

I have spent the last 10 years in law enforcement.

I will say that anywhere you go in the world at any job. The fact is you find people who make errors due to lack of training or the are malious. All I can say this is what happens when you are human and possible emotions are involved in any descions that are made....some are dumb ass!

Put into the factor that human life is important! Protecting life is an important thing. Understand law enforcement are putting there life on the line for not a whole of money!

Do I think some tools are miss used and abused. We all see the news. I have also seen these tools save lives and descalate hundreds of situations.

I respect your opion and you have solid points.

Everybody life is important.

My agency hasn't fully incorporated the use of them yet so I am not sure. I believe it's somewhere in the line of 50k volts; but that could differ depending on the manufacturer.

Being in Lawenforcment for the last 10 years you should have a pretty good knowlege of how much power an officer had to use up to deadly force when you started as an officer and how much they have now?

Has it changed? Personally growing up in the midwest i never saw cops act as they do now.In the mid size cities they are getting to IMO they challenge you to try to mess with them.. The want you to confront them.. What is your opinion on this?

Also what about every officer who is going to go through Tazer school be Tazed?

This away they will know what it can do and is like?

Would you allow yourself to be Tazed in training?


Taser International claims that Tasers are safe, but critics disagree, citing the number of deaths occurring after Taser use. Amnesty International has documented over 245 deaths that occurred after the use of Tasers, although not one of these deaths have been attributed to electrocution.[citation needed] Amnesty International Canada and other civil liberties organizations have argued that a moratorium should be placed on Taser use until research can determine a way for them to be safely used.[28]

A number of studies have investigated the potential dangers of Taser use. They have included examination of incident records, limited human testing, and experimental studies on pigs. Although tests on police and military volunteers have shown Tasers to function appropriately on a healthy, calm individual in a relaxed and controlled environment,[28] Amnesty International asserts that they "do not take into account real life use of Tasers by law enforcement agencies, such as repeated or prolonged shocks and the use of restraints".[30]

Taser International recommends that users be tased during training.[citation needed] At least one police official has been tased to demonstrate confidence in the device's safety.[31] Police officers in at least five US states have filed lawsuits against Taser International claiming they suffered serious injuries after being shocked with the device during training classes.[32]

While their intended purpose is to circumvent the use of lethal force such as guns, the actual deployment of Tasers by police in the years since Tasers came into widespread use is claimed to have resulted in more than 180 deaths as of 2006.[33] It is still unclear whether the Taser was directly responsible for the cause of death, but several legislators in the U.S. have filed bills clamping down on them and requesting more studies on their effects.[34] Despite the growing controversy, a study funded by the U.S. Justice Department asserted that majority of people tasered from July 2005 to June 2007 suffered no injury. A study led by William Bozeman, of the Wake Forest University Baptist Medical Center, of nearly 1,000 persons subjected to Taser use, concluded that 99.7% of the subjects had either minor injuries, such as scrapes and bruises, or none at all; while three persons suffered injuries severe enough to need hospital admission, and two other subjects died. Their autopsy reports indicated neither death was related to the use of a Taser.[35][36]

In October and November 2007, four individuals died after being tasered in Canada, leading to calls for review of its use. The highest-profile of these cases was that of Robert Dziekański, a non-English speaking man from Poland who died in less than two minutes after being tasered by Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) at the Vancouver International Airport, October 14, 2007.[37][38][39] Followed by three other post-Taser deaths, this incident led Amnesty International to demand an end to Taser use in Canada.[40]

On December 12, 2007, in response to the death of Robert Dziekański, Public Safety Minister Stockwell Day requested that the federal Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP (CPC) prepare recommendations for immediate implementation. The CPC report recommended to "immediately restrict the use of the conducted energy weapon (CEW)" by reclassifying it as an "impact weapon."[41] The commission released its report on 18 June 2008; recommendations include restricting use to experienced officers (5 years or more), providing medical attention to those who have been zapped, improving previous documentation of specific deployment of the weapon, among other things.[42][43]

In June 2008, a federal jury ordered Taser International to pay the family of Robert Heston, Jr., $6 million in punitive and compensatory damages for the 2005 death of the man who died a day after being shocked repeatedly by officers using Tasers. According to a press report, the jury "said Taser had failed to warn police in Salinas, California, that prolonged exposure to electric shock from the device could cause a risk of cardiac arrest."[44]

In December of 2008, in light of extensive testing of Tasers by the CBC, many Canadian police agencies, including the Royal Canadian Mounted Police have either suspended use of Tasers, or just those manufactured before 2006.[45]

I believe you are right.

You will not find a SINGLE college Professor of Electronics anywhere that won't say that is 50 times what is needed to kill you.

now as a cop you want all you can have for your job and like you all said are not paid that much for a dangerous job..

I agree Policeman and Teachers should have thier salaries Doubled I believe. They do a job that is critical to our society but yet OUR GOVT>> does not believe so.

I will ask you will you be tazed when they train you voluntarily?

The responsiblity is the same...some of the tools have changed.

