I have seen these posts on who loves Jesus, and who believes in Jesus and they seem to go no where. I am going to try and make this simpler hopeful and just ask: Do you believe in a creator. Regardless of faith, do you believe there is a supreme being that created the earth/stars/universe?

i hope so

I believe in a energy that all things are created from,..

beyond any comprehension of human mind

My justification for this question lies within nature. Everything working in perfect harmony with everything else. So to answer my own question...yes.

I used to believe that at one time. But now I have serious doubts.

I'm now convinced that the most likely scenario is one of two things:

Either we are the creator, or there the is no spiritual world beyond this one.

The idea of a single conscious entity having created this entire universe with a specific design and purpose in mind is truly an unlikely scenario. Especially the idea of one that is a jealous being that demands to be worshiped and would get bent out of shape if people don't pay it attention. That isn't even mature behavior for a human being much less a God.

I'm thoroughly convinced of the scientific evidence that shows that the earth is 4.5 billion years old and that all life evolved on this planet from very simple organisms over those billions of years. I'm not the slightest bit concerned with how this might agree or conflict with any religious views. The time scales just seem to absurd to be the hallmark of a creator who has a purpose (especially if humans are part of that purpose).

If we condense that 4.5 billion years into the span of an hour here's what it looks like:

For the first 50 minutes of that hour nothing more than microbes evolved on earth.

For the next 10 minutes a myriad of animals evolved, and became extinct over the course of many geological time scales. The dinosaurs alone reigned for about 300 million of those years.

Finally, in the last 1/100th of a second, (yes, in the last 0.01 seconds of the earth’s existence humans appeared), and all of human activity historic and prehistory took place in that last 1/100th of a second.

Does that look like we were put here by a God who had us in mind as the main focus of creation?

I don't think so.

Also the world had been dog-eat-dog during all those billions of years long before we every came onto the scene. Animals murdered each other, and stole each others property, ate their young, etc, etc, etc. Disease and natural disaster were commonplace. In fact, it appears that there were several occasions where mass extinctions occurred. If there is any kind of 'baby-sitting' God it certainly appears that God is an experimenter that uses trial and error to design, it's clearly not a pre-planning designer.

Finally there is no way that humans could be blamed for bringing into existence what we call 'evil'. Clearly that kind of behavior is commonplace throughout this entire universe, and always was.

I'm seriously beginning to believe that we might just be mold growing on a rock.

I seriously don't see any reason to believe otherwise.

If there is a God it doesn't appear to be very compassionate at all. It's also an extremely poor example of a parent. I haven't seen any evidence of a supposedly 'loving God'. Is such a deity exists there is no evidence for it, and much evidence against it. At best it would be a deceiving God. Not a loving righteous one.

It's still fun to pretend that there is a God. It's always fun to pretend. I pretend. Why not? There's nothing to lose.

If there is a God (or a higher consciousness of any sort) I'm quite confident that it truly doesn't care what we believe anyway. It would be far above all of the petty attributes that mundane human religions attempt to assign to it. The Biblical God for an example is a totally disgrace. If God truly was like that picture then cosmic reality would be a bigger nightmare than life on earth. A self-confessed jealous egoistical judgmental God who gets angry if it isn't the focus of worship? That's sicker than sick.

I'd truly rather atheism be true than the biblical picture. Truly I would. I'd rather just die than discover that God is as sick as the Bible claims. I've met human beings who were wiser and had more compassion than the biblical picture of God. And they were atheists!

But the truth is that everything doesn't work in harmony.

The truth is that it's a dog-eat-dog world.

Nature isn't always cooperative with life.

Where's the harmony?

I think Confucius crated the universe...

It doesn't? Even a lion eating a antelope is miraculous to me. Everything has its own special niche. Humans are the only things that seem slightly out of place. Just my opinion.

Watching good old carl sagan again are we?

If we condense that 4.5 billion years into the span of an hour here's what it looks like:

For the first 50 minutes of that hour nothing more than microbes evolved on earth.

For the next 10 minutes a myriad of animals evolved, and became extinct over the course of many geological time scales. The dinosaurs alone reigned for about 300 million of those years.

Finally, in the last 1/100th of a second, (yes, in the last 0.01 seconds of the earth’s existence humans appeared), and all of human activity historic and prehistory took place in that last 1/100th of a second.


good anology CS -

I don't believe in a single creator that created me and all the physical universe. I believe the universe is the co-creation of all the self-determined beings in the universe. But to me, that's not the real issue. The real issue is the fact that all these co-creators are not dependent upon the physical universe for their existence, any more than someone who sews and then wears a shirt is dependent on that shirt for his existence.

i suppose your really looking for a yes or no answer, but i can only say this - yes i believe there is a creative force/entity, but iwont know what it is while in this body nor will you. and after i'm gone i'm not sure if i'll know then either - i will expand on this if you want - or leave as it's stated.

I tend to agree with Sky.

If there exists a spiritual element to our existence the pantheistic view is the most likely candidate.

The idea of a single individual consciousness raising us to become its worshipers is indeed an extremely weird idea if you really stop and think about it.

If there is a spiritual nature to our existence the most likely scenario is that we are it.

I must confess though, from a practical point of view I have a difficult time even believing in pantheism anymore.

Although I've come to realize that all belief is nothing more than make pretend. That's what belief is.

So I suppose I continue to believe that somehow there's more to it than just being mold on a rock. It's just more fun to entertain that thought for some reason, although I often even question why that is.

If we just die when we die we'll never know it. We supposedly didn't exist before we were born, so ceasing to exist when we die would hardly be a cheat.

My children never existed at all.

That's right. I chose to not marry and to not have children. So I cheated some humans out of life altogether.

I believe there is energy in this universe or into infinity beyond the universe and it is constant. It changes forms but never dies.

That is the closest I can get to a creator in man made sense of the word.

There is evidence of balance in ALL things from Sub Atomic to Cosmic Proportions. Like the cogs in a precision time-piece, ALL things physical require this balance for "survival". The planet, a human body, any organization... all require balance for survival.

It sure would seem that this magnificent balance was (YES) created by some design... Dare I say, Divine Design.


IMO, the point at which disharmony enters into the picture is when the human mind evaluates itself as "right" and all other minds as "wrong" (unless, of course, another mind agrees ).

Religion sure seems to perpetuate this incessant inclination.

"IMO, the point at which disharmony enters into the picture is when the human mind evaluates itself as "right" and all other minds as "wrong" (unless, of course, another mind agrees )."

I'm being made more aware of how this all too Human "affliction" effects my relationships (how I communicate) on a day-to-day (sometimes moment-to-moment) basis.

Are you trtying to tell us something SL?

coud you make it clearer please -

If I may, I'd like to substitute "valid" for "right" and "invalid" for "wrong". With those words, I could agree 100%.

The reason for the substitution is that in my mind, "right and wrong" are based solely on the goals of an individual. "right" = "assists in reaching goals", "wrong" = "hinders from reaching goals", whereas I think of "valid" and "invalid" as being based on granting other people the right to their own viewpoints.

Just my opinion.

"Valid" and "Invalid" work beautifully.