As has already been stated, there are some people in law enforcement who shouldn't be there. Unfortunately there is no fool-proof way to weed out EVERYONE. As a matter of fact, there is no way to ensure that any person in any particular career field is going to be 100%.

In regards to getting tazed... Most departments require that in order for you to carry a tazer, you have to be tazed. Just like we have to be sprayed in order to carry pepperspray-type substances.

If I want to carry one I'll have to be tazed. Doesn't bother me. As for it a single charge being more than enough to kill....if that were the case, then everyone tazed would be killed. That's not the case. I suggest you do some more research.

new years eve here.... a cop ran down a pedisterian crossing the street.

the cop was speeding to get to a burglary call..and did NOT have her lights flashing.

that is vehicular manslaughter in my opinion......and charges will probably never be brought.

her victim had 2 small children at home.

I am glad to hear you have to see what it is like.

I do believe that someone who has experienced it will be more cautious about using it.

I still find it hard to believe though if we follow the UN which you no all heck was raised about guatanamo.

I do not believe that our soldiers in war use the force our own police use.

They i would guess by what I have read do not use Tazors.

Yet when they humiliated those prisoners at that prison. Soldiers went to prison over it.

then thier was cases of brutality brought against soldiers and Murder when they got out of line after seeing thier buddies slaughtered.

It seems to me and I have seen it. That not only the Police but prosecuters and Judges are all throwing around alot of wieght behind the shield of the Justice System

No whenever your muscles contract it is enough to kill you from an electrical charge.

I have went to college and the field for 20+ years and these guys are saying one thing and supressing what the college proffessors who are experts in the field not someone who is working for you.

Now I am sure you will say well that could not happen them suppressing what the college proffessors say about it.

It does happen as I wrote all over these boards about what was being said about Ethonal being produced from our corn.

They have been warning for years and our govt. does not want to listen to them.. They get thier own experts.

just like these guys who say these charges can not kill you.

That does not mean that it will.

But what it does mean is the possibility that it could anyone.

So I am curious now about this sence you do not have a problem with them.

If i had a kid say 12 and 15 and they were getting out of hand would you support parents using them as disipline?

You're comparing the US military to police work...two totally different animals. From what you've quoted, you're saying that the UN prohibits torture....that is according to the Geneva Convention. Police don't opperate by that. Also, the tazer isn't being used to torture, it's used to gain compliance. Another big difference. As for your muscles contracting...yeah, that's going to happen. However, the shock delivered is not designed to cause death.

This is the kind of stuff that gets to me. I have seen people killed or seen it in the paper i should say.

The cops are never charged. They just keep saying we are investigating it then it like goes away.

We did have one finally put away but only after the young mans parents from New jersey and he was a freshman at the University of Missouri came and did thier own investigation and the prosecuter could not deny what they had discovered.

he would still be on the force today because they do not do a very through job when investigating what may be thier own.

They knew the same as his parents found but they said at the time they did not believe it was relevant so they never brought it to the prosecuter.

say give me a break.

But the cop was having an affair with is guy. he is male also.

he had some stuff on him and decided to break it off with the cop and the cop was afraid he was going to say something so he caught him while he was walking early in the morning through some back yards from a party and sneaked up behind him and slit his throat.

he got life but not if it would not been for his parents coming a 1000 miles and staying and talking to his friends and stuff for a few months did they find out about this affair and the police dept did not see a link between one of thier own having a Hommosexual affair with this kid and his murder.

That is sad..

we abide by the genva convention when it comes to prisoners of war. But our own citizens do not have that right.

Did they use any flashing lights at the academy in your eyes?

You apperently are part of the problem then.

I am glad you showed how cops think these days.

They really do a job on you guys huh?

Define torture...

Torture, the infliction of bodily pain or mental suffering either as punishment, to compel a person to confess to a crime or provide information, or to intimidate, coerce, discriminate against, or repress a person or group of people for political purposes.

So a Tazer does not do that and it is not deliberate.

it does not cause pain.

Is not used to intimidate?

really.

And you truely believe Prisoners of War should have more rights than any citizen of the United States should have..

Interesting..

How about the question about Parents using it to control thier kids?

It should not harm them right?

I always wondered about this case is.

If you keep evidence from the police you are charged with a crime.

Now I guess it is pretty hard to keep evidence from yourself.

But why is it not a crime when the police keep evidence from the prosecuter?

They have way more influence in the justice system than we do.

But it just goes with the perks of the job these days I guess

This is my last reply on this topic because it doesn't appear that you're understanding what I'm saying and we're both spinning our wheels.

1. By your own definition torture is:
the infliction of bodily pain or mental suffering either [bold]as [/bold]punishment, to compel a person to confess to a crime or provide information, or to intimidate, coerce, discriminate against, or repress a person or group of people for political purposes.

In the case of police departments, they are not intended to be used as previously defined. They are used to gain compliance from a resistant person.

2. They are not used to intimidate; refer to #1

3. If you choose to shock your children then that is between you, your child and your local police department and child services if necessary.

As I've stated several times, maybe you need to do a little more research on the topic. Have fun.